Manchester - Liverpool Electrification

LNW-GW Joint · 12 Apr 2015

Wasn't there a post on here over the Easter blockade that had a Lime St-Oxford Road stopper for a day or two instead of the Airport/Victoria services?
Not sure if it was electric though.
It's still a little odd that the Warrington BQ service has not seen 319s yet.

RailUK Forums

156441 · 12 Apr 2015

LDECRexile said:
In essence, there are a several unknowns here, notably:

1. when will ORR give the OK into Man Vic?
2. when will ORR give the OK along the Wigan Branch?
3. when will the right number of crew on the right lines be trained?
4. when will the right number of EMUs be available?
5. of the services which could use EMUs, which are getting priority?

I can answer some of your questions with a degree of certainty as I currently work with one of the electrification managers for Northern.

1. Not yet applied for. Hence the reason MCV will not be going live in May.
MENTOR and then a unit test over all lines needs to happen before ORR approval can be applied for.
2. Application submitted. Awaiting approval.
3. Lime Street training heavily advanced, Wigan and Vic men also going well. (The internal April rota/Link changes moved a lot of work internally in preparation for some lines going Electric in May.)
4. Enough units available for Wigan extension now. With regards to other lines it's still an unknown.
5. Wigan is the priority.

Thomas6187 · 12 Apr 2015

LNW-GW Joint said:
Wasn't there a post on here over the Easter blockade that had a Lime St-Oxford Road stopper for a day or two instead of the Airport/Victoria services?

Two Chat Moss stopping service over Easter ran as a 319. The 08:00ish departure on Friday, and the 07:35 departure from Manchester Airport on Monday

LDECRexile · 12 Apr 2015

156441 said:
I can answer some of your questions with a degree of certainty as I currently work with one of the electrification managers for Northern.

1. Not yet applied for. Hence the reason MCV will not be going live in May.
MENTOR and then a unit test over all lines needs to happen before ORR approval can be applied for.
2. Application submitted. Awaiting approval.
3. Lime Street training heavily advanced, Wigan and Vic men also going well. (The internal April rota/Link changes moved a lot of work internally in preparation for some lines going Electric in May.)
4. Enough units available for Wigan extension now. With regards to other lines it's still an unknown.
5. Wigan is the priority.

Superb, clear, solid information, warm thanks.

Dave
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

LNW-GW Joint said:
Wasn't there a post on here over the Easter blockade that had a Lime St-Oxford Road stopper for a day or two instead of the Airport/Victoria services?
Not sure if it was electric though.
It's still a little odd that the Warrington BQ service has not seen 319s yet.

I'd not noticed the temporary stopper, very welcome subsequent post has confirmed it was run by a 319 on some occasions.

Why is it odd that 319s haven't operated the Warrington BQ service?

Kind regards

Dave

LNW-GW Joint · 12 Apr 2015

LDECRexile said:
Why is it odd that 319s haven't operated the Warrington BQ service?

Well, I presume that the crews are mostly Lime St based and therefore trained on 319s.
They could have worked to Warrington and back in the long layover time of one of the "Airport" trains at Lime St.
I know it changed last week to reduce the layover.

Cotty · 12 Apr 2015

How long does ORR approval normally take? I recall that the Liverpool to MIA service was up and running only a week or two after test trains ran.

Please take this question in good faith I intend no criticism of those involved with regulation or the electrification project

snowball · 12 Apr 2015

156441 said:
1. Not yet applied for. Hence the reason MCV will not be going live in May.

I was inclined not to attach too much weight to what the man at Earlestown said, but now we have it clearly.

Is this related to the signal sighting issues west of Victoria that were mentioned (before Christmas I think)?

Class 170101 · 12 Apr 2015

Surely May (or even before) is going to be critical?

319s going whether the current crewing capability will take them is surely going to be needed to firstly release 156s for TPE crew training from Northern and secondly to maintain services for both TPE and Northern post May timetable change.

samj · 12 Apr 2015

Am planning a week up North between 8-12 June. Will the 319s be used on any other routes except LIV-MIA then does anyone know? Thanks in advance.

LDECRexile · 12 Apr 2015

samj said:
Am planning a week up North between 8-12 June. Will the 319s be used on any other routes except LIV-MIA then does anyone know? Thanks in advance.

Please see post #4592 at the top of this page where the latest we have comes from the horse's mouth.

edwin_m · 12 Apr 2015

Picking up a topic way back up this or another thread, is it still planned to divert the TPE Scottish workings into MCV for a period, and if so when?

Cotty · 12 Apr 2015

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U21765/2015/04/15/advanced

Is this a possible MENTOR visit to Manchester Victoria?

Apologies if someone else already notes this before my post is posted. My activity on this site seems to be running a little late compared to most.

Also apologies if I am just plain wrong!

Bevan Price · 12 Apr 2015

I hope they manage to get most Lime St. - Wigan / Man. Vic services worked by 319s before the 3 Cunard "Queen" liners visit Liverpool from 24 to 26 May. Previous experience during major events in Liverpool is that 2 car Pacers & Sprinters are totally indaequate.

WatcherZero · 12 Apr 2015

That event was flagged up by Northern as something that will require extra capacity to be laid on when they made their plans for the year ahead last year.

nw-sparks · 13 Apr 2015

Bevan Price said:
I hope they manage to get most Lime St. - Wigan / Man. Vic services worked by 319s before the 3 Cunard "Queen" liners visit Liverpool from 24 to 26 May. Previous experience during major events in Liverpool is that 2 car Pacers & Sprinters are totally indaequate.

And as if by magic, a number of additional services to St Helens and Earlestown on the Sunday and Monday appeared in the timetable this morning. They are timed for DMUs, but that doesn't prevent a 319 being used.

QueensCurve · 13 Apr 2015

snowball said:
I think by Wigan he meant Liverpool to Wigan NW via Huyton and St Helens Central.

There are no current plans to electrify Wigan Wallgate station. This is assumed to be because of the low bridge carrying Wallgate (the A49 road after which the station is named). Bolton to Wigan will be electrified within 2 or 3 years but the wires will only connect to Wigan NW.

I can't help but think an opportunity has been lost to concentrate all services on Wigan North Western. The station entrances are after all just across the road from each other.

Unfortunately, the place were you would put the platforms for the Southport/Kirkby line is now occupied by the multi-story car park.

Concentrating all services on North Western wouldn't of course help with electrification, but might be both cost-saving and advantageous to passengers.

snowball · 13 Apr 2015

QueensCurve said:
I can't help but think an opportunity has been lost to concentrate all services on Wigan North Western. The station entrances are after all just across the road from each other.

Unfortunately, the place were you would put the platforms for the Southport/Kirkby line is now occupied by the multi-story car park.

I'm not very familiar with Wigan. I've been there a few times by road and once caught a train at North Western. Where is this car park, please?

Joseph_Locke · 13 Apr 2015

snowball said:
I'm not very familiar with Wigan. I've been there a few times by road and once caught a train at North Western. Where is this car park, please?

linky

LDECRexile · 13 Apr 2015

A member - 'Cotty' - is experiencing difficulty posting so rather than give up he's taken the trouble to post me this link:

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U21765/2015/04/15/advanced

asking if I reckon it's a series of MENTOR runs through Man Vic.

It looks that way to me, what does anyone else think?

Good spot Sir, thank you.

DJH1971 · 13 Apr 2015

LDECRexile said:
A member - 'Cotty' - is experiencing difficulty posting so rather than give up he's taken the trouble to post me this link:

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U21765/2015/04/15/advanced

asking if I reckon it's a series of MENTOR runs through Man Vic.

It looks that way to me, what does anyone else think?

Good spot Sir, thank you.

Sounds like Mentor to me!

LNW-GW Joint · 13 Apr 2015

LDECRexile said:
A member - 'Cotty' - is experiencing difficulty posting so rather than give up he's taken the trouble to post me this link:
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U21765/2015/04/15/advanced
asking if I reckon it's a series of MENTOR runs through Man Vic.
It looks that way to me, what does anyone else think?
Good spot Sir, thank you.

Not many wires around Rose Hill Marple...
Does it test other things?

Class 170101 · 13 Apr 2015

I would have said it might be the yellow Class 150

LDECRexile · 13 Apr 2015

Class 170101 said:
I would have said it might be the yellow Class 150

What does that do?

Bevan Price · 13 Apr 2015

nw-sparks said:
And as if by magic, a number of additional services to St Helens and Earlestown on the Sunday and Monday appeared in the timetable this morning. They are timed for DMUs, but that doesn't prevent a 319 being used.

Unless we get another visit from the wiring team, those shown to terminate at St. Helens Central can only be dmu - the crossover is still unwired.

TOCDriver · 13 Apr 2015

Geeves said:
Plenty of orange man action on the OHLE at Victoria today, I think this weekend will most certainly see it finished. Also we have some nice new LED signal heads at the west end and Manchester North SC is now closed/on the run down. So long Man North!

Yes, that wood hut will be missed. Those Signals will now be controlled by the Man North and Man Central Workstations at the ROC. Any idea as to the border limits of these two workstations, Geeves?

LDECRexile · 14 Apr 2015

I have received several photos from Joe Callaghan of Kearsley, most of which relate to the Blackpool-Manchester thread and photo album.

One of them is of Wigan NW, so I've added it to Joe's album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157651953947345/

and to the Liverpool-Manchester Combined Volume here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

In both cases the Photo is number 0652m

Thank you Joe

Geeves · 14 Apr 2015

A few posters went up in the signing on point at Vic today but the "treated as live" date section is still covered for the time being.

Toc as far as I know the sections on each workstation mimic the old split on the NX Panel, one half controls to just beyond the Rocdale Road bridge and the second work station controls the depot and the various triangular junctions including the line down to Ashburys. I still get Man North Signaller west panel when I ring them up untill they remember where they now are

nw-sparks · 14 Apr 2015

Bevan Price said:
Unless we get another visit from the wiring team, those shown to terminate at St. Helens Central can only be dmu - the crossover is still unwired.

Good point! The crossover at Ravenhead is wired but that's not really useful for this purpose.

DarloRich · 14 Apr 2015

LDECRexile said:
A member - 'Cotty' - is experiencing difficulty posting so rather than give up he's taken the trouble to post me this link:

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/U21765/2015/04/15/advanced

asking if I reckon it's a series of MENTOR runs through Man Vic.

It looks that way to me, what does anyone else think?

Good spot Sir, thank you.

It wont be MENTOR as the service runs to New Mills - it will be the 950 i should think. It didn't run anyway

Cotty · 14 Apr 2015

DarloRich said:
It wont be MENTOR as the service runs to New Mills - it will be the 950 i should think. It didn't run anyway

Is the 950 the track assessor? It's due to run on Wednesday according to the link.

Manchester - Liverpool Electrification

Veteran Member

RailUK Forums

Member

Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Veteran Member

Established Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Established Member

Established Member

Member

Veteran Member

Member