Trivia: Unique London bus routes

[Mutant Lemming]

The 434 in the Purley area also has large sections of hail & ride - not sure if it's the majority of the route though.

There's a bus stop in the Biggin Hill area (not sure of the route) that's within sight of a working farm...

The 240 stops outside Belmont Farm and from the top deck you can see another working farm.
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[Busaholic]

The X68 is the only route which doesn't follow prescribed roads for the most part- how the driver gets from West Norwood to Waterloo on the non-stop section in the morning, and vice versa in the evening peak, is down to him/her although in 'normal' conditions there are probably three at most possible routeings, which may then need to be tweaked as they go along. Brixton/Tulse Hill seems to be a favourite p.m. at least.
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The 240 stops outside Belmont Farm and from the top deck you can see another working farm.
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I used to pass the last working (dairy) farm in the old London County Council area every day for years going to school on the 160 bus - it was off the Middle Park estate, very close to Eltham Palace, and was owned by Express Dairies.

 

[317 forever]

Especially with the 341 operating in the same area as the 141 for part of its route.

Ironically, it was renumbered 341 having started out in 1986 as route 171a!

A plot twist is that the Wood Green scheme for 1 Feb 1992 had earmarked that the then new route, in practice given number 172, would have been numbered 341 as it replaced the southern end of route 141!

Route 390 is unique in 2 ways. It has been the only crew route in the 300s. Also, it is now LT crew operated on Mon-Fri daytime, covering the King's Cross - Tufnell Park section, hitherto route C11 and route 239 before then, which had been single-deck opo in the early 70s!

 

[nicobobinus]

Ironically, it was renumbered 341 having started out in 1986 as route 171a!

A plot twist is that the Wood Green scheme for 1 Feb 1992 had earmarked that the then new route, in practice given number 172, would have been numbered 341 as it replaced the southern end of route 141!

Route 390 is unique in 2 ways. It has been the only crew route in the 300s. Also, it is now LT crew operated on Mon-Fri daytime, covering the King's Cross - Tufnell Park section, hitherto route C11 and route 239 before then, which had been single-deck opo in the early 70s!

I wonder if any stretch of road has seen as many route changes as the Tuffnell Park - Kings Cross corridor in recent years. Since the 1970s it has had the 239, then the C11, then the C12 in the 1990s, which was augmented by and then replaced completely by the 10, finally becoming the 390 in 2003.

The real upswing in demand on that corridor has been fairly recent though - in the late 90s the C12 was being run with little darts every 20 minutes. 15 years on and the 390 struggles with crewed double deckers on almost triple the frequency.

 

[Busaholic]

I wonder if any stretch of road has seen as many route changes as the Tuffnell Park - Kings Cross corridor in recent years. Since the 1970s it has had the 239, then the C11, then the C12 in the 1990s, which was augmented by and then replaced completely by the 10, finally becoming the 390 in 2003.

The real upswing in demand on that corridor has been fairly recent though - in the late 90s the C12 was being run with little darts every 20 minutes. 15 years on and the 390 struggles with crewed double deckers on almost triple the frequency.

When I first used the route it was the 196, all the way from Archway to Norwood Junction! When the northern part went opo as the 239, the 'opportunity' to cut the service quite drastically between Archway and Kings Cross was taken, with every other bus in the peak hours running 'shorts' from Waterloo to Kings Cross, although I must admit I was often the only passenger on one of these between Euston and Kings Cross in the morning peak. There was later a very short-lived Red Arrow from Waterloo to Kings Cross recycling a previously-used number, I seem to remember. I doubt I'd recognise the area now - at least 20 years since I travelled those roads!

 

[Deerfold]

The X68 is the only route which doesn't follow prescribed roads for the most part- how the driver gets from West Norwood to Waterloo on the non-stop section in the morning, and vice versa in the evening peak, is down to him/her although in 'normal' conditions there are probably three at most possible routeings, which may then need to be tweaked as they go along. Brixton/Tulse Hill seems to be a favourite p.m. at least.

Not quite. There is more than one possible route it can take - but if it ventures off all of the ones that the iBus system knows about then the Countdown predictions and on-bus next stop signs would stop working. The driver is supposed to stick to one of them except in extreme situations.

Route deviations are described in a recent tender for the route:

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/80412/response/196553/attach/html/9/Route No.X68.pdf.html and shown on the route map at http://www.tfl.gov.uk/bus/route/x68

 

[Busaholic]

Not quite. There is more than one possible route it can take - but if it ventures off all of the ones that the iBus system knows about then the Countdown predictions and on-bus next stop signs would stop working. The driver is supposed to stick to one of them except in extreme situations.

Route deviations are described in a recent tender for the route:

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/80412/response/196553/attach/html/9/Route No.X68.pdf.html and shown on the route map at http://www.tfl.gov.uk/bus/route/x68

The third variation I was referring to is Brixton to Herne Hill via the 3/196 routeing i.e. incorporating bits of both approved routes and used on a fairly regular basis from my own observations i.e. when I'm in London I am based very near the area. Can iBus be switched off by the driver? I ask because all three times I've been on a 148 it wasn't working. Countdown at busy stops like Marble Arch,Park Lane southbound and Regent Street, Picc Circus southbound I've found quite unreliable both with unpredicted buses arriving and predicted ones never appearing even when the system is saying they are virtually on top of the stop! They can't all break down within 100 yards of the stop and, even if they did, I've got good enough eyesight to clock them.

 

[Deerfold]

The third variation I was referring to is Brixton to Herne Hill via the 3/196 routeing i.e. incorporating bits of both approved routes and used on a fairly regular basis from my own observations i.e. when I'm in London I am based very near the area. Can iBus be switched off by the driver? I ask because all three times I've been on a 148 it wasn't working. Countdown at busy stops like Marble Arch,Park Lane southbound and Regent Street, Picc Circus southbound I've found quite unreliable both with unpredicted buses arriving and predicted ones never appearing even when the system is saying they are virtually on top of the stop! They can't all break down within 100 yards of the stop and, even if they did, I've got good enough eyesight to clock them.

iBus can't be switched off by the driver. The ticket machine will log them onto it automatically - and if the ticket machine is not logged in, it can't take Oyster cards. The signs can be turned off but they're not supposed to be unless they're broadcasting incorrect information which is very rare.

Countdown generally works well though there are some stops where it's not as good, mostly connected with buses near the beginning of a route when the system thinks they have started off and then corrects itself.

 

[Busaholic]

iBus can't be switched off by the driver. The ticket machine will log them onto it automatically - and if the ticket machine is not logged in, it can't take Oyster cards. The signs can be turned off but they're not supposed to be unless they're broadcasting incorrect information which is very rare.

Countdown generally works well though there are some stops where it's not as good, mostly connected with buses near the beginning of a route when the system thinks they have started off and then corrects itself.

Thank you for explaining that. I now know why when I'm waiting at the Brixton Garage stop in the evening Countdown is showing three 319s all due for Sloane Square and none appear - they're being manouvered around in the garage area or the road immediately outside.
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Back to the X68 for another unique feature - the only route with set-down restrictions. In the morning peak, passengers picked up between West Croydon and Norwood may not alight until the first stop after the express section i.e. Waterloo. In the evening peak, though, there is no restriction on passengers boarding between Russell Square and Waterloo Bridge to stop them using it to Waterloo Station, which seems odd if there has been a gap in other services like the 68 and 168. Presumably it hasn't been found to be a particular problem, and each journey costs the same amount anyway.

 

[Antman]

Thank you for explaining that. I now know why when I'm waiting at the Brixton Garage stop in the evening Countdown is showing three 319s all due for Sloane Square and none appear - they're being manouvered around in the garage area or the road immediately outside.
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Back to the X68 for another unique feature - the only route with set-down restrictions. In the morning peak, passengers picked up between West Croydon and Norwood may not alight until the first stop after the express section i.e. Waterloo. In the evening peak, though, there is no restriction on passengers boarding between Russell Square and Waterloo Bridge to stop them using it to Waterloo Station, which seems odd if there has been a gap in other services like the 68 and 168. Presumably it hasn't been found to be a particular problem, and each journey costs the same amount anyway.

Just to clarify the first set down in the evening peak is West Norwood. I was told by a driver that the main reason for going via Brixton (ie the 59 and 2 route is the norm) it to avoid any hassle of somebody wanting to get off on the non stop section. If anybody comes running up to the driver asking why he has turned right into Baylis Road after the Waterloo stop they are deposited at the next stop and have to walk back and get a 68.

 

[nicobobinus]

Just to clarify the first set down in the evening peak is West Norwood. I was told by a driver that the main reason for going via Brixton (ie the 59 and 2 route is the norm) it to avoid any hassle of somebody wanting to get off on the non stop section. If anybody comes running up to the driver asking why he has turned right into Baylis Road after the Waterloo stop they are deposited at the next stop and have to walk back and get a 68.

I'd always assumed that the journey through Brixton was just quicker (not getting tangled up at the multi-way lights at Herne Hill, especially), but the driver's argument makes sense.

I used the X68 for a while about 10 years ago and it generally travelled via Brixton then. Buses often carried extra laminated notices next to the cash tray advising that it *was* an X68 and first set down was West Norwood/Waterloo, and some drivers told people in a rolling broadcast as they boarded.. and/or made tannoy announcements. People still somehow found themselves on the wrong bus. I presume the same thing happens now, even with the advent of ibus.

 

[Deerfold]

Back to the X68 for another unique feature - the only route with set-down restrictions. In the morning peak, passengers picked up between West Croydon and Norwood may not alight until the first stop after the express section i.e. Waterloo.

That was mentioned in post #3

In the evening peak, though, there is no restriction on passengers boarding between Russell Square and Waterloo Bridge to stop them using it to Waterloo Station, which seems odd if there has been a gap in other services like the 68 and 168. Presumably it hasn't been found to be a particular problem, and each journey costs the same amount anyway.

Passengers are not supposed to be set down until after the non-stop section. It's probably quite hard to enforce as the buses stop at most stops.

 

[Statto]

Just to clarify the first set down in the evening peak is West Norwood. I was told by a driver that the main reason for going via Brixton (ie the 59 and 2 route is the norm) it to avoid any hassle of somebody wanting to get off on the non stop section. If anybody comes running up to the driver asking why he has turned right into Baylis Road after the Waterloo stop they are deposited at the next stop and have to walk back and get a 68.

That actually happened on a Southbound X68 i was on, passenger got on but realised their mistake as soon as it went on the non-stop section on the Walworth Road, driver let the passenger off.

 

[Busaholic]

Just to clarify the first set down in the evening peak is West Norwood. I was told by a driver that the main reason for going via Brixton (ie the 59 and 2 route is the norm) it to avoid any hassle of somebody wanting to get off on the non stop section. If anybody comes running up to the driver asking why he has turned right into Baylis Road after the Waterloo stop they are deposited at the next stop and have to walk back and get a 68.

Of course a fare penalty cannot be applied to deter short distance riders as used to happen on a very few London Transport routes, almost always in the evening peak. The examples I can recollect are the 192 in the direction between Woolwich town centre and Plumstead, Woodlands Estate and the Country Bus 402 out of Bromley, a route which still exists in much the same form today. There were also examples from Turnpike Lane Station and Kingston and, possibly, out of Hounslow too. The intention was to get passengers to use other, more frequent routes where they shared common ground for a while. I can't recall any examples in central or inner London,though, except on Green Line routes. These journeys always carried slipboards at the front of the RT and RF buses that operated them - maybe RMs later in one or two cases.

 

[Mutant Lemming]

How many routes pass duck ponds ? (start the ball rolling with the 240 & 251)

 

[Busaholic]

How many routes pass duck ponds ? (start the ball rolling with the 240 & 251)

Eidernt know

 

[Mutant Lemming]

Eidernt know

Was expecting more from Mall'arn'd counsel.

 

[extendedpaul]

Here's one that may take some working out

Which London bus routes pass the main entrance to the most different stations

a) national rail including overground ?

b) underground ?

c) all, only counting each station once where they have both ?

 

[Deerfold]

How many routes pass duck ponds ? (start the ball rolling with the 240 & 251)

If it's more than one, surely they're not unique?

Barnes Pond alone is served by the 209, 283, 485, 969 and N22.

 

[RJ]

Here's one that may take some working out

Which London bus routes pass the main entrance to the most different stations

a) national rail including overground ?

b) underground ?

c) all, only counting each station once where they have both ?

a.) I'd guess either the N89 or N205.

b.) I'd guess the N155, though it's tricky to remember which stations it actually passes the "main" entrance of. The N5 and N20 serve more stations but don't necessarily pass the main entrance.

c.) Probably not the 116.

 

[Busaholic]

If it's more than one, surely they're not unique?

That's more a grouse.

 

[Mutant Lemming]

If it's more than one, surely they're not unique?

Barnes Pond alone is served by the 209, 283, 485, 969 and N22.

...but how many pass duck ponds with widgeon on them ?

 

[nicobobinus]

How many routes pass duck ponds ? (start the ball rolling with the 240 & 251)

There are going to be a few of these. The 331 passes a duck pond on Harefield Common.

The 331 is also the only TfL route to leave London and re-enter twice, crossing four county boundaries and visiting two 'shires' in the process (Herts and Bucks). Unsurprisingly the historical route corridor was not a London Transport affair, only becoming so in the 1990s after the provincial operator gave up.

 

[Statto]

There are going to be a few of these. The 331 passes a duck pond on Harefield Common.

The 331 is also the only TfL route to leave London and re-enter twice, crossing four county boundaries and visiting two 'shires' in the process (Herts and Bucks). Unsurprisingly the historical route corridor was not a London Transport affair, only becoming so in the 1990s after the provincial operator gave up.

Famous one being Clapton Pond, although the 38 now uses Lea Bridge Roundabout for layovers, as a layover area has been built in the middle of the Roundabout, the 393 still uses the old 38 layover point at the Pond.

 

[Busaholic]

Famous one being Clapton Pond, although the 38 now uses Lea Bridge Roundabout for layovers, as a layover area has been built in the middle of the Roundabout, the 393 still uses the old 38 layover point at the Pond.

Must have set the ducks a'quacking when the Scania single-decker on the S2 took its destination too literally

 

[Daz28]

Here's one that may take some working out

Which London bus routes pass the main entrance to the most different stations

a) national rail including overground ?

The 314 passes 7 stations on 7 separate lines and finishes on the tram link.

 

[gage75]

AFAIK The X26 is the only service to use a single door bus regularly on it route

 

[Busaholic]

AFAIK The X26 is the only service to use a single door bus regularly on it route

No, there are many examples dotted around the outer areas - without a bit of research I can't give chapter and verse, but I am sure there are others who can,

 

[PermitToTravel]

We can start with the 465 which uses the same buses as the X26

 

[bb21]

I believe anything under 9m comes with single door specifications.

W5 is an example of single door Solos, 138 another with single door Enviro200, and plenty more. See this page. Anything that says "1D" in "Vehicle Type" is single door.