First Great Western to be renamed/reliveried?

[talltim]

I heard a Northern Gaurd asking some cyclists what they though of Northern considering a similar scheme to denote the door for cycle spaces. I bet they do something different tho.

 

[TEW]

I think a standard colour scheme is a good idea, one which minimises the use of vinyls, like the current 150/1 Plain Blue livery which I think looks quite smart. Change the doors to a different colour from First Group pink and you'd have a pretty good standard livery. Whatever happens I hope we don't get more drab East Coast grey. The current FGW livery does incorporate a prominant yellow cantrail stripe denoting First Class.

 

[alwaystouchout]

Ideally I'd like to see the infrastructure itself, ie stations, move towards a common identity, along the lines of BR/NR Blue or something like that, just to demonstrate to passengers that there is national rail network rather than 20-odd regional networks..'Britain's train companies working together' and all that..

I think a diversity of liveries is a good thing, as it doesn't just avoid a monochrome railway but also aids passengers who might have TOC-specific tickets for example.

Similarly, each TOC could have a legal name but the franchise itself could have a 'trading as' name - East Midlands Trains and Southeastern suggest more a cohesive network than just a corporate/monotonous Virgin Trains or First Great Western.

Like others have said that wouldn't be re-nationalisation.

 

[Gricerjo]

At a rail user group meeting in Wiltshire last month, Ian Mundy, First Great Western's Publications Manager, said that the company was to be 'renamed' and to get a new livery.

As far as I'm aware (I didn't attend, so I'm only going on second hand info) there was no timescale mentioned for this, but logically it would happen some time during the current franchise extension period.

Is not all this re-branding and new livery stuff rather silly and above all a waste of fare and tax payers' money that might be better spent on improving the service? Its a process that benefits no one other than the consultants who have leeched on the industry since privatisation.

Do passengers really care what colour the trains are painted and what the company is called? They simply want a train that's (reasonably) on time, clean, safe and a seat would be nice.

 

[bnm]

The last paint job the FGW HSTs had was done good & proper which is why they're still in quite good nick and are easier to keep clean. Very little corrosion is evident on the bodywork.

I'm told that below the solebar things aren't so good. These are old vehicles and continued touch-ups are rather like polishing a t*rd. They've provided sterling service for nearly 40 years, but it's time to retire the worst of the fleet. The new trains can't come soon enough as far as I'm concerned. I pity Somerset, Devon & Cornwall though. They're going to be stuck with ageing HSTs for far too long IMHO.

 

[jon0844]

You can have sections of the train that can have some branding, such as the route name (to differentiate say Capital Connect from East Anglia or whatever).

Modern stock would be better identified by those who have service specific tickets by larger displays on the front and sides to identify the service, including destination and stopping pattern etc. Maybe also include the time of the departure so people can be sure it matches their advance ticket etc.

Frankly that would be far better than different colours, squiggles or logos that not everyone will know or recognise.

 

[Lockwood]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/44/Southern_Class_377_Diagram.PNG

Red stripes on wheelchair door and yellow stripe for first class.
Nice and simple.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I think a standard colour scheme is a good idea, one which minimises the use of vinyls, like the current 150/1 Plain Blue livery which I think looks quite smart. Change the doors to a different colour from First Group pink and you'd have a pretty good standard livery. Whatever happens I hope we don't get more drab East Coast grey. The current FGW livery does incorporate a prominant yellow cantrail stripe denoting First Class.

Can you see this idea being extended to the bus companies or would that be like a return to something like the former East Germany with drab sameness.

 

[plastictaffy]

I really don't think it matters in the slightest what colour the trains are. The "people" that travel on them will still come and ask you "Is this the xyz train to xyz??" even when you've just made an announcement, on board, for them all to hear, stating that it is indeed the xyz train going to xyz, calling at a, b and c. Paint 'em all red and be done with it.

 

[HowardGWR]

Brown and cream would be nicer though.

 

[dave55uk]

From reading the above, how about having a livery for InterCity services (a nice fawn colour with a red stripe perhaps) and another livery for all other services (like blue with grey window surrounds). To give the impression it's a nationwide network, have the name 'British Rail' on the coaches, and then (pinching the idea from Arriva Greenline coaches) have underneath the 'British Rail' the words (in a smaller size) 'operated by ........'.

:grin:

 

[Drsatan]

'operated by ........'.

:grin:

I wish the same Unfortunately, I very much doubt BR will be recreated any time soon; even Ed Miliband hasn't commented on renationalising the railways.

You can have sections of the train that can have some branding, such as the route name (to differentiate say Capital Connect from East Anglia or whatever).

Modern stock would be better identified by those who have service specific tickets by larger displays on the front and sides to identify the service, including destination and stopping pattern etc. Maybe also include the time of the departure so people can be sure it matches their advance ticket etc.

Following on from this thread, why not go further and give each train service a passenger reference number prefixed by category? This would at least give the passenger a rough idea of the facilities on board the train (e.g. trolley service, first class, buffet car), its average speed and how frequently it will stop.

For example, having looked at Swiss train categories, it might be able to classify all train services in the UK as follows:

EUS: Eurostar services
IC: Intercity services
IR: Interregional services - services which stop more frequently than Intercity services and run at a lower average speed.
L: Local train services
LO: London Overground services
MR: Merseyrail services

A couple of examples:

The 1821 "WAG" express from Cardiff Central to Holyhead, despite having a noticeably lower average speed than a WCML Pendolino service, would be, in my opinion, be classed as an intercity service because of the restaurant car on board. Similarly, LM services from London Euston to Crewe might be classed as interregional because they call at more stations than Virgin services on the same route.

 

[alwaystouchout]

Following on from this thread, why not go further and give each train service a passenger reference number prefixed by category?

Or each route could have a code similar to how RE/RB services do in Germany?

TP01, TP02, etc (TransPennine), NT01, NT02, etc (Northern), for example.

Modern stock with large front/side electronic displays could then display something like 'TP01 - Cleethorpes via Sheffield & Doncaster' - again just to make things simpler for people who might use the railways less frequently.

 

[IanXC]

TP01, TP02, etc (TransPennine), NT01, NT02, etc (Northern), for example.

Modern stock with large front/side electronic displays could then display something like 'TP01 - Cleethorpes via Sheffield & Doncaster' - again just to make things simpler for people who might use the railways less frequently.

And of course such a numbering system already exists:

1B65 TP6006 04/12/2013 0518
Cleethorpes [CLE] to Manchester Airport [MIA]

 

[starrymarkb]

Is not all this re-branding and new livery stuff rather silly and above all a waste of fare and tax payers' money that might be better spent on improving the service? Its a process that benefits no one other than the consultants who have leeched on the industry since privatisation.

Do passengers really care what colour the trains are painted and what the company is called? They simply want a train that's (reasonably) on time, clean, safe and a seat would be nice.

Even with Neutral branding stock would still need periodic repaints. And any branding would probably still be refreshed roughly every 7-10 years. TGVs for example are now on their third livery (over a 30 year life with the same state owned operator)

 

[Hyphen]

And of course such a numbering system already exists

Voyagers (and possibly Pendolinos, but I can't remember) do definitely show this code on the displays on the side of the train.

 

[crewmeal]

Brown and cream would be nicer though.

Agreed. Lets put the Great back in Western. Be proud of it.

 

[starrymarkb]

I've had more then one customer ask which train number they are looking for at work

It might also cut down the platform announcements too. "IC4564 to Newcastle will depart at 15:00 from Platform 2"

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Brown and cream would be nicer though.

Your username betrays your allegiance. However, there are those who would view "varnished teak" as a more attractive livery...

Giving my age away, again..

 

[bnm]

It's slightly misguided to think that frequent livery changes are somehow costly and that the money should be spent elsewhere. Even when the railways were state owned there were frequent re-paints/re-liveries.

OK, the colours alone may not have changed as frequently back in the day, but the fact of the matter is that rolling stock needs a re-paint/re-livery on a fairly regular basis.

HSTs were re-liveried three times between squadron introduction in 1976 and privatisation in 1994. That's an average of once every 6 years.

FGWs current livery is 6 years old.

 

[Michael.Y]

I loved the green and cream of GWT 1997.

 

[FOH]

I loved the green and cream of GWT 1997.

With the INTERCITY logo?

 

[GatwickDepress]

Oh, and speaking of journey numbering, bring back the numerical headcodes for Southern units. If numbers work for buses...

Brown and cream would be nicer though.

Oooh, yes please.

 

[1018509]

Look, let's get this right. Express coaches should be brown and cream and hauled by "Castles". Local trains should be maroon hauled by a Prairie or perhaps the local could be a BR green 3 car DMU (class 117 - no corridor connections) with speed whiskers anything else is totally unacceptable.

Yes! Dinosaurs still exist.

 

[jon0844]

I'd like to think we could use some nicer colour schemes more fitting of the 21st century. A standardised livery doesn't mean going back to the 19th century!

 

[alwaystouchout]

And of course such a numbering system already exists:

1B65 TP6006 04/12/2013 0518
Cleethorpes [CLE] to Manchester Airport [MIA]

Virtually unheard of to everyday rail users though.

My point was if services had a public code/name (similar to WYPTE's Metro lines or something, appearing on maps etc) - in addition to clockface timetabling - it would lend a degree of regularity and reliability to the railways which could surely increase patronage further?

 

[Zoe]

HSTs were re-liveried three times between squadron introduction in 1976 and privatisation in 1994. That's an average of once every 6 years.

I know they started in blue and grey and at privatization were in the intercity livery which had a red band but what were the other two liveries?

 

[JB25]

Do they? EMT is simply EMT, not Stagecoach East Midlands Trains. SWT at one stage were called Stagecoach SWT, but are now simply South West Trains.

Was going to say exactly this...
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
First groups current livery is it navy or purple?

 

[Eagle]

First groups current livery is it navy or purple?

Buses or trains? They're completely different liveries (unlike Stagecoach for instance).

 

[JB25]

Buses or trains? They're completely different liveries (unlike Stagecoach for instance).

I meant trains as in FCC / FGW. It looks like a purplish colour but sure I heard it mentioned as navy. Either way I don't like it.

We went on a day trip in the summer to West Wittering and first thing I commented when we got on the Stagecoach run bus from Chichester was oh look the seats and hand rails all look like SWTs.