What was South West Trains like in the late 1990s?

[trainmania100]

I've got a 1997 timetable book with a picture of a 442 on the front cover, quite a thick book. Lots of little codes and stuff in the columns, something a lot of people would find hard to follow these days

 

[Western Sunset]

Has anyone mentioned some of the 4-CEPs they had? Always seemed strange seeing one at Poole, as they had been so associated with the Eastern Division.

 

[Bertie the bus]

I've got a 1997 timetable book with a picture of a 442 on the front cover, quite a thick book. Lots of little codes and stuff in the columns, something a lot of people would find hard to follow these days

Were those codes the bus routes you could use when your train didn't turn up?

 

[ScottGallagher]

I've heard various things about the 'Driver Shortage' at the beginning of Stagecoach.

One of the things was that they thought they had too many Drivers and offered voluntary redundancy. But they hadn't taken into account the route and traction knowledge of the depots. So the newly uncovered work couldn't be placed into existing diagrams like they'd hoped because of lack of knowledge.

Another thing I heard, was that it was the Management team who were retained from BR days who instigated this, as their Management Bid to run the franchise themselves hadn't been chosen - Stagecoach had won. Sour grapes became an opportunity to do over Stagecoach (don't feel too sorry for them though - remember Darlington buses!).
The story goes when Stagecoach realised, those responsible were told to clear their desks and got the boot!

Whether there is any truth in that I don't know, but its an interesting rumour.

I was told by an ex-SWT Driver that the RMT went into a meeting and the Management proposed a £100 bonus if all available rest days were worked by Drivers in 'x' period. The RMT agreed.
Then ASLEF went in, declined the £100, and with a bit of brinkmanship it ended up that the figure agreed was £1000.
Such was SWTs desperation at the mess it had got itself into.

Did any of the redundant drivers return soon after? If so not bad to get a redundancy package and then get the phone call to come back !!

 

[Class800]

Depends on contract - in the field I work in, if someone comes back to same employer within a specified time frame, the redundancy is void

 

[StephenHunter]

True - that was an issue with them on the way back from the smoke, but I'd still have been incandescent with rage.

One can only wonder at how those "frightened" passengers were somehow unable to find an open Saloon in a CIG or a VEP !

From my experience with Mark 1 coaches on tours and heritage lines, the lighting isn't anyway as good as modern vehicles. The EPBs also lacked inter-carriage gangways, so that would definitely be a concern.

 

[yorksrob]

From my experience with Mark 1 coaches on tours and heritage lines, the lighting isn't anyway as good as modern vehicles. The EPBs also lacked inter-carriage gangways, so that would definitely be a concern.

CIG's and VEP's had flourescent lighting installed by NSE, so were more brightly lit than most heritage vehicles. And unlike EPB's they had inter-carriage gangways and toilets.

 

[StephenHunter]

I stand corrected.

 

[AY1975]

One can only wonder at how those "frightened" passengers were somehow unable to find an open Saloon in a CIG or a VEP !

CIG's and VEP's had fluorescent lighting installed by NSE, so were more brightly lit than most heritage vehicles. And unlike EPB's they had inter-carriage gangways and toilets.

True, although I suppose some passengers who felt vulnerable might have feared that an undesirable might emerge from the next coach (or from the guard's area on the Motor Brake Standard or the side corridor on the Driving Trailer Composite on a VEP or CIG) and pounce on them. The end gangway doors on the 455s have windows so you can see into the next coach, whereas those on the VEPs (and the sliding doors at the ends of each coach on the CIGs) did not.

Also, the 455s had low back seats before they were refurbished by SWT in the mid-2000s, whereas the VEPs, CIGs and CEPs had high back seats (albeit IC70 seats on the CEPs after their 1980s refurbishment) so at least on the VEPs and CIGs it could be more difficult to see who else was in your coach than on the 455s.

Why this was seen as more of an issue on the Reading line than on other similar services such as the Alton line and Basingstoke stoppers is beyond me, though.

 

[yorksrob]

True, although I suppose some passengers who felt vulnerable might have feared that an undesirable might emerge from the next coach (or from the guard's area on the Motor Brake Standard or the side corridor on the Driving Trailer Composite on a VEP or CIG and pounce on them). The end gangway doors on the 455s have windows so you can see into the next coach, whereas those on the VEPs (and the sliding doors at the ends of each coach on the CIGs) did not.

Also, the 455s had low back seats before they were refurbished by SWT in the mid-2000s, whereas the VEPs, CIGs and CEPs had high back seats (albeit IC70 seats on the CEPs after their 1980s refurbishment) so at least on the VEPs and CIGs it could be more difficult to see who else was in your coach than on the 455s.

Why this was seen as more of an issue on the Reading line than on other similar services such as the Alton line and Basingstoke stoppers is beyond me, though.

If some undesirable comes wandering up from the next carriage on a 455, your as trapped as on a slammer, whether you can see someone or not.