Which little-used stations might be candidates for closure in the new age of cost-cutting?

[Kite159]

and Sankey for Penketh I would strongly consider too.

Although with only a token weekday service (from memory 2 trains each way a day) since Warrington West opened up it won't save that much money if Sankey gets closed.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'd absolutely consider banishing Ardwick to the depths of history as well, unless someone can convince me of a good reason for keeping it.

Not much use now, but keep. That part of the city will in due course be swallowed up by development of flats etc and then it will have value and could potentially then be served by all the passing EMUs on the Hadfield line.

If the rotting footbridge falls to bits, by all means mothball temporarily, but don't dig it up.

The Denton line stations can join them too

Post HS2 (i.e. when paths become available) a Stockport to Manchester Victoria via Denton/Reddish South hourly or even half-hourly service would be of benefit, particularly now more services use Vic than used to. So I'd not close them, but it would be fine to mothball for now - though if it isn't hard to path and get staff it is quite possible that the "Flying Dentonian" could be profitable if run on a weekend due to the enthusiast interest.

and Sankey for Penketh I would strongly consider too.

I'd keep it. Electrification of the route could allow it to continue to be served. OK, it's only a kilometre from Warrington West, but that sort of station spacing is very common on Merseyrail, and it's not entirely impossible (see other threads) that the route may become part of Merseyrail at some point.

 

[Tayway]

Golf Street – only a stone's throw from the main station in Carnoustie and served by just two trains a day each way.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Golf Street – only a stone's throw from the main station in Carnoustie and served by just two trains a day each way.

Isn't this station primarily used when there are major events at the golf course, so the calls it normally gets are just to keep it open for that purpose?

Barry Links is probably more useless.

 

[Tayway]

Isn't this station primarily used when there are major events at the golf course, so the calls it normally gets are just to keep it open for that purpose?

Barry Links is probably more useless.

No, the golf specials all run to Carnoustie (or at least they did for the last Open), which is better equipped for large crowds.

 

[Kite159]

No, the golf specials all run to Carnoustie (or at least they did for the last Open), which is better equipped for large crowds.

Add on that Golf Street doesn't have long platforms



(Photo taken from the footbridge near Golf Street in August 2020)

I guess if the platforms ever degrade to a point of needing work then it will be an easy station to mothball.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They look pretty falling-to-bits now if the photo on the Wiki article is anything to go by.

I would say of these three, serve them properly or close them. Nobody local is going to use them with a Parly service. Stations 1km apart aren't totally useless - plenty of Merseyrail stations are like that and nobody is calling for those to close - but it does require commitment to serving them properly.

 

[lachlan]

They look pretty falling-to-bits now if the photo on the Wiki article is anything to go by.

I would say of these three, serve them properly or close them. Nobody local is going to use them with a Parly service. Stations 1km apart aren't totally useless - plenty of Merseyrail stations are like that and nobody is calling for those to close - but it does require commitment to serving them properly.

Monifieth and Broughty Ferry recently had their service upgraded to hourly (from three and ~eight trains each way per day respectively according to Wikipedia) Both saw big usage jumps with Monifieth passenger numbers doubling.

There is already a shuttle between Arbroath and Dundee that takes ~24 minutes. Looking at one of the trains also serving Golf Street, Barry Links, and Balmossie, it takes 32 minutes. Is the journey time increase worth it? I'm inclined to say yes. Arbroath does also have fast trains that call at Dundee.

As already mentioned Golf Street is very close to Carnoustie. Closing it and refurbishing Barry Links is an option too.

 

[Bletchleyite]

As already mentioned Golf Street is very close to Carnoustie. Closing it and refurbishing Barry Links is an option too.

In reality both are a bit sub-optimal. Barry Links is a bit far west to be useful, while Golf Street as you say is quite close to Carnoustie and is awkwardly on an embankment. If you were going to rebuild something, it might actually make more sense to close both and build an entirely new station (Carnoustie West, say) somewhere around Anderson St or Victoria St, which would put basically all of Carnoustie within walking/cycling distance of a station - and it appears the land to do that could be acquired quite easily as it's just car parking. I suspect Golf St is where it is because it serves the golf course entrance (it was opened in 1960 so this seems to fit) but it isn't really useful in that form any more.

Yes, that's an expensive solution, but Scotland has certainly built some expensive semi-white-elephant stations of late!

 

[Recessio]

In theory Newhaven Harbour is used by 50,000 passengers a year. Of the Settle and Carlisle stations only Appleby has slightly more at 60k. Wouldn't it be better value in cost saving to close the whole Settle to Carlisle retaining a short section at the south end for the quarry. There would be enormous infrastructure savings and it would make an excellent cycle path.

Not sure how that 50,000 number is calculated, so it may not be relevant here, but the Newhaven station's season ticket numbers used to be heavily inflated by people buying season tickets between Town and Harbour for the Gold card trick. I remember there was actually a report done about the line that mentioned this and said it sort of stuffed their modelling a bit.

 

[daodao]

Of the Settle and Carlisle stations only Appleby has slightly more at 60k. Wouldn't it be better value in cost saving to close the whole Settle to Carlisle retaining a short section at the south end for the quarry. There would be enormous infrastructure savings and it would make an excellent cycle path.

I agree.

 

[dk1]

Yes I always understood it was retained because the Acle route was deemed not to provide enough capacity for the busiest times. Whether that still applies nowadays is of course another matter!

In the busy Summer Saturdays of yesteryear (50s,60s,70s) when Yarmouth saw regular trains from London, & many destinations in the North of England & the Midlands, many trains where operated as via Reedham in the up direction & via Acle in the down. For this reason IBH signals where provided in the down direction only at Stracey Arms to break up the Acle to Breydon Junction single line section. Berney Arms could also switch in as could another signal box at Postwick between Brundall & Whitlingham. Local trains where slightly thinned out to accommodate the extra express services.

 

[Bletchleyite]

In theory Newhaven Harbour is used by 50,000 passengers a year. Of the Settle and Carlisle stations only Appleby has slightly more at 60k. Wouldn't it be better value in cost saving to close the whole Settle to Carlisle retaining a short section at the south end for the quarry. There would be enormous infrastructure savings and it would make an excellent cycle path.

It wouldn't make an excellent cycle path. Too long (the sweet spot is maybe 10-20 miles) and massive maintenance costs.

The Conwy Valley would make an excellent cycle path other than the tunnel section which would need to be closed. Primarily people would use it on the northern section from Llandudno Jn to Betws, which presently has no good cycle route.

There is already a shuttle between Arbroath and Dundee that takes ~24 minutes. Looking at one of the trains also serving Golf Street, Barry Links, and Balmossie, it takes 32 minutes. Is the journey time increase worth it? I'm inclined to say yes. Arbroath does also have fast trains that call at Dundee.

Guess that means an extra unit, though? Presumably a 24 minute end to end means only one unit doing the hourly service.

 

[70014IronDuke]

In theory Newhaven Harbour is used by 50,000 passengers a year. Of the Settle and Carlisle stations only Appleby has slightly more at 60k. Wouldn't it be better value in cost saving to close the whole Settle to Carlisle retaining a short section at the south end for the quarry. There would be enormous infrastructure savings and it would make an excellent cycle path.

It's been some years since I last travelled on the line, but at that point, strange to say, but Settle station was still on the Settle and Carlisle line.

In 2019-20, it had 149,000 entries and exits.

It does not necessarily detract too much from your argument (though I don't know how Newhaven Harobour gets 50k) of course, but good to keep it in mind.

 

[Drogba11CFC]

I've heard just now that there are rumours of Alton and Bentley potentially facing the axe.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've heard just now that there are rumours of Alton and Bentley potentially facing the axe.

I would be amazed, they are hardly poorly used.

 

[bramling]

I would be amazed, they are hardly poorly used.

Who knows, this govt seems to be going out of their way to self-destruct the Conservative vote in areas like London, the SE and Home Counties.

But yes I’d be surprised if it were true.

 

[richard1976]

I've heard just now that there are rumours of Alton and Bentley potentially facing the axe.

Which Bentley, Hampshire or South Yorkshire

 

[Clayton]

Who knows, this govt seems to be going out of their way to self-destruct the Conservative vote in areas like London, the SE and Home Counties.

But yes I’d be surprised if it were true.

17 K population and a train every half an hour? Doesn’t seem likely

 

[Drogba11CFC]

Which Bentley, Hampshire or South Yorkshire

Hampshire

 

[zwk500]

I've heard just now that there are rumours of Alton and Bentley potentially facing the axe.

I would be astonished. Are you able to say where you heard it from?

 

[Alex365Dash]

17 K population and a train every half an hour? Doesn’t seem likely

And 679,324 passengers a year in 2019/20 to add!

That would be incredibly surprising if true.

 

[Drogba11CFC]

I would be astonished. Are you able to say where you heard it from?

My brother; his train was cancelled at Farnham last night and he had to get a lift the rest of the way; he heard it from the person who gave him the lift.

 

[yorksrob]

I've heard just now that there are rumours of Alton and Bentley potentially facing the axe.

If such theories are gaining credence in the Home Counties, it doesn't suggest a lot of faith in the Governments stewardship of the railway.

 

[D6130]

If such theories are gaining credence in the Home Counties, it doesn't suggest a lot of faith in the Governments stewardship of the railway

In all honesty, does anyone still have any faith in this 'government's' stewardship of anything?

 

[yorksrob]

In all honesty, does anyone still have any faith in this 'government's stewardship of anything?

If you were looking to find someone who did, you'd probably start in the Home Counties !

 

[The Planner]

My brother; his train was cancelled at Farnham last night and he had to get a lift the rest of the way; he heard it from the person who gave him the lift.

Forgive us if we don't treat that evidence as "robust"

 

[Neptune]

If you were looking to find someone who did, you'd probably start in the Home Counties !

Now, if they closed some fairly well used stations in say Hampshire……..

My brother; his train was cancelled at Farnham last night and he had to get a lift the rest of the way; he heard it from the person who gave him the lift.

To be fair I don’t think that is going to be a particularly reliable source. It sounds a bit like ‘man in a pub’ syndrome.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

(of the Settle–Carlisle: )

It wouldn't make an excellent cycle path. Too long (the sweet spot is maybe 10-20 miles) and massive maintenance costs.

10-20 miles is the sweet spot for a particular market – basically the bike hire/bikes-on-roofrack market. The Camel Trail, Monsal Trail etc. do very nicely from that.

But it's not the only market. If you look at Europe then there is a massive tourism industry around long-distance, significantly traffic-free cycle routes: the Loire and Danube routes, for example. Not everyone is doing the whole Loire from source to sea, of course, but there are thousands of people riding multi-day trips. I rode the Loire a couple of years ago and the number of family cycle tourists genuinely took me aback. Now that e-bikes are a thing, I suspect it's busier still.

We don't have anything like that in the UK. The closest we have are some of the long-distance National Cycle Network routes, but generally they're too hilly and too car-infested to appeal to family or novice cyclists. It wouldn't be outlandish to conceive of the Settle–Carlisle as the base for such a route, perhaps connecting somehow to the Leeds & Liverpool Canal towpath at Skipton and from there to the east coast.

(But it'll never happen.)

 

[yorksrob]

(But it'll never happen.)

Quite. We need it as a railway.