Uber taxis

[jonthetaxi]

I'm sorry you lost out, the last generation of cabbies to have to jump through such hoops. I lost out with house prices, owning a dingy flat in Leighton Buzzard that's still in negative equalty while pouring most of my earnings into renting a 3 bed house. But then I was sensible, putting 6 months wage as a deposit and getting a mortgage for 3.5 times my salary. Friends who had help from the bank of mum-and-dad and took out 5x mortgages all bought massive houses 3 years earlier. My point is, ..it happens, someone is left holding the parcel. Someone always loses, although it's very unlucky to lose in every way. I don't know how old you are, but if you're lucky you'll still receive a pension. People leaving school this year won't.

Property is an investment. Everyone knows investments can rise and fall. People leaving school this year are not promised a pension and told to invest in it and then have it taken away from them.

And unlike Hackney drivers they never complain about taking me home "it's too short, I've been waiting 2 hours I deserve a trip to Leeds". And "No, cash only mate", and a receipt scribbled on a piece of paper that noone from HMRC would accept.

I can't comment about outside London's taxi operation. In London, refusals happen but if you complain to TFL, that driver won't refuse again because he has the threat of licence revocation. HMRC have always accepted receipt's on paper, so not sure what that one's about.]

Most degrees are worthless for a chosen employment, they're used to get your "foot in the door", and more and more companies are downplaying them due to the ridiculous costs

I'm not comparing our job to lawyers or doctors but both of them have to study for their chosen employment because of the speciality. Whether you agree or not, london is very specific from the taxi perspective and even with sat nav's every night I have uber driver's coming up one way streets the wrong way, doing illegal turns and just stopping randomly because they don't know where they are.
You are spot on you need a degree to get your foot in the door. That's my point. While I was researching my career change, a lot of options were closed to me because I don't have a degree. Now if all them people with a degree were told that the key you have to get in the door is no longer needed and people like me without a degree have the same opportunity to the same job as you, they'd be fighting to slam that door shut immediately.

Force AZ to pay tax and they leave for greener pastures, taking a lot of high paid jobs with them.

Let company B come in to replace AZ. Stop buying AZ drugs. Buy company B drugs. Company B can stay if they pay their tax.

If 85% of your customers are happy, why are they leaving you in droves? Is it because people value cheap over good? (to be honest, I find Uber drivers far better than the average black cab driver).

Agreed, because they value cheap over good. In london even uber passengers will disagree with you over black cab drivers. For all our faults people do actually value the fact that we have the knowledge. But everyone does believe they have an entitlement to cheap everything while they themselves should earn a good wage.

I'm not sure where this myth that Uber is "well-in with the guberment init" - smacks of conspiracy theory ravings

Rather insulting init! I'll try and spell correctly so you don't think I'm raving.
Google is one of the main shareholders in uber. Up until recently Google's CEO, Eric Schmidt was the leader on the Business Advisory Group "telling" Cameron what business expects from our poodle leaders. Uber''s head of PR is Rachel Whetstone who worked with Cameron when he worked in PR for Carlton TV. Her and her husband ,who was an advisor to Cameron, were godparents to the Camerons now deceased child. Cameron and his wife are godparents to their child. Oh no, I've dreamt all that.

The sad fact is that global governments are powerless to stop the new-look globalised world even if they wanted to.

The sad fact is we are allowing a generation to grow up thinking it's nothing to do with us how the world develops. Guess what , governments are answerable to us, the public. They have brainwashed a generation with shiny phones, X factor, and flat screen TV's. I don't want a society where we are all wage slaves just feeding the globalisation monster, and the more people are willing to say, oh well, it's just the way it is means we don't stand a chance. (Now that's off topic)

Anyway I'm going off to put on my tin foil hat because it's the only way to stop the government reading my mind.

 

[Puffing Devil]

Uber must be bad* if they've got the cabbies and Addison Lee to agree on something.

*Bad for their businesses, that's all.

 

[telstarbox]

@jonthetaxi: Thanks for your detailed and informative replies from the other side of the fence.

Clearly the Black Cab trade is hard to enter due to the Knowledge and vehicle requirements, and so Black Cab drivers are proud of what they do. I don't dispute that Black Cabs provide a higher level of service than minicabs/Uber - but it might be a higher level than some passengers need or can afford.

I think there will be a place for Black Cabs in London for many years, particularly the city centre, but it will be as a premium rather than a mass-market product. For example:

A business type coming into Waterloo or Kings Cross in the rush hour will still want to jump in a taxi and be at their meeting as quickly as possible, which is where the Knowledge makes a difference over a satnav.

Similarly, tourists will hop in a Black Cab from Harrods to Madam Tussaud's as they know it's a 'proper London taxi' and the cabbie will know straight away how to get there.

However, if I want to get from Brixton to Lewisham at 3am (or other suburban areas of choice) there's generally only one route and not much traffic, so the Knowledge isn't important and for me the price premium for a Black Cab isn't worth it. I also don't have the risk that the cabbie won't go there. Personally I'll only use a taxi/minicab if public transport isn't a realistic or convenient option.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The main issue our trade has with Uber is the instant flag down with their app. We were/are told if we do the Knowledge of London, (which took me 3 and a half years putting in roughly 40-50 hours a week of unpaid study and all the other costs incurred) and we buy or rent a vehicle specified by TFL and we charge a price set by parliament, that only we have the privilege of picking up off the street. Private hire CAN ONLY be pre-booked. Obviously nobody saw how technology was going to develop but the app system is simply flagging a car down electronically.

This is the only bit I'd disagree with. Although you can see the taxis moving around on the Uber screen you still have to 'book' it even if you can see the vehicle in the street. It's the same as if I saw a free minicab - I'd still have to phone the number on the side to fulfil the prebooking requirement rather than just hopping in.

 

[telstarbox]

ISTR the app acts as a meter, but I did think (possibly wrongly) that the price charged was based on the rate at the time of booking.

If it was fixed-price, you could imagine a load of arguments when the passenger inevitably asks for more stops or similar and the driver has to either say no (and risk assault) or say yes and not be paid extra for them.

However, I do agree the "surge pricing" should be as defined at the time of booking, not at the time of taking the trip.

It's not a fixed-price - you are given an estimated fare and if surge pricing applies you also have to confirm the multiplier rate. See screenshots below.

 

[Bletchleyite]

So surge pricing applies as at the time of booking? Good.

 

[jonthetaxi]

. I don't dispute that Black Cabs provide a higher level of service than minicabs/Uber - but it might be a higher level than some passengers need or can afford.

Hi Telstarbox. That is exactly right. There has never been any doubt that for some people Black Cabs are expensive. And that's where the mini cabs did come in and plug a gap in the market. Now uber have decided they don't need to operate on the same terms as the minicab companies, they don't have to follow TFL private licensing guidelines and because they get around our tax laws they can slash fares and the ones who subsidise that is the UK taxpayer.
If you want to take a flight somewhere, most of us wouldn't dream of paying first class or taking a private business jet, it's just not worth the premium to us. However if a company came in and started doing private jets at discount rates but didn't have the same regulation or didn't pay any tax on their profits, it's hardly a level playing field and that is what the minicab and taxi industry were asking for.

 

[telstarbox]

So surge pricing applies as at the time of booking? Good.

Yes. It will say e.g. "1.4x" on the screen and you have to type in "1.4" in the box below to confirm acceptance before the taxi is dispatched.

 

[Tetchytyke]

So surge pricing applies as at the time of booking? Good.

It didn't when the app was first launched, but in any case the app is still acting as a meter because the fare is "estimated".

We've seen this with repeated cases of Uber drivers taking ridiculous routes in order to fleece customers. Unlike with black cabs, there's nothing you can do about it.

What Uber are doing in London and in other cities is attempting to have all the freedom of a Private Hire licence but still keep all the benefits of being a Hackney Carriage.

 

[telstarbox]

I can only speak from experience but every time I've been in an Uber it's gone the 'sensible' route and that includes late night journeys where you might expect drivers to try to take advantage.

 

[ivanhoe]

There is an issue however with Hackneys. That is the trade in Hackney licenses which keeps the running costs of a Hackney taxi artificially high. If a newcomer comes in and can't get a relatively cheap plate off the local authority( they don't issue many new ones) they will in all likelihood buy a plate off the secondary market. Now they will still be regulated as taxi drivers, but the cost of the plate can be as much as the cab itself.

Given running costs , depreciation etc, the annual cost will be quite high. Fares are also regulated as well. For these reasons, I understand the frustrations of the Hackney Drivers as they are in an imperfect market. For example, their cab and plate may well be part of their pension pot for the future, but Uber will have the effect of deminishing the value of their investment.

I wish I had an answer to the problem but Hackney Drivers may have to take on Uber with their own apps but I do think that there should be an equal playing field for both private and uber drivers as there is synergy in what service they are offering. Hackney Authorities and Drivers also need to reform and try and bring a solution to the secondary trading of licences, but there will be losers and thus I cannot see a solution.

 

[EM2]

I'm confused. If a non-Uber private hire vehicle charges by distance, e.g. by using mileometer in the car, doesn't that count as a meter?

 

[miami]

It didn't when the app was first launched, but in any case the app is still acting as a meter because the fare is "estimated".

We've seen this with repeated cases of Uber drivers taking ridiculous routes in order to fleece customers. Unlike with black cabs, there's nothing you can do about it.

Course there is, hit "fare review". Not only do you get your money back almost instantly (if you've got a case), but the driver is likely removed from the system. It's not a "he-said she-said" thing like with a legacy taxi, it's there in black and white. And kept for posterity.

Here's one from July. (I can give you the route I took from the middle of town to Belgium airport last November. Took 65 minutes to do 12km - traffic was terrible, there was a smash on the motorway just ahead of us)

If you're not happy hit Fare Review if you think the route is wrong.

And unlike with black cabs (which are at least usually safe, just ignore the racism and "not going south of the river" and "I don't want to go that way" and "I dont take cards" and "here's a business card write your own receipt"), you get a bad uber driver (say the car's dirty), you mark him down, his rating drops, and he's off the system. With minicabs there's little you can do other than phone their dispatcher or in some cases the police.

On the other hand, if you're a bad passenger the same happens to you.

 

[Bletchleyite]

What Uber are doing in London and in other cities is attempting to have all the freedom of a Private Hire licence but still keep all the benefits of being a Hackney Carriage.

And if that is to the benefit of the passenger, which I personally believe it is, why shouldn't they?

Taxi regulation should be for the benefit of the passenger, not to stifle innovation.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

There is an issue however with Hackneys. That is the trade in Hackney licenses which keeps the running costs of a Hackney taxi artificially high. If a newcomer comes in and can't get a relatively cheap plate off the local authority( they don't issue many new ones) they will in all likelihood buy a plate off the secondary market.

That is a silly situation in my view. If a driver no longer requires their licence, they should be required to surrender it for the next driver in the "queue" to get it. Seems silly that they can be sold for profit; surely they should simply be applied for for an administrative fee when they become available.

 

[miami]

I'm confused. If a non-Uber private hire vehicle charges by distance, e.g. by using mileometer in the car, doesn't that count as a meter?

This is the sole valid argument that cabbies have against Uber. TFL disagree, and take the position that a taximeter has to be connected to the vehicle in some fashion. There's a hearing at the high court that's just started:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-34445398

Naturally Adison Lee and the Taxi association want Uber banned in any way possible. I suspect that if the courts say it's not a meter, then they'll cry foul play (wah wah it's a conspiracy), and if the courts say it is a meter Uber will simply ignore it.

Ironically TFL, who are saying that it's not a meter, are trying to get an "anti-uber" law passed. Protectionism never works well.

If Uber is popular, then people will be unhappy that its taken away from them. If people prefer using black cabs, they what's the issue?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

For example, their cab and plate may well be part of their pension pot for the future, but Uber will have the effect of deminishing the value of their investment.

Everyone knows investments can rise and fall. I have no sympathy whatsoever if that's the case (I know it's the case in the mafia-run NY cab system, and the French system, I didn't realise such corruption infected the UK too).

 

[EM2]

This is the sole valid argument that cabbies have against Uber. TFL disagree, and take the position that a taximeter has to be connected to the vehicle in some fashion. There's a hearing at the high court that's just started:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-34445398

Naturally Adison Lee and the Taxi association want Uber banned in any way possible. I suspect that if the courts say it's not a meter, then they'll cry foul play (wah wah it's a conspiracy), and if the courts say it is a meter Uber will simply ignore it.

Ironically TFL, who are saying that it's not a meter, are trying to get an "anti-uber" law passed. Protectionism never works well.

If Uber is popular, then people will be unhappy that its taken away from them. If people prefer using black cabs, they what's the issue?

It's still not clear. The rules say that only licensed Hackney Carriages can use a taximeter, and that this is 'a device for calculating the fare to be charged in respect of any journey by reference to the distance travelled or time elapsed since the start of the journey (or a combination of both).'
Now if, as I mentioned earlier, a private hire vehicle is using its mileometer to determine the distance travelled, or even a clock to measure the time elapsed, and therefore the fare to be charged, why is that not classed as a taximeter? And if so, why is TfL only taking action against Uber and not every other private hire company in London?

 

[miami]

I'm not comparing our job to lawyers or doctors but both of them have to study for their chosen employment because of the speciality.

And technology makes many skills redundant. I doubt that many Doctors know about the best use of leaches, and Lawyers will of course be familiar with laws that are no longer valid.

Whether you agree or not, london is very specific from the taxi perspective and even with sat nav's every night I have uber driver's coming up one way streets the wrong way, doing illegal turns and just stopping randomly because they don't know where they are.

In which case the police will be able to pull them over and take their license.

You are spot on you need a degree to get your foot in the door. That's my point. While I was researching my career change, a lot of options were closed to me because I don't have a degree. Now if all them people with a degree were told that the key you have to get in the door is no longer needed and people like me without a degree have the same opportunity to the same job as you, they'd be fighting to slam that door shut immediately.

Nope, quite the opposite infact. Perhaps that's just me.

Agreed, because they value cheap over good. In london even uber passengers will disagree with you over black cab drivers.

I strongly disagree. Give me the Uber system any day over Black Cab, regardless of the price.

But everyone does believe they have an entitlement to cheap everything while they themselves should earn a good wage.

The human condition, and the downfall of society.

Rather insulting init! I'll try and spell correctly so you don't think I'm raving.
Google is one of the main shareholders in uber. Up until recently Google's CEO, Eric Schmidt was the leader on the Business Advisory Group "telling" Cameron what business expects from our poodle leaders. Uber''s head of PR is Rachel Whetstone who worked with Cameron when he worked in PR for Carlton TV. Her and her husband ,who was an advisor to Cameron, were godparents to the Camerons now deceased child. Cameron and his wife are godparents to their child. Oh no, I've dreamt all that.

I fail to see how any of that has baring on the legal side of our system? Perhaps it could affect future laws, but Cameron's busy stealing candy from babys and giving it to billionaires. There's some high-profile Tory MPs that are anti-uber too.

The sad fact is we are allowing a generation to grow up thinking it's nothing to do with us how the world develops. Guess what , governments are answerable to us, the public.

That's not right, and you know it. The public is answerable to what the TV and papers say. It was the Sun that won it. Look at the hate the Daily Mail spreads. "Her parents are Axl Rose and Madonna. The five minutes you spend a day with her can't compete with that kind of constant bombardment. You're outgunned, amigo"

I don't want a society where we are all wage slaves just feeding the globalisation monster, and the more people are willing to say, oh well, it's just the way it is means we don't stand a chance. (Now that's off topic)

I don't want that either, just not sure how one can actually stop it. If I was dictator of the universe you'd have the Uber system, but it would be a higher wage to the drivers, and a slightly higher cost to the passengers. You'd get rid of silliness like the knowledge, and you'd certainly get rid of license selling. Sadly I'm not, and even if Jeremy Corbyn won a sudden shock election next week I don't see things changing.

 

[jon0844]

This thread is quite apt for a rail forum as in the years to come new technology is bound to see major changes to trial drivers. Of course there will be lots of battles and union led strikes etc, but I'm sure the end result will be a simplification of the duties of a driver (replaced by technology) and that could mean less training needed (so making it easier to replace staff) and lower pay.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Two days were allocated for the hearing of Transport for London v Uber London Ltd. in Court 9 of the Royal Courts of Justice : that was today (5th Oct) and tomorrow (6th Oct). But, unusually, everything that had to be said was said today.
Mr Justice Ouseley has reserved judgement (meaning the decision will be considered over the next few days and weeks), so we'll find out the decision in a few weeks.

 

[miami]

It's still not clear. The rules say that only licensed Hackney Carriages can use a taximeter, and that this is 'a device for calculating the fare to be charged in respect of any journey by reference to the distance travelled or time elapsed since the start of the journey (or a combination of both).'
Now if, as I mentioned earlier, a private hire vehicle is using its mileometer to determine the distance travelled, or even a clock to measure the time elapsed, and therefore the fare to be charged, why is that not classed as a taximeter? And if so, why is TfL only taking action against Uber and not every other private hire company in London?

It's not clear - do minicabs in London charge per mile or per minute?

Hopefully it will be clear soon.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

This thread is quite apt for a rail forum as in the years to come new technology is bound to see major changes to trial drivers. Of course there will be lots of battles and union led strikes etc, but I'm sure the end result will be a simplification of the duties of a driver (replaced by technology) and that could mean less training needed (so making it easier to replace staff) and lower pay.

Unions may delay it by a few years, but its inevitable. DLR is automatic, Central, Northern, Jubilee, Victoria lines, the L train in New York, all run automatically.

The Vancouver SkyTrain doesn't even have someone pushing the button.

If a taxi can be automated to the point of no driver, why can't Watford Junction to St Albans?

 

[jonthetaxi]

I doubt that many Doctors know about the best use of leaches, and Lawyers will of course be familiar with laws that are no longer valid.

I don't understand what that has to do with studying for your chosen profession.

In which case the police will be able to pull them over and take their license.

hahaha That's the funniest thing you've written. You obviously have never driven in the centre of london at night! Hahaha, I'm still laughing.

Nope, quite the opposite infact. Perhaps that's just me.

No, it's not quite the opposite infant, it is just you. I have been looking for a career change for the last year and researched many different options. The degree barrier is there for a reason, to sift out a lot of applicants early on in the process, I don't know when you last tried to change your career. You can get a job in the service industry and a few other jobs on minimum wage but I'm talking about a job with decent pay.

strongly disagree. Give me the Uber system any day over Black Cab,
regardless of the price.

All entitled to choice.But my point was about the skills required to drive a taxi in London, and you are in a minority if you think Uber is a better system than the black taxi and the knowledge. If your honest, it is just the price, like a lot of people you think you are entitled to have somebody give you a service very cheap regardless of them earning a living wage.

I fail to see how any of that has baring on the legal side of our system? Perhaps it could affect future laws, but Cameron's busy stealing candy from babys and giving it to billionaires. There's some high-profile Tory MPs that are anti-uber too.

It's got no bearing (not baring) on the legal side of our system and it was not meant to have bearing. The point was regarding the spurious accusation that I was a raving conspiracy theorist because I said there are close links between government and uber. I was proving the point that when the prime minister is god parent to the child who is the head of public relations at uber that is a close link, you chose to come up with a totally erroneous connection between the legal system.

That's not right, and you know it. The public is answerable to what the TV and papers say. It was the Sun that won it. Look at the hate the Daily Mail spreads. "Her parents are Axl Rose and Madonna. The five minutes you spend a day with her can't compete with that kind of constant bombardment. You're outgunned, amigo"

This makes no sense to me at all, me old mucker.

You'd get rid of silliness like the knowledge, and you'd certainly get rid of license selling.

There is no such thing as license selling in the london taxi trade and there has never been. There are near on 25,000 men and women who worked harder than you ever have to earn that badge. The reason I say that without knowing you personally is because anyone who has had to work hard for anything would never be so patronising and disparaging. I've talked to all sorts of professionals and non professionals over the years and some have the opinion that london taxis are good value others that they are poor value, but one thing they all have agreement on is the knowledge of london exam is one of the most difficult testing regimes there is and anyone who get's through it has shown great tenacity and strength of purpose that most university degree courses do not require. So send 25,000 people onto the dole for that little silliness they spent an average of 50 hours a week for 4 years of their life with no pay and no government subsidy.

 

[Abpj17]

I prefer Hailo.

You get a black cab (so drivers actually know where they are going) with the convience of uber (book through app, see on map, pay by card etc.)

When I've shared an uber car with friends the driver invariably gets lost/doesn't know quickest routes etc.

(Although there is a black cab option in Uber, but I'm not sure of the take up...)

 

[miami]

Currently in an Uber, booked it from the hotel at Old Trafford where I had a late night meeting. Chucking it down, no idea how to get home without Uber. 3 minutes later I get a vibration on my phone, cab has arrived. Asked if I was happy with the recommended route or if I had a preference, I said "whatever" (or something more polite). Asked if I needed to borrow a phone charger to rejuvinate my 1% battery phone. Sat in the back with some depressing drizzle on my laptop, he's just turning into my road now. Yet another 5* Uber journey.

 

[St Rollox]

Currently in an Uber, booked it from the hotel at Old Trafford where I had a late night meeting. Chucking it down, no idea how to get home without Uber. 3 minutes later I get a vibration on my phone, cab has arrived. Asked if I was happy with the recommended route or if I had a preference, I said "whatever" (or something more polite). Asked if I needed to borrow a phone charger to rejuvinate my 1% battery phone. Sat in the back with some depressing drizzle on my laptop, he's just turning into my road now. Yet another 5* Uber journey.

Is there some special difference between that nice little story and a local mini cab service.
Is Uber free?
Do they give you money if your five star?

 

[The Snap]

Best idea since sliced bread.

Excellent in London, there's always one nearby and are not badly priced. In Manchester city centre and Manchester Airport they are also very useful and frequent (not so much in the suburbs). The drivers are always more polite than normal cab drivers, probably because a user has the option to rate them; apparently if a driver gets too many bad ratings they get kicked out of Uber!

Can't get enough of them personally...

 

[miami]

Is there some special difference between that nice little story and a local mini cab service.
Is Uber free?
Do they give you money if your five star?

I have no idea what minicab firms serve the Old Trafford area at 2AM. With uber I can book it in a few seconds, with a minicab firm I have to go online dig out various numbers and start phoning around. Then I have no idea when the car will actually arrive so I end up standing outside for 10 minute hoping it might turn up. I've never had a minicab drive offer to change my phone. I'd also have to navigate the minicab (or worse a black taxi) around (next left, 2nd road on the right, etc). With Uber I can concentrate on more important things until the car stops and I get out.

I remember getting a black cab from Manchester to Chester once. Didn't really know how to get there - told him I wanted to go to Christleton. This was before smartphones. Obviously the taxi driver (who didn't take debit or credit card) had no idea, so just kicked me out about 2 miles away and I had to phone someone with an internet connection, bargain for £90.

When people come out with things like "driver invariably gets lost/doesn't know quickest routes", I don't recognise that at all.

 

[telstarbox]

Yes - it's a very seamless experience.

 

[miami]

This makes no sense to me at all, me old mucker.

Quote from a film. Doesn't matter what parents try to drum into their kids, they believe what they see on the newspaper - especially nowadays where society encourages both parents family to be out at work and let nurseries bring up their kids.

There is no such thing as license selling in the london taxi trade and there has never been.

Good news, that was a reference to ivanhoe's post "the trade in Hackney licenses which keeps the running costs of a Hackney taxi artificially high.". Glad such horrible anti-competitive moves are limited to places like the U.S. and France.

There are near on 25,000 men and women who worked harder than you ever have to earn that badge.

Breaking rocks is hard work too, but it's meaningless, like the knowledge. I'm sorry, but technology has removed the need, just like it removed the need for Doctors to know about leaches. In a few years it will remove the need for drivers completely. Train drivers will last a while longer,

People that did the knowledge in the last 15 years should have seen the writing on the wall. I'd be shocked if people are still doing the knowledge. For the rest, that's a decent amount of time to be in a job nowadays. Even then, Black cabs won't vanish overnight -- they still have privileges like driving in bus lanes (delaying public transport so their rich passengers can travel a little faster).

I saw in the paper this morning that kids born today are likely to work until they're 100 and have 40 different jobs in that time - most likely bouncing from zero-hour contract to zero-hour contract. It's a global problem, and it needs a global solution. It's not just limited to one archaic part of the job of a private people conveyor in one part of the country.

So send 25,000 people onto the dole for that little silliness they spent an average of 50 hours a week for 4 years of their life with no pay and no government subsidy.

Campaign for the UK to shoot down GPS satellites then - the luddite movement reborn, but without something of that level, GPS and Uber (and hopefully some real competition for Uber) is here to stay.

Students doing degrees will end up - if they're lucky - earning as much as a cabbie earns. They also put 3 years into it, but they come out of 3 years with a £30k bill.

I think http://new.spectator.co.uk/2014/02/the-case-against-london-black-cabs/ is a fair reflection of the black cab industry in London.

 

[St Rollox]

Just laughing at those who think a local mini cab hasn't turned up for them.
Addison Lee, Uber, same old same old.
Except one takes cash.

 

[radamfi]

I've never used Uber, given that they are still expensive like other taxis, and only operate in places I am least likely to need a cab, because they are well served by public transport. But I do like the fact that tipping isn't necessary because the payment is all done online. I find tipping rather embarrassing. I would rather be told a price and pay that, rather than having to think up a price myself. Online payment does have the useful effect of eliminating tipping, like with pizza delivery.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I saw in the paper this morning that kids born today are likely to work until they're 100 and have 40 different jobs in that time - most likely bouncing from zero-hour contract to zero-hour contract. It's a global problem, and it needs a global solution.

And it won't get one unless we close our borders and engage in full protectionism (noting that I do not support that approach).

There are only so many natural resources in the world, therefore there is only so much feasible wealth based on them. Globalisation is making "poorer" countries richer, so by necessity the "richer" countries will get poorer and their standard of living will reduce. That includes us.

We cannot realistically expect *not* to be more like China. It's unpalatable, but Cameron etc are IMO just preparing us for something that cannot realistically be avoided in the long term.