First South West (Kernow & Buses of Somerset)

[vla50]

The oldest buses that first in cornwall have got rid of is 21/22 year old ALX400s which are W-PAEs which is/was 32104/32015 which Kernow had for about 1/2 years.

Could Kernow do with B7TLs from Bradford or Huddersfield/Halifax to replace any buses? Maybe the remaining dealer White vehicles 32121-32129? So some of the 370xx B7TL Geminis from Bradford/Huddersfield or Halifax as they are getting rid of their B7TL Geminis due to the Clean Air Zone in West Yorkshire coming into force in Spring 2022.

From what I can tell 32126-32129 are the only B7TLs remaining (32129 has transferred to BOS for some reason but I imagine temporary) but I don't know what they'll be replaced with.

Do not take my word for it as I am not associated with the company, but I imagine when the last 2 E500s enter service (2 haven't been seen since early January) that'll probably see them off.

 

[cnjb8]

The oldest buses that first in cornwall have got rid of is 21/22 year old ALX400s which are W-PAEs which is/was 32104/32015 which Kernow had for about 1/2 years.

Could Kernow do with B7TLs from Bradford or Huddersfield/Halifax to replace any buses? Maybe the remaining dealer White vehicles 32121-32129? So some of the 370xx B7TL Geminis from Bradford/Huddersfield or Halifax as they are getting rid of their B7TL Geminis due to the Clean Air Zone in West Yorkshire coming into force in Spring 2022.

First South West are awaiting some Gemini transfers from West Yorkshire. It was on a post a few pages back

I would hate to see the 02/52 reg Volvos replaced because they seem to be like a good batch but would it be likely they would be? First have been getting 25 years out of some of their stock so I imagine they'd still have a good number of years left in them?

‘Another investment project’ seems to suggest they are replacing something. We need to wait and see unfortunately

 

[volvob12]

‘Another investment project’ seems to suggest they are replacing something. We need to wait and see unfortunately

I’m surprised none of the FSW ‘Twitterati’ picked up on this tweet from the New Year, seemingly confirming the intended use!

I’d half expected ex Lothian B9s for their larger upper deck capacity vs ex London.

https://twitter.com/MarcMorganHuws/status/1477956435220877317?s=20

That’s some Twitter action by our friends
@EnsignBusCo
Well sone to the Essex legends. We’re looking forward to you supplying our new fleet for the Land’s End Coaster!!!

 

[vla50]

I’m surprised none of the FSW ‘Twitterati’ picked up on this tweet from the New Year, seemingly confirming the intended use!

I’d half expected ex Lothian B9s for their larger upper deck capacity vs ex London.

https://twitter.com/MarcMorganHuws/status/1477956435220877317?s=20

I didn't see that tweet but now that makes sense. That sounds really interesting. I suppose with a year round service plus the service having done extremely well the service probably does deserve upgrades especially as the Atlantic Coaster has. I imagine the 2 Geminis currently in the LEC fleet will also stay on?

 

[Goldfish62]

I’m surprised none of the FSW ‘Twitterati’ picked up on this tweet from the New Year, seemingly confirming the intended use!

I’d half expected ex Lothian B9s for their larger upper deck capacity vs ex London.

https://twitter.com/MarcMorganHuws/status/1477956435220877317?s=20

I'm surprised I missed it!

The current longer ones do struggle at times on the route and the longer still Lothian ones simply would not fit, eg at Porthcurno and Sennen Cove.

I wonder if they'll be converted to single door for extra capacity. It was previously stated the E400d were unsuitable for the LEC because of their lower capacity.

 

[On the Buses]

Volvo B7TL ALX Closed Tops in Cornwall
As I’ve stated previously, the replacements are already in fleet. Some have already departed, some are awaiting collection. Some are retained temporarily while we deal with around 6 Geminis that await engine rebuilds - Brexit and Covid caused lengthy delays to the availability of parts and contract labour. The only additional double deck requirement could be from contract gains - we are currently operating numerous tenders surrendered by other operators. Based on the status quo we are probably 1 short. There are Geminis due into Somerset from Yorkshire and Scotland in the near future along with the remaining Trident East Lancs from Hilsea. Aside from a Gemini escaping to Cornwall instead that is it for cascades.

FSW Open Tops
I’d be really quite disappointed if our plans for 2022 were in any way predictable, so it’s reassuring to see that no one is anywhere close to knowing what we are doing in terms of open top fleet.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Volvo B7TL ALX Closed Tops in Cornwall
As I’ve stated previously, the replacements are already in fleet. Some have already departed, some are awaiting collection. Some are retained temporarily while we deal with around 6 Geminis that await engine rebuilds - Brexit and Covid caused lengthy delays to the availability of parts and contract labour. The only additional double deck requirement could be from contract gains - we are currently operating numerous tenders surrendered by other operators. Based on the status quo we are probably 1 short. There are Geminis due into Somerset from Yorkshire and Scotland in the near future along with the remaining Trident East Lancs from Hilsea. Aside from a Gemini escaping to Cornwall instead that is it for cascades.

FSW Open Tops
I’d be really quite disappointed if our plans for 2022 were in any way predictable, so it’s reassuring to see that no one is anywhere close to knowing what we are doing in terms of open top fleet.

I was sitting back and enjoying the rampant speculation With the B9s are heading for the Lands End Coaster, then I'm sure that there's options for any vehicles made spare. Look forward to seeing yet more innovation from FSW

I appreciate you're a busy person but out of curiosity, what are FSW operating that has been surrendered by others?

 

[On the Buses]

I was sitting back and enjoying the rampant speculation With the B9s are heading for the Lands End Coaster, then I'm sure that there's options for any vehicles made spare. Look forward to seeing yet more innovation from FSW

I appreciate you're a busy person but out of curiosity, what are FSW operating that has been surrendered by others?

Closed school contracts in Cornwall

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Closed school contracts in Cornwall

Thanks

 

[carlberry]

Volvo B7TL ALX Closed Tops in Cornwall
As I’ve stated previously, the replacements are already in fleet. Some have already departed, some are awaiting collection. Some are retained temporarily while we deal with around 6 Geminis that await engine rebuilds - Brexit and Covid caused lengthy delays to the availability of parts and contract labour. The only additional double deck requirement could be from contract gains - we are currently operating numerous tenders surrendered by other operators. Based on the status quo we are probably 1 short. There are Geminis due into Somerset from Yorkshire and Scotland in the near future along with the remaining Trident East Lancs from Hilsea. Aside from a Gemini escaping to Cornwall instead that is it for cascades.

FSW Open Tops
I’d be really quite disappointed if our plans for 2022 were in any way predictable, so it’s reassuring to see that no one is anywhere close to knowing what we are doing in terms of open top fleet.

Dont worry, the plans for the open top tours of Hinkley Point C are safe with me!

 

[83G/84D]

33319 was on the T1 this morning, the first green one on the route this year?

 

[Callum15632]

33319 was on the T1 this morning, the first green one on the route this year?

Nope not the first one of the year as 33321 was on the T1 yesterday and I believe different green ones were on in the week.

 

[Trainfan061193]

With the B9s expected on the Lands End Coaster, I wonder if the open top Lizard Tridents will attempt a return this year despite their extreme unreliability last year? I’m also looking forward to hopefully going on one of the ex Seaford Tridents as I was told on here just before Christmas they would most likely be used on the Sunseeker.

I also wonder when the Discover Exeter Tridents will return?

 

[vla50]

With the B9s expected on the Lands End Coaster, I wonder if the open top Lizard Tridents will attempt a return this year despite their extreme unreliability last year? I’m also looking forward to hopefully going on one of the ex Seaford Tridents as I was told on here just before Christmas they would most likely be used on the Sunseeker.

I also wonder when the Discover Exeter Tridents will return?

I imagine they would do.

As for the Discover Exeter Tridents, I wonder similarly because they required engine rebuilds and OTB has just mentioned that there is parts and contract labour delay caused by COVID & Brexit.

 

[Busaholic]

Nope not the first one of the year as 33321 was on the T1 yesterday and I believe different green ones were on in the week.

I travel to Royal Cornwall Hospital every two days along much of the route and I've seen at least two earlier in the week.

 

[vla50]

https://twitter.com/MarcMorganHuws/status/1482433721961791496

Guess these'll be the fleet numbers:

37789: LK59CXF
37791: LK59CXH
37792: LK59CXJ
37793: LK59CXL
37795: LK59CXN
37796: LK59CXO
37797: LK59CXP
37798: LK59FCO
37801: LK59FCV

 

[Busaholic]

https://twitter.com/MarcMorganHuws/status/1482433721961791496

Guess these'll be the fleet numbers:

37789: LK59CXF
37791: LK59CXH
37792: LK59CXJ
37793: LK59CXL
37795: LK59CXN
37796: LK59CXO
37797: LK59CXP
37798: LK59FCO
37801: LK59FCV

That's a bold guess!

 

[Whiteway215]

https://twitter.com/MarcMorganHuws/status/1482433721961791496

Guess these'll be the fleet numbers:

37789: LK59CXF
37791: LK59CXH
37792: LK59CXJ
37793: LK59CXL
37795: LK59CXN
37796: LK59CXO
37797: LK59CXP
37798: LK59FCO
37801: LK59FCV

Those are certainly the old Centrewest fleet numbers.

 

[Accelerator59]

That's a bold guess!

It’s a good guess as they’re the original fleet numbers with CentreWest as aforementioned with the addition of a couple of letters prior to the fleet numbers.

 

[gka472l]

The E400's that got re-acquired for the Atlantic Coaster got their original First numbers back, 33575/92/600/1.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The E400's that got re-acquired for the Atlantic Coaster got their original First numbers back, 33575/92/600/1.

As indeed did one of the e400s that similarly went from First to Metroline and then joined First Scotland East for Bright Bus Tours.

In respect of those B7TLs ousted from Lands End Coaster, it's intriguing to see what they might end up doing. I had thought, in perhaps 2023, that they might be be used to replace some of the elderly Tridents O/Ts ultimately. If the ex Seaford ones are being prepared for Sunseeker and there's been some work done on the others, then that doesn't seem like a likely plan.

They could, of course, head elsewhere in the group but would be more interesting if they were to stay. What is for certain is that First South West are one of the more innovative bus businesses in the UK (not just in First) and some of their initiatives have got people unawares. We will wait with interest to see what happens when information can be shared.

 

[Goldfish62]

In respect of those B7TLs ousted from Lands End Coaster, it's intriguing to see what they might end up doing. I had thought, in perhaps 2023, that they might be be used to replace some of the elderly Tridents O/Ts ultimately. If the ex Seaford ones are being prepared for Sunseeker and there's been some work done on the others, then that doesn't seem like a likely plan.

In his usual way of keeping us guessing @OntheBuses has responded to a tweet to state that these B9s are not replacing the current B7s used on LEC.

Now, either he means that the B7s are being retained and will be used elsewhere or that the B9s are not intended for the LEC after all (they would after all be a bit new for Penzance ).

The intrigue continues!

 

[vla50]

As indeed did one of the e400s that similarly went from First to Metroline and then joined First Scotland East for Bright Bus Tours.

In respect of those B7TLs ousted from Lands End Coaster, it's intriguing to see what they might end up doing. I had thought, in perhaps 2023, that they might be be used to replace some of the elderly Tridents O/Ts ultimately. If the ex Seaford ones are being prepared for Sunseeker and there's been some work done on the others, then that doesn't seem like a likely plan.

They could, of course, head elsewhere in the group but would be more interesting if they were to stay. What is for certain is that First South West are one of the more innovative bus businesses in the UK (not just in First) and some of their initiatives have got people unawares. We will wait with interest to see what happens when information can be shared.

Maybe 2 might end up replacing 32799/800 as spare buses? After all 32800 did have a serious engine problem which caused it not to partake in any duties for the rest of the season.

The intrigue absolutely continues but I'm sure FSW and OTB have tricks up their sleeve. Perhaps some of these new OT services might be in BOS territory now? I guess we'll not know for a while.

In his usual way of keeping us guessing @OntheBuses has responded to a tweet to state that these B9s are not replacing the current B7s used on LEC.

Now, either he means that the B7s are being retained and will be used elsewhere or that the B9s are not intended for the LEC after all (they would after all be a bit new for Penzance ).

The intrigue continues!

It would make sense for some of the B9s to work the LEC (which 37058 (B7) and 37729 (B9) already do) because the service is now running year round along with the Atlantic Coaster which also has a modern fleet of E400s with perhaps the B7TLs moved towards more lowkey seasonal duties or "tester" services such as Sunseeker, Lizard etc. Not to say the 02/52 reg couldn't operate year round but they've all been out of service since Late November (except for 32103 & 32179, of which the latter is on the FC right now).

I think it's been hinted towards in a previous tweet that Ensignbus are sorting out the LEC fleet, of which was revealed to be B9s a few days ago. There are also 9 exactly and there are 10 B7s on the LEC so I imagine that would probably allude to them being used there, unless the LEC now receives a frequency increase (or even the AC as well).

 

[Trainfan061193]

Maybe 2 might end up replacing 32799/800 as spare buses? After all 32800 did have a serious engine problem which caused it not to partake in any duties for the rest of the season.

The intrigue absolutely continues but I'm sure FSW and OTB have tricks up their sleeve. Perhaps some of these new OT services might be in BOS territory now? I guess we'll not know for a while.


It would make sense for some of the B9s to work the LEC (which 37058 (B7) and 37729 (B9) already do) because the service is now running year round along with the Atlantic Coaster which also has a modern fleet of E400s with perhaps the B7TLs moved towards more lowkey seasonal duties or "tester" services such as Sunseeker, Lizard etc. Not to say the 02/52 reg couldn't operate year round but they've all been out of service since Late November (except for 32103 & 32179, of which the latter is on the FC right now).

I think it's been hinted towards in a previous tweet that Ensignbus are sorting out the LEC fleet, of which was revealed to be B9s a few days ago. There are also 9 exactly and there are 10 B7s on the LEC so I imagine that would probably allude to them being used there, unless the LEC now receives a frequency increase (or even the AC as well).

It does look as if the ex Seaford Tridents are going to be used on the Sunseeker so it does look as if OTB said 32102-104/32200/02/07-09/11 are staying but will possibly be used elsewhere or even joined by the B9s on the Lands End Coaster but the reality is we will just have to wait and see...

 

[GusB]

Just a quick a reminder that "jargon" needs to be defined. Terms such as AC, FC and LEC may be familiar to local forum members, but they are meaningless to anyone from outwith the area. Thanks

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Maybe 2 might end up replacing 32799/800 as spare buses? After all 32800 did have a serious engine problem which caused it not to partake in any duties for the rest of the season.

The intrigue absolutely continues but I'm sure FSW and OTB have tricks up their sleeve. Perhaps some of these new OT services might be in BOS territory now? I guess we'll not know for a while.


It would make sense for some of the B9s to work the LEC (which 37058 (B7) and 37729 (B9) already do) because the service is now running year round along with the Atlantic Coaster which also has a modern fleet of E400s with perhaps the B7TLs moved towards more lowkey seasonal duties or "tester" services such as Sunseeker, Lizard etc. Not to say the 02/52 reg couldn't operate year round but they've all been out of service since Late November (except for 32103 & 32179, of which the latter is on the FC right now).

I think it's been hinted towards in a previous tweet that Ensignbus are sorting out the LEC fleet, of which was revealed to be B9s a few days ago. There are also 9 exactly and there are 10 B7s on the LEC so I imagine that would probably allude to them being used there, unless the LEC now receives a frequency increase (or even the AC as well).

TBH, we could give ourselves a headache coming up with extensive and spurious ideas for these vehicles - an expanded Atlantic Coaster, an increased frequency on Lands End Coaster, an expanded Exmoor Coaster, or something completely new?

All the time, @On the Buses will be having a right old chuckle from his Bond villain lair under Carn Brea.... Personally, I'd hope to see a bit more at Minehead (not a prediction or speculating) and we will wait and see what gives. It's rarely dull with FSW!

 

[Goldfish62]

Maybe 2 might end up replacing 32799/800 as spare buses? After all 32800 did have a serious engine problem which caused it not to partake in any duties for the rest of the season.

The intrigue absolutely continues but I'm sure FSW and OTB have tricks up their sleeve. Perhaps some of these new OT services might be in BOS territory now? I guess we'll not know for a while.


It would make sense for some of the B9s to work the LEC (which 37058 (B7) and 37729 (B9) already do) because the service is now running year round along with the Atlantic Coaster which also has a modern fleet of E400s with perhaps the B7TLs moved towards more lowkey seasonal duties or "tester" services such as Sunseeker, Lizard etc. Not to say the 02/52 reg couldn't operate year round but they've all been out of service since Late November (except for 32103 & 32179, of which the latter is on the FC right now).

I think it's been hinted towards in a previous tweet that Ensignbus are sorting out the LEC fleet, of which was revealed to be B9s a few days ago. There are also 9 exactly and there are 10 B7s on the LEC so I imagine that would probably allude to them being used there, unless the LEC now receives a frequency increase (or even the AC as well).

Well, the LAND the publicised route "number" as per Traveline and bus stop timetables) is currently being operated mostly with E400s from route ATLA, together with the Geminis, although there seems to be a lot of inconsistency in respect of which journeys are covered by open toppers.

The Summer PVR on the LAND is eight, so nine replacement buses would make sense. In practice it's been extremely rare that all eight buses are open top. Commonly it's not unusual to have three of the workings covered by closed toppers. Newer buses would hopefully improve reliability in this respect.

@OntheBuses stated in his Omnibus Society talk that the section of the ATLA between Perranporth? and St Ives may be reduced this year due to poor loadings, although of course things may have moved on since then.

32179 dedicated to the FALM appears to be one of the most reliable buses in the fleet, but it's let down by its interior appearance. Hard plastic seats upstairs and extremely faded original seat moquette downstairs.

 

[vla50]

TBH, we could give ourselves a headache coming up with extensive and spurious ideas for these vehicles - an expanded Atlantic Coaster, an increased frequency on Lands End Coaster, an expanded Exmoor Coaster, or something completely new?

All the time, @On the Buses will be having a right old chuckle from his Bond villain lair under Carn Brea.... Personally, I'd hope to see a bit more at Minehead (not a prediction or speculating) and we will wait and see what gives. It's rarely dull with FSW!

A bit irrelevant here but you mention an expanded Exmoor Coaster...didn't the 300 used to continue further on down to Woody Bay from Lynmouth? Or am I thinking of something different?

I do speculate perhaps the Exmoor Coaster might become full O/T this year because IIRC the PVR was 3 and there are 3 open tops so perhaps a fourth one might be added as a spare (I know a single decker used to regularly do the Exmoor Coaster)? All in the realm of speculation.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

A bit irrelevant here but you mention an expanded Exmoor Coaster...didn't the 300 used to continue further on down to Woody Bay from Lynmouth? Or am I thinking of something different?

I do speculate perhaps the Exmoor Coaster might become full O/T this year because IIRC the PVR was 3 and there are 3 open tops so perhaps a fourth one might be added as a spare (I know a single decker used to regularly do the Exmoor Coaster)? All in the realm of speculation.

There were 2 OT boards on Exmoor. The third was a single deck, usually an e200 iirc.

However, one of the Scanias seemed a little more susceptible to defects and there is the run of the mill inspections too so a third was arrived as a spare, as there were a good few days where an OT board was run with a Solar

 

[On the Buses]

The first and last journeys of the day operated through from Donisford with an open top.
The open top pvr was 2.

The third vehicle required in service is a school single deck in fleet livery that operated the rest of the linked journeys from Donisford to Minehead.
The season started with 2 ope
n tops. Neither were unreliable but both were taken off to rebuild the breaking systems and then maintained throughout for the challenging downhill runs. (Before anyone suggests otherwise, the braking systems always functioned to standard - it’s just that the wear means we keep the systems ‘as new’ in order to prevent continual maintenance)

A third open top arrived during the course of the season to act as spare to cover maintenance (which is undertaken at Bridgwater). Until the third was available a Solar was used as necessary.