X53 First bus Exeter to Poole

[shinkansen1966]

Would like to take the X53 First operated bus between Exeter and Poole.
Timetable here: http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/sou...=X53/X54&routeid=2415971&operator=7&source=sp

You can see the service is now 5 different services with connections at Seaton, Bridport, Weymouth and Wool. Previously it was shown as a through service. Are these genuine connections, so I can make a continuous journey ?

Have others used this service ?

Contacted First bus for guidance, but no response yet.

Thanks for any help.

 

[trentside]

I'm not sure of the exact technicalities with the X53, but these splits in the service are just to get around EU drivers hours regulations. Usually the service is worked by the same bus throughout.

 

[Greenback]

First Cymru have done a similar thing with the fast service between Carmarthen and Llanelli. The timetable shows the service splits at Llanelli, yet First say customers do not need to change buses.

I must confess to being bewildered by how this is supposed to work. People who just look at the timetable ar ebound to assume a change is required, and this may put many people off using the service. So what is the point? As far as I know drivers hours aren't regulated by the timetable, but by how much driving they actually do?

 

[trentside]

It's not the timetable, but the route length. Anything over 50km (31 miles) requires the drivers to work under more stringent EU hours regulations (rather than UK domestic regulations), which requires them to be on a separate rota and makes crew scheduling more difficult.

 

[flymo]

Crikey, the EU can even make reading bus timetable difficult.

 

[trentside]

First just display it badly, to be honest.

Here's a much simpler way of doing things from Stagecoach East Midlands:
http://www.stagecoachbus.com/PdfUploads/Timetable_10898_InterConnect 3.pdf

 

[Greenback]

It still looks as though customers need to change buses - do they?

 

[trentside]

Nope, but non-regular travellers often ask whether they need to.

That's the major problem with these regulations, it leaves people confused about whether they have a through service or not. 'Guaranteed Connections - No need to change buses' would be a better way to word it.

 

[flymo]

First just display it badly, to be honest.

Yep, I agree

Here's a much simpler way of doing things from Stagecoach East Midlands:
http://www.stagecoachbus.com/PdfUploads/Timetable_10898_InterConnect 3.pdf

Much better. Still think it is a ridiculous way to have to display a timetable. Still, if those are the rules...

Actually regarding the Exeter - Poole service, it looks to be about 85 miles one way and takes around 4 hours and 40 minutes. That works out at just over 18 miles per hour. If that is what the "X" does goodness knows what a non-"X" service would take. I love travelling by bus and have spent hours on them but flipping heck even I would think twice about using that one..Is there too much usage of the "X" prefix these days ?

 

[Greenback]

Nope, but non-regular travellers often ask whether they need to.

That's the major problem with these regulations, it leaves people confused about whether they have a through service or not. 'Guaranteed Connections - No need to change buses' would be a better way to word it.

It would, maybe they will change it if someone reads these boards!

Actually regarding the Exeter - Poole service, it looks to be about 85 miles one way and takes around 4 hours and 40 minutes. That works out at just over 18 miles per hour. If that is what the "X" does goodness knows what a non-"X" service would take. I love travelling by bus and have spent hours on them but flipping heck even I would think twice about using that one..Is there too much usage of the "X" prefix these days ?

The regulations probably need to be changed - I'm sure it wasn't the intention to cause confusion, but then again with the EU you never know!

The trouble with many X services is that they aren't truly limited stop express services. They may be on the outskirts of major conurbations, but in other places en route they often provide the only bus service, so need to stop!

 

[flymo]

The trouble with many X services is that they aren't truly limited stop express services. They may be on the outskirts of major conurbations, but in other places en route they often provide the only bus service, so need to stop!

Yep, I agree with that, sometimes there is no other option.

 

[anthony263]

These regulation, are causing a lot of problems not just that a few of the older drivers are thinking about retiring rather than doing the drivers cpc. Good in theory, but it is going to make life diffcult as small firms have got to find the time to make sure their staff are trained.

i done my drivers cpc back in 2008 so should be ok til 2013, personally it is good idea to keep up to date with new regulations, something like this should be done for all car drivers (unless they should a pcv or hgv licence)

going back to the eu drivers hours regulation. stagecoach have recently split service 172 Aberdare - Tonypandy - Bridgend - Porthcawl but the buses clearly say that bus will be continuing to Porthcawl/Aberdare.

It is stupid, i know some rural routes have been heavily cut because of it. There should have been a exception clause made in the legislation for local bus services.

 

[bb21]

I've not done the route lately, but the route has always been worked by separate drivers over the whole distance. Driver changes used to take place at Bridport and Weymouth so that there are three drivers working one complete journey from Exeter to Bournemouth (as it was when it first opened). Passengers did not have to change buses. Not sure about the situation now. Maybe worth giving Weymouth depot a call?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If that is what the "X" does goodness knows what a non-"X" service would take.

It stood for X-tra long.

 

[mbonwick]

Still think Stagecoach North West's way of dealing with route splits is the best;
http://www.stagecoachbus.com/PdfUploads/Timetable_9171_X2 - 2X (Preston).pdf

 

[OMGitsDAVE]

Still think Stagecoach North West's way of dealing with route splits is the best;
http://www.stagecoachbus.com/PdfUploads/Timetable_9171_X2 - 2X (Preston).pdf

That's actually very good, gives people some confidence and reassurance!

 

[iantherev]

The X53 is worked by the same bus throughout so there is no need to change vehicles.

 

[bb21]

Thanks. That confirms what I thought.

Though a footnote explaining that fact would have been welcome, but then again we are talking about First Group here, aren't we?

 

[shinkansen1966]

Though a footnote explaining that fact would have been welcome, but then again we are talking about First Group here, aren't we?

Over a week ago, I contacted First bus about the X53 service and have heard nothing back.

So now I am sending an email to First bus PR manager Niall Dowds and asked for a speedy response.

 

[bb21]

Maybe give Weymouth depot a ring tomorrow: 01305 783645

 

[route101]

Stagecoach Western service 4 does this spilt at Kilmarnock . Desty screen on bus says Kilmarnock for Ayr .

 

[radamfi]

The EU gets a lot of flack for this regulation, but if buses got tachos then they can run any distance. The issue is really that British buses are so poorly funded that they can't even afford tachos.

 

[Eagle]

In the same way (and the same part of the country :P) Wilts and Dorset split the 184 Salisbury-Weymouth in two at Blandford circa 2008. It's still one through bus but it now has two numbers: 184 for Salisbury-Blandford and 183 for Blandford-Weymouth. Even the blinds acknowledge this by scrolling "184 Blandford. Via Sixpenny Handley, Tarrant Hinton, Pimperne. Continues to Dorchester and Weymouth."

 

[shinkansen1966]

The issue is really that British buses are so poorly funded

Mismanaged, more like.

Some urban areas have muiltiple bus companies with little control or guidance from the city authorities. Outside London, profitable services are run on a commercial basis with the profit retained by the private operator. But loss making services financed by the local authority. Result: the obvious two tier bus structure you see: frequent daytime service but almost nothing after 18:00 or Sundays.

Then we have the absurd situation where the government pays private operators to convey the over 60s.

Politicians don't have the gumption, visions or brains to run buses as they are run in Northern Ireland or London.

 

[mbonwick]

The EU gets a lot of flack for this regulation, but if buses got tachos then they can run any distance. The issue is really that British buses are so poorly funded that they can't even afford tachos.

It's not that at all.
It's because drivers who fall under EU rules (by driving routes that require tachos) have to be on a completely separate rota to those driving under domestic rules.
That causes huge headaches for the planners, hence why many companies are now splitting routes to avoid the hassle.

Yet another example of EU knows best....

 

[trentside]

The EU gets a lot of flack for this regulation, but if buses got tachos then they can run any distance. The issue is really that British buses are so poorly funded that they can't even afford tachos.

In that case, why are the operators who can and do have tachos fitted to their buses choosing to split the routes? I'd argue it's because of the unnecessary need to maintain two separate rotas for crews working under domestic hours regulations and the EU regulations. This leads to unnecessary paperwork and hassle for the operator, especially when it can be avoided by simply splitting the route into sections.

 

[radamfi]

Are operators outside the UK complaining about this regulation? Maybe it is normal for all buses to have tachos and it is just the UK that only have them on some buses? Just guessing here.

 

[anthony263]

Are operators outside the UK complaining about this regulation? Maybe it is normal for all buses to have tachos and it is just the UK that only have them on some buses? Just guessing here.

I can say that there are a few operator's in europe who are not happy about this piece of legislation. Another problems is that a lot of buses are not fitted with tachographs

There are a lot of drivers who are not happy about all the changes with EU legislation (myself included), Where routes have been split i do think the bus operators should do more so that passenger's know that they are not required to change buses

 

[Welshman]

It all seems rather uneccessarily complicated.

Take, for example, Arriva Wales' services 5 and X5 from Llandudno to Caernarfon via Bangor.

On the outward journey, they're all shown as operating through from Llandudno to Caernarfon [Service 5 taking 1hr 35min and Service X5 Ihr 30min, with a slight variation in routing].

But on the return, only the X5s are shown as going through. What should be the 5s are shown as two seperate services, numbered 5C between Caernarfon and Bangor and 5 from Bangor to Llandudno.

Now unless there's a growing cache of unused buses parked somewhere in Bangor, they all obviously travel through, but not according to the timetable, and the unsuspecting passenger could be forgiven for thinking a change in Bangor is required. There's no helpful footnote to ease any apprehension. Indeed, the destination indicator of these buses usually says "Bangor, with connections to Llandudno"

So, confusion for the passengers. And at the end of the day, what's the point? The buses used seem inter-changeable, whether they have tachos or not, and the drivers drive almost same mileage in their shifts and for almost the same hours whether they are driving X5s or a combination of 5Cs & 5s.

All part of the rich tapestry of life in the land to the west of Offa's Dyke.

 

[Greenback]

It is totally and unnecessarily complicated. And, as usual, it is the passenger (or intending passenger) who suffers. Either by having to double check with the operator or being put off travelling altogether.

An explanation in the timetable notes would be so helpful.

 

[shinkansen1966]

It is totally and unnecessarily complicated. And, as usual, it is the passenger (or intending passenger) who suffers. Either by having to double check with the operator or being put off travelling altogether.

An explanation in the timetable notes would be so helpful.

Agreed.

Still, no reply from First Group PR Manager Nial Dowds.
So now, I've sent an email to his colleage, Corporate Communications Manager, Stuart Bugg.

After that, I'll then email Mr Bugg's direct Ms Rachael Borthwick.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
First Group Corporate Communications Manager Stuart Bugg has emailed me.

This link clears things up:
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/service/CoastLinX53_Summer_2011.pdf