Wensleydale Railway ‘clear out’

alexl92

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How difficult/sacrilegious would it be to convert some of the ex-LMS sleepers into normal compartment (or even open) stock? I know it would mean changing the interior layout and the windows but would it be a massive job on the superstructure too? Surely doing that wouldn't be worse than just allowing them to rot?
 
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torten

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How difficult/sacrilegious would it be to convert some of the ex-LMS sleepers into normal compartment (or even open) stock? I know it would mean changing the interior layout and the windows but would it be a massive job on the superstructure too? Surely doing that wouldn't be worse than just allowing them to rot?
They are riddled with lots of lovely asbestos.
 

37114

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I saw that crop up last week on one of the Facebook groups - does anyone have any idea as to where it's gone to?
According to the WNXX news page a private site at Kinsley, apparently there are 4 track panels being installed for 37503, 60050, 60086 and possibly 31454
 

fgwrich

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According to the WNXX news page a private site at Kinsley, apparently there are 4 track panels being installed for 37503, 60050, 60086 and possibly 31454

I’m surprised to hear of the 60s moved on, though they are in a bit of a state at the moment. Work seemed to be progressing fairly well on those before the lockdown.
 

paul1609

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I’m surprised to hear of the 60s moved on, though they are in a bit of a state at the moment. Work seemed to be progressing fairly well on those before the lockdown.
If I was the Wensleydale I wouldn't want 130 tonne freight locos running on my track!
 

Richard Scott

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Its a bit different a mainline loco hauling a one off train every 5 years to having those locos based on the railway.
To be honest I don't think a 60 running every so often will cause massive damage. If it does then afraid the PWay is not up to much in the first place.
 

paul1609

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To be honest I don't think a 60 running every so often will cause massive damage. If it does then afraid the PWay is not up to much in the first place.
I haven't been to ride on the Wensleydale for a couple of years but it was mostly fairly elderly rail on wooden sleepers which they had been frantically trying to spot resleeper the last time I was there. There were some fairly lengthy 15 mph speed restrictions because of the track condition. Definitely a railway for a multiple unit or light loco imho.
 

Richard Scott

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I haven't been to ride on the Wensleydale for a couple of years but it was mostly fairly elderly rail on wooden sleepers which they had been frantically trying to spot resleeper the last time I was there. There were some fairly lengthy 15 mph speed restrictions because of the track condition. Definitely a railway for a multiple unit or light loco imho.
If that is the case then possibly a 60 may be a bridge too far?
 

alexl92

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I’m surprised to hear of the 60s moved on, though they are in a bit of a state at the moment. Work seemed to be progressing fairly well on those before the lockdown.
I'm suprised too. They seemed really excited about the prospect of a pair of 60s when they announced their arrival - it wasn't all that long ago was it?
 

Marmaduke

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I'm suprised too. They seemed really excited about the prospect of a pair of 60s when they announced their arrival - it wasn't all that long ago was it?
I'm not.....I think it falls into the whole rationale thing about "dumping" locos on site with a snowballs chance in hell of being restored. I read somewhere that the WR had stated the type of operational locos that would be welcomed to the line....25, 26, 31's etc, which for me is sound thinking. Why would yo wish to challenge the infrastructure with heavy locos?

Any loco owner worth is salt wants his loco used on a regular basis, as when you don't use them, particularly the more complex ones, you stand a chance of greater failures, so a class 60, well that really is a bit fanciful to consider it would ever see regular usage?

I think it's rather understandable that the Embsay & Bolton Abbey lot didn't want it, given their own issues with locos with un-attentive owners on their line!
I think the same owner so I am told has a 37 sat in the field at Warcop, Eden Valley Railway. I was taking some pics up there in 2019 and I asked if the 37 belonged to someone at the EVR and was told the guy wasn't a member but was a Director of the WR?

Wasn't told who he was but thought it strange if true that its wasn't on the WR?? Seemed that it had arrived many years ago with the understanding it would be done up, but nothing has happened apart from frequent visits by the "Midnight Metal Company" - Damn shame to see a useful loco like a 37 languishing in this way!!
 
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alexl92

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I'm not.....I think it falls into the whole rationale thing about "dumping" locos on site with a snowballs chance in hell of being restored. I read somewhere that the WR had stated the type of operational locos that would be welcomed to the line....25, 26, 31's etc, which for me is sound thinking. Why would yo wish to challenge the infrastructure with heavy locos?

Any loco owner worth is salt wants his loco used on a regular basis, as when you don't use them, particularly the more complex ones, you stand a chance of greater failures, so a class 60, well that really is a bit fanciful to consider it would ever see regular usage?


I think the same owner so I am told has a 37 sat in the field at Warcop, Eden Valley Railway. I was taking some pics up there in 2019 and I asked if the 37 belonged to someone at the EVR and was told the guy wasn't a member but was a Director of the WR?

Wasn't told who he was but thought it strange if true that its wasn't on the WR?? Seemed that it had arrived many years ago with the understanding it would be done up, but nothing has happened apart from frequent visits by the "Midnight Metal Company" - Damn shame to see a useful loco like a 37 languishing in this way!!
Re: the 60s you may well be right. I'm more surprised because some work, if only surface deep, had started on the 60s. They'd definintely been cleaned up a bit. I fully understand when a loco is just sitting there.

I think the 37 owner is quite controversial. Don't know too much more but am curious!
 

Marmaduke

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Re: the 60s you may well be right. I'm more surprised because some work, if only surface deep, had started on the 60s. They'd definintely been cleaned up a bit. I fully understand when a loco is just sitting there.

I think the 37 owner is quite controversial. Don't know too much more but am curious!
Re- 37 at Warcop EVR...Just been thinking, may be a co-incidence, but may be the same guy who had the 9F, another 37 and a 20 recent vacation from the WR. I think someone said he was a Director?
 
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So you think a railway should just happily permit stock which doesn't have a dogs chance of ever being restored to stay, rent free, ad infinitum? Looking back at WR's facebook page, they have done an amazing job of restoring 37250, a Bubble Car and some Mk2's


And your right to know this info is based on what?
I entirely agree with you. Hats off to the WR for taking the initiative. I happen to know the site and space is particularly limited at Leeming Bar and every time they needed to carry out some movements, involves a hell of a lot of shunting!!
Leeming Bar for years looked like a scrap yard, but one or two of the Directors and a few key individuals, since being spurred on by the Loco shed being erected, have enacted and made plans for the place, so much so that there is a new sense of purposefulness.
I look forward to the end result and hopefully commercial / contractual arrangement will prevail for any loco or stock owners wishing to place their "restoration" pieces their, with a defined timescale written into contract tied into cost recovery for any on-site services used.
That way, only the serious restorers will appear and keep the collectors at bay!!
 

alexl92

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Re- 37 at Warcop EVR...Just been thinking, may be a co-incidence, but may be the same guy who had the 9F, another 37 and a 20 recent vacation from the WR. I think someone said he was a Director?
I think I've heard that too.

I hope someday they can boast a rolling stock situation which is something similar to the KWVR, where out-of-service locos are stored on display in good condition with a healthy operational home fleet being rotated according to need. As much as I'm primarily a steam fan, I also hope they don't abandon their diesels; I don't think they will realistically.

Making a success of the WR is a much more difficult task than the Worth Valley in my view (being 4x as long for starters!) but I think there's genuine potential. Could be mega for galas if they can get the signalling and passing loops sorted. I'm determined to visit soon; every time I've tried in the past my plans have been dashed! It's a shame that I'll probably be riding a pacer if I visit this year - I fully understand why and agree with their logic but nonetheless, for me as an enthusiast I'd much prefer a vintage DMU or loco-hauled train. They have to cater for the bigger tourist market tho.
 

Marmaduke

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I think I've heard that too.

I hope someday they can boast a rolling stock situation which is something similar to the KWVR, where out-of-service locos are stored on display in good condition with a healthy operational home fleet being rotated according to need. As much as I'm primarily a steam fan, I also hope they don't abandon their diesels; I don't think they will realistically.

Making a success of the WR is a much more difficult task than the Worth Valley in my view (being 4x as long for starters!) but I think there's genuine potential. Could be mega for galas if they can get the signalling and passing loops sorted. I'm determined to visit soon; every time I've tried in the past my plans have been dashed! It's a shame that I'll probably be riding a pacer if I visit this year - I fully understand why and agree with their logic but nonetheless, for me as an enthusiast I'd much prefer a vintage DMU or loco-hauled train. They have to cater for the bigger tourist market tho.
I guess with the WR, its a long...long railway and as such just keeping on top of the lineside and P-WAY will take a lot of manpower and money.

I've always thought that the WR would in an ideal world have been better operating over a shorter distance, Leyburn to Aysgarth because that end was and would have always been the place to be.

Sadly, Aysgarth was sold prematurely in my opinion irrespective of what was put out at the time about raising capital to inject into the WR, because seemingly, there was very little funds left over to put in!!.

Yes along with many others I've read the very long thread a couple of years ago and even made comment then myself on what was and still is to a large amount of people, an emotional subject.

So Aysgarth aside, the WR has a great deal of potential and there appears to be a positive impetus, with action taking place daily.

Yes I'm a steam fan, but I also like certain heritage diesels, so I think with the new and experienced GM in place, with some supportive PLC & Trust Board members, the only way is up?
 

paul1609

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I guess with the WR, its a long...long railway and as such just keeping on top of the lineside and P-WAY will take a lot of manpower and money.

I've always thought that the WR would in an ideal world have been better operating over a shorter distance, Leyburn to Aysgarth because that end was and would have always been the place to be.

Sadly, Aysgarth was sold prematurely in my opinion irrespective of what was put out at the time about raising capital to inject into the WR, because seemingly, there was very little funds left over to put in!!.

Yes along with many others I've read the very long thread a couple of years ago and even made comment then myself on what was and still is to a large amount of people, an emotional subject.

So Aysgarth aside, the WR has a great deal of potential and there appears to be a positive impetus, with action taking place daily.

Yes I'm a steam fan, but I also like certain heritage diesels, so I think with the new and experienced GM in place, with some supportive PLC & Trust Board members, the only way is up?
Ive walked much of the Redmire to Aysgarth section of the Wensleydale. Quite aside from the land ownership costs the railway would need completely rebuilding to re-open as even a heritage railway. Apart from the missing bridge the ash foundation of the line is completely undermined. You'd have to scrape all the embankments etc back and remake them, based on my experience with the K&ESR Id say that youd be looking at an eight figure sum for the cost of re-instatement of the Redmire buffer stops to Aysgarth section alone. There is no way a heritage railway company is going to be able to finance that from internal sources. The Northallerton to Redmire section is I believe leased from Network Rail for a peppercorn amount.
 

Marmaduke

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Ive walked much of the Redmire to Aysgarth section of the Wensleydale. Quite aside from the land ownership costs the railway would need completely rebuilding to re-open as even a heritage railway. Apart from the missing bridge the ash foundation of the line is completely undermined. You'd have to scrape all the embankments etc back and remake them, based on my experience with the K&ESR Id say that youd be looking at an eight figure sum for the cost of re-instatement of the Redmire buffer stops to Aysgarth section alone. There is no way a heritage railway company is going to be able to finance that from internal sources. The Northallerton to Redmire section is I believe leased from Network Rail for a peppercorn amount.
I agree, with you and never ever said it would be a challenge!! The easy bit is across Apedale Beck to immediately in front of Castle Bolton, after that its very difficult to see how you could build a railway without extensive civil engineering works that would run into 10's of millions.

There was never a chance that the WR could have ever raised the funds to do that and I doubt even Mr Smith who owns Aysgarth Station, with the suggestions by others, that he would like to get to Redmire from Aysgarth, would have he stomach for it?

It would be such a large and costly task not to mention complex
 

Pinza-C55

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Ive walked much of the Redmire to Aysgarth section of the Wensleydale. Quite aside from the land ownership costs the railway would need completely rebuilding to re-open as even a heritage railway. Apart from the missing bridge the ash foundation of the line is completely undermined. You'd have to scrape all the embankments etc back and remake them, based on my experience with the K&ESR Id say that youd be looking at an eight figure sum for the cost of re-instatement of the Redmire buffer stops to Aysgarth section alone. There is no way a heritage railway company is going to be able to finance that from internal sources. The Northallerton to Redmire section is I believe leased from Network Rail for a peppercorn amount.

I'm not exactly sure of the detailed ownership of Redmire - Aysgarth but I seem to remember the WR doing vegetation clearance on that section years ago so if that's true it suggests that they have access to it.
 

Roast Veg

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Has anything at all been done to Aysgarth since Mr Smith took ownership? It looks nearly identical to me. "Gobby" Graham from the former station volunteers whom I met for the first time by chance spoke about it at length.

It's a wonder that Mr Smith hasn't made good with the team.
 

Marmaduke

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Has anything at all been done to Aysgarth since Mr Smith took ownership? It looks nearly identical to me. "Gobby" Graham from the former station volunteers whom I met for the first time by chance spoke about it at length.

It's a wonder that Mr Smith hasn't made good with the team.
I have a few friends from that fine group of volunteers, TASP and I cant recall there being one called "Graham" and I knew most of them quite well?
Not being their spokesperson, but remembering their feelings at the time of the sale of one of disappointment and afterwards disenchantment given their consistency to develop Aysgarth.
I don't really think it mattered who took over the Station, they had simply had enough by that stage and the group formally disbanded.
They did briefly appear at Hawes to give the coaching stock & loco a re-paint and I think one of two may have landed at the EVR, but not sure on this latter bit??
I think as far as Aysgarth goes, you used to be able to see in the site from the road bridge near the YDNP centre last year and clearly there appeared to be a lot of positive activity with rails in the platform areas, but you couldnt see much further.
 

Roast Veg

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I think as far as Aysgarth goes, you used to be able to see in the site from the road bridge near the YDNP centre last year and clearly there appeared to be a lot of positive activity with rails in the platform areas, but you couldnt see much further.
You can see in from multiple places. There is track present in both platforms, and at the East end there is pointwork to bring it into a buffer stop right next to the missing bridge deck over the public footpath. There's some fresh looking ballast down too, and a hopper wagon that looks to have distributed it resting on the track next to the station building.
 

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