Waterloo station masterplan

[yorksrob]

It's also pretty dire if you want to cycle there. Coming from the East, my experience is of having to navigate that awful roundabout that surrounds the imax, then go a short way down York Road (which is not cycle-friendly) until you stumble upon the shared cycle/foot way up Cab Road - which is much too narrow to accommodate the cyclists and pedestrians. Then there are vastly insufficient bike racks for the demand. If the plan can sort those kinds of issues out, I'll be very happy.

Also - not directly related to the station but seems to be within the scope of the plan: Trying to get to Waterloo Bridge from the East is also a nightmare on a bike - requiring either navigating that roundabout, or making a (hard-to-find and unintuitive) detour along Cornwall Road and Upper Ground.



Yeah, Waterloo East badly needs some kind of concourse. I guess to be most useful to passengers who actually are exiting (as opposed to getting another train from Waterloo) it would be better for the concourse to be at street level - and so, below rather than above the tracks.

The absolute ideal would be to just rebuild the platforms further West, so the station can really become a part of Waterloo, but that would be expensive and I'm pretty sure is not in the plans.

I tend to use the main concourse if waiting for a train from East. It's got all the necessary facilities.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I tend to use the main concourse if waiting for a train from East. It's got all the necessary facilities.

That's certainly possible, but personally I tend to feel uneasy at waiting so far away from the platform.

 

[MPW]

The absolute ideal would be to just rebuild the platforms further West, so the station can really become a part of Waterloo, but that would be expensive and I'm pretty sure is not in the plans.

I was thinking the same. Cornwall Road tunnel/arch could be used as concourse with escalators going east to platforms from there. Would be a good visual/design match to the new 'south station'.

Obvious caveat that I'm not a structural engineer but there seems to be a few bits of useable space between the Wellington and current track positions, below the sci-fi bridge and at North end of sandell Street.

 

[davews]

The main toilets on the north end of the concourse have been closed for refurbishment since spring 2023 (the notice says 'we are freshening up') and not due to reopen until June. There are also some portabin ones at the south end.

And this morning the gents in the Sidings had half their urinals taped off out of use, the cubicle loos had no seats and one was jammed up with paper. Those loos were never designed for the amount of use they are getting while the main loos are being 'freshened up'.

 

[Bald Rick]

I wonder if the new route to Waterloo East would be suitable for a travelator, as per Manchester Piccadilly? I fairly regularly change between the two Waterloo stations, and although it doesn't take very long as it is, saving a couple of minutes potentially allows new connections and makes existing ones more relaxed.

A travelator would save about 30 seconds max. It’s really not that far (about 100 metres).

 

[DynamicSpirit]

A travelator would save about 30 seconds max. It’s really not that far (about 100 metres).

I agree that a travelator wouldn't help that much (although they have one connecting the Jubilee and Bakerloo/Northern lines) in the underground station, and I doubt that saves any more time than that. But it would help a bit.

Looking on Google maps, it looks to me like the distance from the bottom of the ramps at Waterloo East to the nearest platform entrance at Waterloo Main is about 240m, not 100m, which is a longish distance to walk. I used to travel from Abbey Wood to Wimbledon, changing trains at Waterloo. Since at both Abbey Wood and Wimbledon, I'm on the far end of the train, that turned the total walk into over 500 m - or well over 1/4 mile. I don't think it's unreasonable for people to be annoyed about that kind of walk in what's supposed to be a station interchange.

I'm guessing maybe your 100m is thinking about only the length of the connecting bridge - which admittedly with the present design is the only bit you could build a travelator for.

 

[yorksrob]

That's certainly possible, but personally I tend to feel uneasy at waiting so far away from the platform.

Yes, I'd give myself ten minutes to get to the train to be comfortable.

And this morning the gents in the Sidings had half their urinals taped off out of use, the cubicle loos had no seats and one was jammed up with paper. Those loos were never designed for the amount of use they are getting while the main loos are being 'freshened up'.

Glastonbury festival every day !

 

[swt_passenger]

There’s no way to easily move the platforms to the west. Even if brand new platforms on such a curve were allowed, and they’re obviously not going to be, you’d need to at least double the viaduct overall width over hundreds of metres, you’d have to relocate all the existing junctions that are between the station and Hungerford Bridge, and as soon as you mentioned demolition of any existing buildings such as the Wellington the objectors would instantly be out in force…

 

[Bald Rick]

I'm guessing maybe your 100m is thinking about only the length of the connecting bridge - which admittedly with the present design is the only bit you could build a travelator for.

Is the right answer.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

There’s no way to easily move the platforms to the west. Even if brand new platforms on such a curve were allowed, and they’re obviously not going to be, you’d need to at least double the viaduct overall width over hundreds of metres, you’d have to relocate all the existing junctions that are between the station and Hungerford Bridge, and as soon as you mentioned demolition of any existing buildings such as the Wellington the objectors would instantly be out in force…

Agreed. Fundamentally we're stuck with a station that - with the benefit of 155 years of hindsight - was arguably built in the wrong place, and we have to do the best we can with that. I think pragmatically, the best solution would be to improve the connection to Waterloo (Main) with a proper concourse for people interchanging, but also to build a proper entrance/exit to the street (with a concourse) underneath the platforms (right now, the station seems to be designed only for interchange with almost no thought for people who might want to finish their journeys there). I'd suggest the underpass at Windmill Walk as a reasonable location for a proper entrance - providing easy access to the shopping area along The Cut.

Related trivia question: Is there any other station on the entire network that's anything like as busy as Waterloo East but which doesn't have a proper, easily accessible, entrance from the street? (I don't consider the endless flight of stairs from Sandell Street that isn't even anywhere near the platforms to be a proper entrance)

Yes, I'd give myself ten minutes to get to the train to be comfortable.

And I guess one problem then is, 10 minutes means you're setting off for the platform before the train has even started its journey at Charing Cross - so plenty of opportunities for the train to suddenly get delayed or cancelled after you've already left the concourse to walk to the platform.

 

[yorksrob]

Agreed. Fundamentally we're stuck with a station that - with the benefit of 155 years of hindsight - was arguably built in the wrong place, and we have to do the best we can with that. I think pragmatically, the best solution would be to improve the connection to Waterloo (Main) with a proper concourse for people interchanging, but also to build a proper entrance/exit to the street (with a concourse) underneath the platforms (right now, the station seems to be designed only for interchange with almost no thought for people who might want to finish their journeys there). I'd suggest the underpass at Windmill Walk as a reasonable location for a proper entrance - providing easy access to the shopping area along The Cut.

Related trivia question: Is there any other station on the entire network that's anything like as busy as Waterloo East but which doesn't have a proper, easily accessible, entrance from the street? (I don't consider the endless flight of stairs from Sandell Street that isn't even anywhere near the platforms to be a proper entrance)




And I guess one problem then is, 10 minutes means you're setting off for the platform before the train has even started its journey at Charing Cross - so plenty of opportunities for the train to suddenly get delayed or cancelled after you've already left the concourse to walk to the platform.

I find the traipse from Waterloo Concourse to the East platforms less tortuous than Leeds concourse to platform 17 - a walk I do several times a week, and the recommended connection time there is ten minutes.

 

[Taunton]

I deliberately came through, for the first time, The Sidings last night, after reading this thread, from arriving at the "Eurostar" (alias Windsor Lines) platforms, to the Jubilee Line.

What a poor experience.

- Most, in fact almost all, of the retail units are unlet.
- Despite the main station being busy at 1900, the place seemed deserted.
- Raw concrete passageways
- It seemed an extraordinary lengthy route march compared to going by the main concourse.
- I can't reconcile the descending, two escalators and two sets of stairs, the last one lengthy, compared to just one escalator from the main concourse, down to the Jubilee gateline.
- Overall an appalling development, and waste of investment.

 

[lookapigeon]

And this morning the gents in the Sidings had half their urinals taped off out of use, the cubicle loos had no seats and one was jammed up with paper. Those loos were never designed for the amount of use they are getting while the main loos are being 'freshened up'.

I'm not surprised, they must be getting battered with the amount of usage. The flushers are also all electronic and the feed of water is not particularly powerful.

Why is this country so slow in doing building work, I mean blocks of apartments get thrown up quicker in the amount of time it takes for Waterloo to refurbish its loos.

 

[duffield]

Did the Waterloo<->Waterloo East interchange again yesterday, in both directions. It does seem to get shorter and simpler each time!

Note for next time: remember to walk right to the front of the train (if possible) during the short journey from London Bridge.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Is there anything particularly wrong with Waterloo as it is?

Having an entrance to the platforms other than right at the buffers top end will certainly be an improvement in boarding, especially as most traisn are now at least ten cars and many are twelve. The existing stairs are as much a hindrance as a benefit, as they make the platforms narrower, and the stairs face the wrong way so even if you are using them you first have to squeeze past the stairwell

 

[hwl]

...
- Overall an appalling development, and waste of investment.

But not by NR, by LCR (London and Continental Railways)

 

[Meerkat]

Very first picture I noticed the ghostly ugly roof extension and the looming tower block, but you have to trawl through endless pages of buzzword bluster before getting to the "what's paying for this" bit and even then it is very vague and brushed over. Looks like the tower block is over the larger cab road canopy but its not very nice under there and there is another smaller one that I assume will survive, and on the plan there is a 'station portico' in the area where the 'under the clock' gap (to be greatly expanded) goes out onto where the bike park is (but wont be) so maybe they will use the old canopy to cover that??
It helps the Victory Arch congestion because you will be able to go through that gap and walk down the pedestrianised cab road instead (or across to Waterloo East or down to lower exits to the new bus interchange on the Imax converted roundabout and hopefully a quicker walking route to Waterloo Bridge).
Not sure about moving the cabs to the platform 1 exit - can see that getting congested and its a long walk from the higher number platforms and even the central ones that are most likely to bring in people with luggage.

However the southern concourse would be genuinely transformational - relieving a lot of pressure on the cramped gatelines and concourse. It will make a much easier exit for commuters heading on foot for St Thomas' and Westminster and a more direct route for tourists heading to the London Eye, Pier, Houses of Parliament etc. Might even spread the load on incoming trains as it would reduce the crush for the front of the train.