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Rishi Sunak and the Conservative Party.

brad465

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Most pensioners alive today did not live through the war never mind fight in it, though a sizable proportion seem to think they did.
German comedian Henning Wehn once joked that anyone who was a child during WWII was technically on the side of the Nazis, as they were a net drain on resources.

Elsewhere looks like the Foreign Secretary has more questions coming his way:


David Cameron's government knew the Post Office had ditched a secret investigation that might have helped wrongly accused postmasters prove their innocence, the BBC can reveal.
The 2016 investigation trawled 17 years of records to find out how often, and why, cash accounts on the Horizon IT system had been tampered with remotely.
Ministers were told an investigation was happening.
But after postmasters began legal action, it was suddenly stopped.
The secret investigation adds to evidence that the Post Office knew Horizon's creator, Fujitsu, could remotely fiddle with sub-postmaster's cash accounts - even as it argued in court, two years later, that it was impossible.
The revelations have prompted an accusation that the Post Office may have broken the law - and the government did nothing to prevent it. Paul Marshall, a barrister who represented some sub-postmasters, said: "On the face of it, it discloses a conspiracy by the Post Office to pervert the course of justice."

Senopathy Narenthiran, known as Naren, a convicted sub-postmaster from Ramsgate in Kent who joined the legal action, wiped away a tear as he learned about the information that might have helped his case.
"By knowing all this, why do we waste all our time in the prison and separate from our family? I don't know," he told the BBC. "I'm 69 years old - too old to go through all these things."
 
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DarloRich

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I assume the formerly conservative party will now lurch (hard) right in an attempt to fend off Reform. The recent by elections results were noticeable by a swing to Reform.
 

edwin_m

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I assume the formerly conservative party will now lurch (hard) right in an attempt to fend off Reform. The recent by elections results were noticeable by a swing to Reform.
There are several reasons why Wellingborough might (might!) be a high water mark for Reform:
  • By-election protest vote. People on the right might wish to express dissatisfaction with the Tories in a context where it won't put Labour into power.
  • Disgust at the behaviour of Bone and/or his partner being the Tory candidate to replace him.
  • Ben Habib is apparently one of the most prominent members of the party.
 

northwichcat

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Most pensioners in 2016 were, at best, young children when WW2 was being fought so would have no or only very little memory of the conflict. To have firm meaningful memories of the conflict you'd like need to have been born in the 1920s putting them around the mid-80s or older when the referendum took place.

Do note that rationing and national service continued for a long time after WWII. It also took until the 60s to build new houses to replaced bombed out ones. For someone who grew up in somewhere like Coventry in the 50s they would certainly have seen the effects of WWII first hand.

While I'm too young to remember that and was very young when the Berlin Wall came down, I do see the reunification of Germany as being an event in my lifetime, even if it was more than 40 years after the end of WWII.
 

brad465

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There are several reasons why Wellingborough might (might!) be a high water mark for Reform:
  • By-election protest vote. People on the right might wish to express dissatisfaction with the Tories in a context where it won't put Labour into power.
  • Disgust at the behaviour of Bone and/or his partner being the Tory candidate to replace him.
  • Ben Habib is apparently one of the most prominent members of the party.
This is also a lower result than what UKIP were achieving in by-elections in their prime. UKIP were getting over 20% in key by-elections, and even winning 2 seats where the incumbents defected to them.
 

jfollows

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Is another by-election in the pipeline? The standards committee has recommended a 35 day suspension for Scott Benton.

His appeal has just been rejected, so another by-election seems likely now.
Blackpool South MP Scott Benton, who was caught in a lobbying scandal, has had his appeal against a recommended 35-day suspension from Parliament dismissed by an independent panel.
(Unless he resigns the recall petition process takes 6 weeks, after which the by-election will happen if enough people approve the petition, in all likelihood meaning May 2nd. for the by-election along with all the other elections on the same day.)
EDIT In a statement later, Scott Benton implies that he’s not going to resign.
 
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SteveM70

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His appeal has just been rejected, so another by-election seems likely now.

(Unless he resigns the recall petition process takes 6 weeks, after which the by-election will happen if enough people approve the petition, in all likelihood meaning May 2nd. for the by-election along with all the other elections on the same day)

This has made me happier than any piece of political news for years.

I have experience of dealing with Benton when he was the Tory leader on Calderdale council, and I have to say he was a horrible, egotistical, patronising idiot.

He was promoted miles beyond his ability even then, but I suppose he ticked a few boxes when they were looking for prospective candidates for a general election
 

Typhoon

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Most pensioners alive today did not live through the war never mind fight in it, though a sizable proportion seem to think they did.
Some did live through the after-effects of the war though. My best friend live in one of a group of prefabs sited in a gap between houses in a long row which were close to a factory that had been converted for war-work; there were still other gaps which just had the remains of foundations or parts of walls where we used to play. Some houses still had air-raid shelters in the back garden where we would go in bad weather. There were also the people who still had signs of war wounds; my father had a burn down the side of one leg caused by an ejected shell casing, to which he applied a cream every day to ease the pain, but there were worse, much worse. Parents telling you not to stare at someone with a facial or limb disfigurement caused by enemy action. We knew there had been a war, and we knew some of the impact it had had. Much may depend on where you were; I could see a factory that made ship's turbines out of my bedroom window and passed a former munitions factory on my way to school. I would have thought that for those brought up in Hull, the East End of London, Coventry, Liverpool, Plymouth and similar places, it was even more obvious.
 

jfollows

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True, I recall going on a school trip to Liverpool 1970-73 and being surprised by the amount of war damage still visible then.
 

Mojo

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This is also a lower result than what UKIP were achieving in by-elections in their prime. UKIP were getting over 20% in key by-elections, and even winning 2 seats where the incumbents defected to them.
I'm of the belief that Reform, like Ukip before them, don't have to win any parliamentary seats to be successful, they just have to make the Conservatives lose by taking away enough votes from them that Labour or the Lib Dems win instead. This in turn means their policy objectives can be achieved because the Conservatives will inevitably change their approach to stem the losses.
 

Typhoon

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I'm of the belief that Reform, like Ukip before them, don't have to win any parliamentary seats to be successful, they just have to make the Conservatives lose by taking away enough votes from them that Labour or the Lib Dems win instead. This in turn means their policy objectives can be achieved because the Conservatives will inevitably change their approach to stem the losses.
... with the risk that more moderate Conservative voters will stay at home, or switch to another party. I don't know what things are like elsewhere but locally, several councils have seen a rise in the size of independent groups, who appear to have absolutely no problem with forming alliances with Labour, LibDem, Green (there may even be the occasional one with the Conservatives). These seem to be the successors of the Ratepayers, who tended to be quite conservative, but they are finding they can work just as well with other parties. Their supporters may be tempted to vote Labour/ LibDem/ Green if their candidate is one of the councillors they have been working with.
 

Silenos

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I'm of the belief that Reform, like Ukip before them, don't have to win any parliamentary seats to be successful, they just have to make the Conservatives lose by taking away enough votes from them that Labour or the Lib Dems win instead. This in turn means their policy objectives can be achieved because the Conservatives will inevitably change their approach to stem the losses.
Which is why, despite never having won a parliamentary seat, Farage is in some ways the most successful politician of our era, having remade the Tory party in his image.
 

brad465

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I'm of the belief that Reform, like Ukip before them, don't have to win any parliamentary seats to be successful, they just have to make the Conservatives lose by taking away enough votes from them that Labour or the Lib Dems win instead. This in turn means their policy objectives can be achieved because the Conservatives will inevitably change their approach to stem the losses.
Which debunks the notion FPTP prevents extremes getting power, the major parties just get hijacked by extremists instead (Momentum hijacking Labour is a left wing example of this).
 

Snow1964

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Seems PM Sunak is doing a tour of North Wales

Prime Minister Rishi Sunak is in North Wales today to see how the Levelling Up agenda is helping to spread opportunity, create jobs and revitalise local communities across North Wales.

And seems following has been included in press release (again)

A major upgrade and electrification of the North Wales Main Line – backed by an unprecedented £1 billion investment – will bring parts of North Wales within an hour of Manchester.

 

geoffk

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I assume the formerly conservative party will now lurch (hard) right in an attempt to fend off Reform.
Probably, and most of those who traditionally vote Tory will continue to do so, seemingly unaware that it's no longer the party of MacMillan, Home and Heath and hasn't been for some years. Meanwhile, the Reform candidate at Rochdale is a former Labour MP!
 

nw1

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Probably, and most of those who traditionally vote Tory will continue to do so, seemingly unaware that it's no longer the party of MacMillan, Home and Heath and hasn't been for some years. Meanwhile, the Reform candidate at Rochdale is a former Labour MP!
Not sure what to make of this particular character:
Danczuk, who has been the Labour MP for Rochdale since 2010, was suspended by his party following allegations that emerged in the Sun newspaper that he exchanged sexually explicit text messages with 17-year-old [name redacted].
Source: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/01/labour-mp-simon-danczuk-crisis-management-expenses

Interesting also that a former Labour MP is now standing as a candidate for an (IMO) hard-right party. Then there's Galloway as well who is another person I would argue as having hardline right-wing sympathies despite originally being from the left (his support of Farage and the Brexit Party in the 2019 European elections). An "interesting" cast of characters in this upcoming byelection, that's for certain; I certainly hope neither of these two individuals win.
 
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Lost property

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Probably, and most of those who traditionally vote Tory will continue to do so, seemingly unaware that it's no longer the party of MacMillan, Home and Heath and hasn't been for some years. Meanwhile, the Reform candidate at Rochdale is a former Labour MP!
I think traditional Tory voters are only too well aware the current version is "Tory" in name only and will be as glad to see the back of them as the rest of us.

As for Reform, I look forward to a candidate knocking on the door, thereafter "discussing" the lineage N.F / BNP (plus UKIP, the political wing of the BNP) EDL and now the latest rebranding name.
 

nw1

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Surely such strong feelings (at that time) are understandable in people who had suffered through the privations of WW2, had quite possibly lost family members through military service or bombing, and became fully aware after the war of the utter evil and depravity committed, not just by Germany's leaders but by its population in general?

The German population in general? Not sure about that.

Also what does Sunak mean when he says:

"We should never let extremists intimidate us in to changing the way in which parliament works," Mr Sunak said.


Who are the "extremists"? Lindsay Hoyle? The SNP? Labour?
 
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SteveM70

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As opposed to the extremists on the far right of the Conservative Party who have absolutely zero influence over policy, and who have never used any intimidatory tactics?
 

YorkshireBear

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As opposed to the extremists on the far right of the Conservative Party who have absolutely zero influence over policy, and who have never used any intimidatory tactics?
Indeed, Liz Truss' speech in America was an eye opener for sure!
 

Typhoon

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She has seriously lost the plot ! ( even if she had a grasp of it in the first place )!
I doubt her bank manager would agree. They are lapping it up over there (even if the MAGA crowd don't know who she is), doubtless she will be well paid. Book coming out soon so getting plenty of publicity. And all the while the people of South West Norfolk are unrepresented - she has not been seen in the House this month.
 

Silenos

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I doubt her bank manager would agree. They are lapping it up over there (even if the MAGA crowd don't know who she is), doubtless she will be well paid. Book coming out soon so getting plenty of publicity. And all the while the people of South West Norfolk are unrepresented - she has not been seen in the House this month.
It just goes to show that you can indeed fool some of the people all of the time.

But while mirroring extreme right-wing positions back to those who already hold them might guarantee a political audience, the thing I find really hard to understand is the desire of large companies and corporations to hear from the likes of Truss and Johnson as public speakers. These are people of no discernible talent who managed to bring one of the world’s major economies to its poorest state in a generation. What could they possibly have to teach a successful business?
 

Typhoon

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It just goes to show that you can indeed fool some of the people all of the time.

But while mirroring extreme right-wing positions back to those who already hold them might guarantee a political audience, the thing I find really hard to understand is the desire of large companies and corporations to hear from the likes of Truss and Johnson as public speakers. These are people of no discernible talent who managed to bring one of the world’s major economies to its poorest state in a generation. What could they possibly have to teach a successful business?
How not to do things?
 

Gloster

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A lot of it is the old paying off of debts. A PM, minister or MP does various things while they are in government or have influence that is to the advantage of a company, group or individual and in return the recipient or an associate will shove a well-paid consultancy or a ludicrously expensive speaking engagement towards the politician. It is all part of the mutually advantageous gravy-train of business and politics…or corruption, depending on your point of view. And the rest of us: we are just the mugs who pay for it all.
 

birchesgreen

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So, Liz Truss appears on Steve Bannon's TV show and doesn't say a word when he praises Tommy Robinson as a hero. Mind you it probably didn't register in her massive mind until about 3 days later.
 

nlogax

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How not to do things?

Unfortunately for us Chartwell likes a profit so that's not how they market Truss. Quoting their (presently locked) page touting her areas of expertise,
  • Economic growth and reform
  • The future of Conservatism
  • Geopolitics
  • International Trade (edit: Pork Markets?)
  • Female leadership and women’s empowerment

Knowing how much damage Truss did it's still astonishing to me that corporates and thinktanks continue to line up to receive the 'benefit of her wisdom and experience'. Each and every one of her speaking engagement customers is complicit in enabling this lunatic's post-No.10 political journey which I hope will eventually end with a years-overdue lightbulb moment of self-awareness and her disappearance from politics for good.
 

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