Transpennine Route Upgrade and Electrification updates

[Manutd1999]

I understand the frustration. Yes the works are complex, yes we need to minimise disruption and yes there are external (political) factors. But it still shouldn't take 8 years to upgrade 29km.....

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I understand the frustration. Yes the works are complex, yes we need to minimise disruption and yes there are external (political) factors. But it still shouldn't take 8 years to upgrade 29km.....

Government cash flow then?

 

[MatthewHutton]

Government cash flow then?

If spending more quickly meant you got the benefits quicker then that would be something you could persuade the treasury to do I am sure.

They are politicians. They want it done before the next election if possible.

If the industry doesn't challenge itself over time and cost enhancements will continue to wither on the vine.

This is precisely why the “cost per mile” people have been so persuasive.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

If spending more quickly meant you got the benefits quicker then that would be something you could persuade the treasury to do I am sure.

I doubt it. I really do.

They are politicians. They want it done before the next election if possible.

very true

 

[YorkshireBear]

At 11B not surprising it gives very little benefit.

No, he was referring to the electrification only plan. The current scheme obviously has huge benefits.

 

[CdBrux]

If spending more quickly meant you got the benefits quicker then that would be something you could persuade the treasury to do I am sure.

They are politicians. They want it done before the next election if possible.

Borrowing costs and market reaction are not overly favourable right now

 

[LittleAH]

Not really. There’s no justification of building NPR without HS2 and TRU will already deliver the increase in service as well as moderate journey time improvements.

Edit: apologies. This was in response to Andrewe

 

[nr758123]

not if we had a Huddersfield to Oldham Pennine Base Tunnel...

They are talking about the tunnel only going as far as Marsden, so all the trains would still use this section.

That presupposes that the announcement of a new line from Manchester to Marsden, as part of the Integrated Rail Plan (remember that?), was anything more than a press release intended to enable Grant Shapps, on the day that he cancelled HS2 eastern leg to Leeds, to go on regional TV and say that high speed rail would still be coming to Yorkshire.

 

[MatthewHutton]

That presupposes that the announcement of a new line from Manchester to Marsden, as part of the Integrated Rail Plan (remember that?), was anything more than a press release intended to enable Grant Shapps, on the day that he cancelled HS2 eastern leg to Leeds, to go on regional TV and say that high speed rail would still be coming to Yorkshire.

A faster line connecting Darlington and Newcastle could have value IMO - that section is currently not as fast as some of the others.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

The latest Sarah Bell video is out o.n YouTube featuring/focusing on Heaton Lodge Jct and Deighton. Mainly visible update but hopefully the notes below will help.
Deighton - 12/02/25
Huge earthworks continue
2 x 90m platforms currently being lengthened.
2 tracks being increased to 4 tracks. Whole corridor being widened.
2 slow tracks will have platforms but the 2 fast tracks being built will have no platforms allowing passing.

Heaton Lodge 13/02/25
Huge earthworks continue
0.8 mile curve of extra track will smooth out the curve
2 tracks being increased to 4 tracks. In a cutting to minimise visual impact.
One of biggest worksites on whole of TRU project. Grade separated junction was considered here but, in the end, went for Ravensthorpe at design stage to minimise environmental impact.
It is claimed 8 extra paths per hour will result!?? Wow

B1168 Colne Bridge 13/02/25
Replacement bridge under construction
Reinforced concrete abutments.

 

[superkev]

The latest Sarah Bell video is out on YouTube featuring/focusing on Heaton Lodge Jct and Deighton.

Excellent video ftom.Sarah as always.
K

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

The latest Sarah Bell video is out o.n YouTube featuring/focusing on Heaton Lodge Jct and Deighton. Mainly visible update but hopefully the notes below will help.
Deighton - 12/02/25
Huge earthworks continue
2 x 90m platforms currently being lengthened.
2 tracks being increased to 4 tracks. Whole corridor being widened.
2 slow tracks will have platforms but the 2 fast tracks being built will have no platforms allowing passing.

Heaton Lodge 13/02/25
Huge earthworks continue
0.8 mile curve of extra track will smooth out the curve
2 tracks being increased to 4 tracks. In a cutting to minimise visual impact.
One of biggest worksites on whole of TRU project. Grade separated junction was considered here but, in the end, went for Ravensthorpe at design stage to minimise environmental impact.
It is claimed 8 extra paths per hour will result!?? Wow

B1168 Colne Bridge 13/02/25
Replacement bridge under construction
Reinforced concrete abutments.

Good to see that even in todays heavily constrained world of men&machines not mixing with running trains that significant works are being progressed during normal operations.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Good to see that even in todays heavily constrained world of men&machines not mixing with running trains that significant works are being progressed during normal operations.

Indeed. What I was thinking too.

 

[YorkshireBear]

You only have to watch Sarah's videos to realise why TRU is not happened as quick as WCML north electrification! The size of those earthworks at Deighton.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

You only have to watch Sarah's videos to realise why TRU is not happened as quick as WCNL north electrification! The size of those earthworks at Deighton.

I agree. I love watching her videos as they are action packed and give a good overview of the sheer scale of some of the works. MML may result in more route mileage getting electrified but TPU project seems more immense somehow.

(btw what is WCNL please?)

 

[YorkshireBear]

I agree. I love watching her videos as they are action packed and give a good overview of the sheer scale of some of the works. MML may result in more route mileage getting electrified but TPU project seems more immense somehow.

(btw what is WCNL please?)

It's what people with fat fingers typing in a morning call the WCML...

 

[GRALISTAIR]

It's what people with fat fingers typing in a morning call the WCML...

Thanks lol! The Poplars link? does Western to North London line and is being electrified at a large cost per mile so I was truly wondering.

 

[zwk500]

Thanks lol! The Poplars link? does Western to North London line and is being electrified at a large cost per mile so I was truly wondering.

To be fair at a complexity per mile basis the Poplars project probably also scores quite high.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

There is yet another Sarah Bell video update on YouTube specifically about Mirfield station. To comply with forum rules, I will only post a link on Monday so that I can annotate it as it is very visual with not many words. But well worth a watch imho

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

You only have to watch Sarah's videos to realise why TRU is not happened as quick as WCML north electrification! The size of those earthworks at Deighton.

Majority of the big scale civil works is able to take place off the operating infrastructure which enables continuous working unlike the WCML which even with the lower safety standards of the day still needed possessions to deliver anything meaningful.

All the why costs remain eye wateringly high on railway projects we are unlikely to see any further enhancements works progressed.

 

[YorkshireBear]

Majority of the big scale civil works is able to take place off the operating infrastructure which enables continuous working unlike the WCML which even with the lower safety standards of the day still needed possessions to deliver anything meaningful.

All the why costs remain eye wateringly high on railway projects we are unlikely to see any further enhancements works progressed.

That doesn't bring down the cost that much. Adjacent Line Open work is still expensive. As is making sure your earthworks work doesn't affect line speed trains. It is not Greenfield construction by any measure.

 

[edwin_m]

Thanks lol! The Poplars link? does Western to North London line and is being electrified at a large cost per mile so I was truly wondering.

To be fair at a complexity per mile basis the Poplars project probably also scores quite high.

For a start it's very short so the fixed costs of running a project can't be spread out over a larger area. It also needs to work round several other electrification and track upgrades in close proximity, some affecting other parts of the same structures.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

That doesn't bring down the cost that much. Adjacent Line Open work is still expensive. As is making sure your earthworks work doesn't affect line speed trains. It is not Greenfield construction by any measure.

This is high street environment not pure adjacent line open working which im not sure NR really supports these days.

 

[edwin_m]

It is not Greenfield construction by any measure.

When they start on Greenfield it won't be greenfield construction either

 

[Tim_UK]

The size of those earthworks at Deighton.

They are huge.
And consider you have houses on 2 sides. And there is the old midland line through the site too - now the Greenway cycle track. The whole line of the old midland route used as a linear tip in the past. There will be all kinds of stuff dug up.



The Heaton Lodge site is also huge.

 

[Revaulx]

I can understand why the earthworks at Heaton Lodge and Ravensthorpe are huge as they are for either all-new or significantly widened trackbeds.

Why the need at Deighton though? It was always four track there. Is it because in the four track days there wasn’t a station on the main line?

 

[Narrowgauge725]

I can understand why the earthworks at Heaton Lodge and Ravensthorpe are huge as they are for either all-new or significantly widened trackbeds.

Why the need at Deighton though? It was always four track there. Is it because in the four track days there wasn’t a station on the main line?

When there were four tracks Deighton Station wasn’t on the mainline it was on the Kirkburton branch, so they need to get the station off the trackbed

 

[61653 HTAFC]

When there were four tracks Deighton Station wasn’t on the mainline it was on the Kirkheaton branch, so they need to get the station off the trackbed

It was the Kirkburton branch, though it did call at Kirkheaton. The junction for that branch was also to the left right (in the Leeds direction) whereas the slow lines in the new layout will be to the right left (again in the direction of Leeds).

 

[Meerkat]

It was the Kirkburton branch, though it did call at Kirkheaton. The junction for that branch was also to the left (in the Leeds direction) whereas the slow lines in the new layout will be to the right (again in the direction of Leeds).

Slow lines will be on the left/west side. Fast lines to the east so they can cut the corner off at Heaton Lodge.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Slow lines will be on the left/west side. Fast lines to the east so they can cut the corner off at Heaton Lodge.

Complete brainfart on my part there with left/right! Original post will be corrected.