I must say, as someone whose retirement age has twice been increased I find this the oddest part of that particular story. There was constant reporting at the time of the fact that pension ages were increasing, and several communications from the Government (I can’t remember now whether they were letters or emails) telling me which government web page to go to in order to check my new retirement date and calculated State pension.
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Rishi Sunak and the Conservative Party.
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WelshBluebird
Established Member
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Those complaining about the flag, were you also complaining about the GB 2012 Olympic kits? Do you feel the same about the altered Scottish and Brazilian flags that have been on their kits before? What about the altered coloured versions of flags that are incredibly common at football matches (I've seen blue and yellow wales flags, white and black england flags, mostly all dark navy Union Jack's - its incredibly common to see). It's all a storm in a teacup, and given changing colours like this has been common for ages, I really fail to see why its an issue now!
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It’s also been pointed out that at recent Tory party conferences and leadership elections they used versions of the union flag in shades of blue, rather than red white and blue.
I’m sure Sunak complained about this at the time but it just didn’t get reported.
Oh, look, a flying pig……
I’m sure Sunak complained about this at the time but it just didn’t get reported.
Oh, look, a flying pig……
It appears that the inquiry decided the communication wasn't adequate and that the government knew this many years ago.
Which they do seem to have some point about from around 2005 onwards (ish) it would seem that DWP just stopped thinking about it in any concrete way. Which is hardly surprising, whilst the Home Office is probably the most dysfunctional government department the DWP are not far behind. So I do have some sympathy with them, however, at the same time if these women were relying on their state pension to make up a significant portion of their income from when they turned 60 it seems staggeringly complacent to, seemingly, not do any checking about their state pension entitlement (which would flag up the upcoming age issue to them) until, seemingly, they were months/weeks away from turning 60.
The change wasn't hidden away from them, the Pensions Act of 1995 provided for the change to be rolled out between 2010 and 2020 and the Parliamentary and Health Service Ombudsman themselves determined that until 2005 DWP communication was of an acceptable standard. So it wasn't a state secret! Now again, I do have some sympathy with those that got caught up in the acceleration following the Pensions Act 2011 which saw the equalisation to 65 brought forward to the end of 2018 and then increased to for everyone by the end of 2020. But again, none of this was secrete!
At some point there has to be some level of personal responsibility for making retirement plans. I think the DWP, across multiple administrations, have not done a good job informing people of the changes. The critical failure seems to be in 2005 when they knew that many women weren't aware of the changes and then didn't really do very much until very late in 2007 early 2008 which of course would only be a couple of years from when the increases would kick-in. But, at the same time I'm not sure that the Government owes compensation to these women either, particularly not when the compensation will need to be funded predominantly by working age taxpayers who are facing state pension ages far in excess of what many of these women had. My state pension age is 68 (full expecting that to rise further). Older even than many men let alone women from bygone years!
I know mine has gone up from what it was too (also to 68). I'm not so bothered as I'm "young" for my age and will probably still be fit to work at 67, but even still, it's gone up from what I would have been "promised" at 18.
Quite! It's bit tricky to follow as the Pensions Act 1995 has now been amended so many times that it's a rabbit warren of citations (it's beyond time that the way that legislation is drafted was reformed to make it easier to read once it starts getting amended) however it would seem that pension age of 68 for those born after 5 April 1978 was introduced by the Pensions Act 2007 so whilst I was not quite 18 yet I wasn't that far away. Now, admittedly I had (and still have) decades to get used to the idea of getting a state pension at 68 (more like at least 70 I bet in reality) but even within my lifetime already my state pension age has increased. Such is life!
Many WASPI women will go on the New State Pension, which is now over £50 more than Basic State Pension so they will we paid more over less time than those who retired before the change, there will be winners and losers. As you say, change happens.
It's not just those born after 5/4/78 though; I was born before that date yet mine is 68, so obviously it changed (again?) more recently than that.
There's been Pensions Acts in 2011 and 2014 (at least) as well so it may well have been in there. As I say, the Pensions Act 1995 has been amended so many times by so many different acts it's a nightmare to follow.
birchesgreen
Established Member
Lets see if life expectancy drops then the retirement age does too, probably do your own life expectency bad to hold your breath for that!
DustyBin
Established Member
It’s very common where I live to see black and white union flags, and I’ve seen orange (sorry tangerine!) ones in Blackpool. I’m sure there are countless others, and their “purpose” is clear. My reaction to the 2012 Team GB kit was along the lines of “Why have they used the wrong colours? Seems a bit odd but whatever…”.
It is indeed a storm in a teacup, and I suspect Nike are thinking there’s no such thing as bad publicity(!). The only “interesting” part of the story to me is the criticism Starmer has received from some for making a valid point, in what were pretty much passing comments.
Sorry to snip what was a very informative post, but I think this is an important point.
Realistically I probably have another 25 years of work to (ahem) look forward to, but I won’t be entitled to a state pension at that point. In fact, I’ve basically discounted the state pension from my retirement plans as I think there’s a realistic chance it either won’t exist, or (more likely) will be means-tested. Whilst this feels somewhat unfair, ultimately I consider myself fortunate…
Speaking from experience, I think it’s often difficult to get someone in their early 20s to start planning for retirement, but the importance of it needs better communicating. Unless they’re in a position to play catch-up later on, which the majority won’t be based on average earnings, retirement has the potential to be pretty grim for those who don’t start planning early.
Now that really is unfair. I could cope with raising the retirement age to even 70, but to completely withdraw the state pension to me is outrageous.
Much more worthy of mass protest than members of an already very privileged generation retrospectively attempting to claim billions from the government...
DustyBin
Established Member
I agree, but I’m preparing for the worst. A blanket withdrawal within the next 25 or even 30 years would be unworkable in truth, but some form of means testing is entirely realistic in my opinion.
Partly because many are putting money aside for a deposit on a property and, maybe, worrying about their student loans. I recently heard a radio programme in which some recent graduates in decent jobs were saying that their student loans were increasing even though they had been paying off from the moment they entered employment.
Thanks to the guise of anonymity I can say that I am making little provision for the generation after me (ie the middle aged), concentrating on the teens and twenties. They are really going to have it tough. And when I was growing up there were no expectations - dad had a motorbike and side car, did all the decorating, including building work, holidays in Bognor (Regis), hand-me-downs, jumble sales, when we got a telly - second hand - the screen was smaller than my monitor. No different to neighbours.
We need to start getting more realistic about what we can and can't do, both as individuals and as a country. One reason why I have sympathy for Starmer's stance.
Italicised - good for you, others need to do the same. Underlined - work on some form of tapered pension, so everyone gets something but only the worst off get the lot. The problem with that is that it discourages saving, what you (and I) have done. Fortunately, a dilemma I don't have to resolve.
Presumably because your neighbours were pretty much your only yardstick of what normal is. Nowadays umpteen commercial channels and the rise of the internet means everyone knows everything about what they could have
Exactly! Except I might have written :
Even schools are at it - residentials abroad for instance. More money out of the family budget. You've got two or three kids ...
317 forever
Established Member
It has tended to be safer Conservative as Kensington & Chelsea, rather than just Kensington which includes poorer Labour-leaning areas.
The high school I went to had a skiing trip every year and it was always to France or Switzerland rather than Andorra etc. Every year we got given a letter about it to take home to our parents and every year I put it in the bin straight away because there was no way my parents would have been able to afford it.
So elitist nonsense did happen occasionally even in the 1980s
birchesgreen
Established Member
In the 80s i went to a mediocre comprehensive, we had Paris trips - i went on one, the hotel caught fire which was uncool. Highlight though was a CCCP trip which i went on. Overnight sleeper train from Leningrad to Moscow was included so that was pretty cool, and it meant the first aeroplane i ever flew on was a Tupolev Tu-154. 
You are right. I used to take part in, and sometimes lead, residentials when I was a teacher. We left on a coach after a pep talk from a Deputy Head (and making sure we had everything) after nine, we were at the hostel and unpacked ready for lunch by midday. Few of the pupils could have pointed to the place on a map before signing up, even though it was almost on the doorstep. There are some great areas pupils can be taken to without crossing borders where they can learn about the landscape, history of the area -including industry, integrating aspects of biology, get plenty of exercise. Not a great deal of cost (at the time), those on free school meals got a discounted rate. In fact those from less well off families were often first to put themselves forward, simply because they often didn't have regular holidays.
These days they're likely to be a biodegradable cellulose or starch film, rather than plastic.
Plastic is defined by the properties of the material, not the source it is made from.
Yes, that is technically correct (which is the best kind of correct), but in colloquial use "plastic" is synonymous with "petrochemical derived material".
I suspect a term such as 'petroplastic' will start to come into common use.
Scott Benson has finally resigned today, Monday 25 March. Not waiting for the recall petition, but having the hassle and the cost of setting it up in the first place.His appeal has just been rejected, so another by-election seems likely now.
Scott Benton: Lobbying scandal MP loses suspension appeal
The decision could pave the way for a by-election in MP Scott Benton's Blackpool South constituency.www.bbc.co.uk
(Unless he resigns the recall petition process takes 6 weeks, after which the by-election will happen if enough people approve the petition, in all likelihood meaning May 2nd. for the by-election along with all the other elections on the same day.)
EDIT In a statement later, Scott Benton implies that he’s not going to resign.
If a writ for a by-election is moved hastily, it might just be possible to have it on 2 May if wanted; that's 27 working days from now I think and I also believe the minimum number of days between the writ and the election to be 21 days.
DynamicSpirit
Established Member
The BBC report says that the writ will be moved quickly. And I can imagine the Tories would prefer to have the election on the same day as the local elections so they minimise the bad publicity by only having one day of the headlines being all about awful (for them) election results.
BBC said:
(https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-68658896)
Happened in the 70s too - my high school did a Med. cruise (1972?). The letter went straight in the bin too. Most of the kids who did go were 'only' children (including one of my friends), but I didn't feel bad about it - it knew it was out of the question. Luckily I had adventurous parents (my Dad worked for BR) and had already been on several long foreign trips by train. (far more interesting than a boat!)
Thank you - the presumption is that Scott Benson was leaned on by the Tories to enable the by-election to happen on May 2nd. rather than later, for the reason you suggest. Presumably he was offered "something", it'll be interesting to know what in due course.
Richard Scott
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Why is it elitist? Loads of schools offer trips of varying sorts. Sometimes it's an opportunity for a family to give their child an experience like this as they are able to scrape money together for the child to go but not whole family. Therefore the child is able to have experience that they wouldn't have had. Someone I know said that they could allow each of their two children a chance to go abroad because of school trips, something they couldn't afford if the three of them went together.
Nowadays a school if a child wishes to go who cannot afford a trip the school will often assist financially in some form. Income cases the whole trip may be funded (and, yes, this does happen in state schools).
Just because one person can't go does that mean no-one should have the opportunity?