Anglesey-Cardiff Air Service Scrapped - Money to be spent on land-based North-South Links

[LNW-GW Joint]

The Welsh government has scrapped the Valley-Cardiff air service, in favour of improving land-based north-south links.
The air service has not operated since the start of the Covid emergency, but will not resume.

Eastern Airways: Cardiff-Anglesey air link scrapped

The publicly funded flights will not resume after two-year suspension in pandemic, ministers say.

www.bbc.co.uk

Publicly funded flights between Cardiff and Anglesey will not resume after a two-year suspension in the pandemic.
The Welsh government said the service could no longer be justified economically and environmentally.
The up to £2.9m a year spent on funding the flights will be diverted to improving north Wales public transport.
Deputy Minister for Climate Change Lee Waters said the decision would "benefit more people" and help Wales reach its climate change goals.
(snip)
The Welsh government said it would spend the funding it usually offered the air-link on accelerating work on north-south connectivity within the North Wales Metro programme.
This meant faster progress on the Holyhead Masterplan, Bangor Gateway and Wrexham Gateway schemes and new stations being developed for Broughton and Greenfields, it said.
Work to improve rail journey times between Holyhead and Cardiff and improve integration with other sustainable ways of travelling along the route will also be fast-tracked

 

[thenorthern]

Good, it was a waste of money and it was never going to work. The demand just wasn't there and it should never have started in the first place.

 

[Gloster]

I heard that Valley bought the departure board, or at least part of it, from Manchester Airport. It has space for twenty departures: Valley had one a day.

 

[D821]

What could 2.9m be used for to improve the rail links? More trains or are there infrastructure improvements they could make to shorten the journey times?

 

[Bletchleyite]

What could 2.9m be used for to improve the rail links? More trains or are there infrastructure improvements they could make to shorten the journey times?

It's not a huge sum, but one option would be more Mk4s to allow all Cardiff-Holyhead services to be so formed (and release some 197s which could be used to allow the 230s to be binned off). Get their name on them now or they won't get them. Or simply order more 197s.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

What could 2.9m be used for to improve the rail links? More trains or are there infrastructure improvements they could make to shorten the journey times?

There are already plans to improve North Wales main line infrastructure, and to build some new stations (Broughton is mentioned in the announcement).
Part of the planning is to add a new island platform P8 at Chester for Merseyrail use, to free up P7 for more TfW services.
There's to be a North Wales Metro as well, but that is mainly buses I think.
NR has plans to extend resignalling from Llandudno Jn to Llandudno and towards Holyhead (controlled from Cardiff), but that will be a lot more than £2.9m.
There are still some long signal sections on the main line, notably on Anglesey.

 

[lachlan]

Excellent news. I wwonder how the journey times could be improved. Given the large number of stops on the train services, an express service could presumably cut the journey time quite a bit

 

[Mikey C]

A shame as I always planned to try that flight, even if it was nonsense.

The reality is that there is little demand for travel from Anglesey to Cardiff

 

[The Planner]

£2.9 million a year over the life of an intervention adds up though.

 

[Geeves]

I left two friends to catch the flight at Cardiff Airport, a bus ride for me back to town, then a train from Cardiff to Chester and them having to come along the NW Coast, I beat them. They were the only passengers on board said flight.

 

[Reliablebeam]

The money saved won't touch the sides of improving the train 'service' on that line! A true pit of the abyss, line of misery - when I was younger, actually enjoyed a decent service. A complete rethink needed. Letting the Welsh government dig their claws into North Wales coast rail services was the worst thing that ever happened to that line, and I say that as someone who has voted Plaid when I lived in Wales.

Surprised the services were so badly used, back in my days of living in south Wales they seemed very popular with civil service/business crowd. Maybe they have all gone remote...

 

[headshot119]

I wonder if £2.9 million is enough to recommission Ty Croes as a block post instead of a crossing box and shorten the longest block section on the route.

 

[JonathanH]

Presumably £2.9m a year doesn't even approach the annual subsidy needed to run the existing service on the North Wales coast, let alone make improvements?

 

[mmh]

Presumably £2.9m a year doesn't even approach the annual subsidy needed to run the existing service on the North Wales coast, let alone make improvements?

Exactly, it will have zero impact at all. It might fund some new advertising or a few consultants for a couple of years. It's greenwash nonsense. I was never in favour of it, but the reasoning behind getting rid of it is rubbish as well.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

A shame as I always planned to try that flight, even if it was nonsense.

The reality is that there is little demand for travel from Anglesey to Cardiff

I am not the only one who takes flights well - just because! I did Ryanair Blackpool to Dublin while it existed and also Dublin to Galway. Anyway, back OT - I think short haul flights that lose money where there are reasonable alternative arrangements should be curtailed/cancelled so I am glad this has happened. As has already been pointed out though, the money saved will be a drop in the ocean as to what is required for improving travel in Wales.

 

[mmh]

I am not the only one who takes flights well - just because! I did Ryanair Blackpool to Dublin while it existed and also Dublin to Galway. Anyway, back OT - I think short haul flights that lose money where there are reasonable alternative arrangements should be curtailed/cancelled so I am glad this has happened. As has already been pointed out though, the money saved will be a drop in the ocean as to what is required for improving travel in Wales.

It was a reasonable idea, to be fair. It shouldn't have gone to Valley though. If it had been to Broughton instead it may well have been more successful and the narrative that it was solely a sop to Plaid Cymru reduced somewhat.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The money saved won't touch the sides of improving the train 'service' on that line! A true pit of the abyss, line of misery - when I was younger, actually enjoyed a decent service. A complete rethink needed. Letting the Welsh government dig their claws into North Wales coast rail services was the worst thing that ever happened to that line, and I say that as someone who has voted Plaid when I lived in Wales.

Surprised the services were so badly used, back in my days of living in south Wales they seemed very popular with civil service/business crowd. Maybe they have all gone remote...

While I think it needs to be clockface and isn't, I don't think the timetable is that bad. It would be nice to have Brum via Stafford back, but it can't be pathed until post HS2. The main problem is the chronic shortage of rolling stock, which the coming of the 197s should remedy.

As for that specific journey, though, hardly anyone actually wants to make it. North Wales associates to Liverpool, Manchester and Chester, not Cardiff.

 

[mmh]

As for that specific journey, though, hardly anyone actually wants to make it. North Wales associates to Liverpool, Manchester and Chester, not Cardiff.

You frequently say this, and to some extent I agree with you, but I suspect you've never travelled on the day before or after an international at Cardiff. Those sorts of things aside, there is more traffic north south than there used to be. It doesn't need to be high frequency, a two hourly service would do. It just needs to be more than a 150 or a pair of 153s. As you said earlier, what they should do is take up enough Mk4s to make every North South service 4 or 5 coach. Problem solved, quickly.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You frequently say this, and to some extent I agree with you, but I suspect you've never travelled on the day before or after an international at Cardiff. Those sorts of things aside, there is more traffic north south than there used to be. It doesn't need to be high frequency, a two hourly service would do. It just needs to be more than a 150 or a pair of 153s. As you said earlier, what they should do is take up enough Mk4s to make every North South service 4 or 5 coach. Problem solved, quickly.

Yes, true. My main reason for suggesting it was that it'd finally (well, at least since the Mk1/Mk2 formations of the 90s finished) mean enough capacity on the Coast for tourists. They could of course reshuffle things for major events in Cardiff - I know it's a very different operation but Chiltern manage it for Wembley, and I'm sure Arriva did run "ruggexes" on occasions.

If they did that, they could then have enough 2-car 197s spare to bin off the 230s (a decision us on the Marston Vale know nobody would regret) and maybe a couple more units spare for Cambrian strengthening?

 

[Runningaround]

The money saved won't touch the sides of improving the train 'service' on that line! A true pit of the abyss, line of misery - when I was younger, actually enjoyed a decent service. A complete rethink needed. Letting the Welsh government dig their claws into North Wales coast rail services was the worst thing that ever happened to that line, and I say that as someone who has voted Plaid when I lived in Wales.

Surprised the services were so badly used, back in my days of living in south Wales they seemed very popular with civil service/business crowd. Maybe they have all gone remote...

Plaid have never run the rail service in Wales, it's been Labour ever since devolution.

 

[The Planner]

If its £2.9 million a year then you may end up with a larger scheme based on its payback time. Id count out signalling changes though.

 

[Runningaround]

You frequently say this, and to some extent I agree with you, but I suspect you've never travelled on the day before or after an international at Cardiff. Those sorts of things aside, there is more traffic north south than there used to be. It doesn't need to be high frequency, a two hourly service would do. It just needs to be more than a 150 or a pair of 153s. As you said earlier, what they should do is take up enough Mk4s to make every North South service 4 or 5 coach. Problem solved, quickly.

Correct and it's growing significantly and would have probably surpassed the new fleets capacity without covid, it'll be pretty close even with it.
Its an outdated claim that Wales shouldn't bother improving North - Mid - South transport links as we always head east to England anyhow, it's what opponents use to deter any re-opening of Aberystwyth - Carmarthen, who do not see the level of traffic on the roads. Workers, students and day trippers are increasingly heading North to South by enlarge due to Cardiff and Swansea's growth.

 

[Bald Rick]

Presumably £2.9m a year doesn't even approach the annual subsidy needed to run the existing service on the North Wales coast, let alone make improvements?

I’d be surprised if £2.9m a year covers the annual subsidy of the two loco hauled diagrams currently on the South to North Wales circuit.

 

[John Luxton]

A shame as I always planned to try that flight, even if it was nonsense.

The reality is that there is little demand for travel from Anglesey to Cardiff

Would this service have been better if operated from Caernarfon Airport? Seems to get little use except for private planes and sir ambulance and coastguard. It is less remote than Anglesey.

 

[wobman]

The money may go towards the extra Mk4s that have been bought by tfw, on top of the GC Mk4s now tfw are looking at even more Mk4s to add to the loco fleet.
If tfw get extra Mk4s that could help strengthen other services that tfw run, this extra money won't go far as Mk4s are not cheap trains to run.

 

[Mikey C]

I am not the only one who takes flights well - just because! I did Ryanair Blackpool to Dublin while it existed and also Dublin to Galway. Anyway, back OT - I think short haul flights that lose money where there are reasonable alternative arrangements should be curtailed/cancelled so I am glad this has happened. As has already been pointed out though, the money saved will be a drop in the ocean as to what is required for improving travel in Wales.

The Gerald train up to Anglesey (in 1st class) and the Jetstream 41 flight back are featured on this YouTube channel. Both journeys heavily subsidised by the Welsh assembly...

 

[NI 271]

If its £2.9 million a year then you may end up with a larger scheme based on its payback time. Id count out signalling changes though.

That’s a shame, making Ty Croes a block post would be really helpful.

 

[sw1ller]

I wonder if £2.9 million is enough to recommission Ty Croes as a block post instead of a crossing box and shorten the longest block section on the route.

I’ve never had an issue with this long section in 6 years driving the route. Money should be spent either at Beeston/Crewe, or Gobowen/Shrewsbury. This would make journey times better but these aren’t in wales so it won’t even be discussed. Chester still needs bulldozing and rebuilt from scratch as it’s nearly as pathetic as Shrewsbury. The work that NEEDS to be done to improve it would hit the billions I think, 2.9m ain’t doing jack hit. But we’ll just continue to throw plasters at the issues and make do.

 

[Shrop]

Always good to see anything which improves services through Shrewsbury. Whether services run via Wrexham or Crewe and then south to Hereford, they will all benefit from having a faster track than the pathetic slow one which runs towards Birmingham.
The only snag is the madness that prevailed when the Wrexham by-pass was built, using the unbelievably short-sighted approach of pinching one of the rail tracks to do it. Many of us screamed about it at the time, only to fall on deaf ears as the rail authorities knew best. Oh, the rewards they've reaped since then, I wonder how many thousands or even millions of minutes have been unnecessarily lost due to the single track section since that dire decision was made?

 

[Sheridan]

I’ve never had an issue with this long section in 6 years driving the route. Money should be spent either at Beeston/Crewe, or Gobowen/Shrewsbury. This would make journey times better but these aren’t in wales so it won’t even be discussed. Chester still needs bulldozing and rebuilt from scratch as it’s nearly as pathetic as Shrewsbury. The work that NEEDS to be done to improve it would hit the billions I think, 2.9m ain’t doing jack hit. But we’ll just continue to throw plasters at the issues and make do.

There are a couple of pinch points in the timetable, such as 1055-1134 when three Holyhead bound trains pass Gaerwen, and 2117-2132 where there are two. Any disruption prior to this will lead to delays at Gaerwen. However, it’s rare that it results in a delay of more than 10 minutes, usually nearer 5. Whenever there is more serious disruption (e.g. an Avanti has been delayed by an hour from Euston, as happened recently), the backlog can be much longer though. I’m pretty sure all these trains are worked by Holyhead TfW and Avanti traincrew working home.

However, I’m not sure any of this justifies making Tŷ Croes a block post!

(The worst I’ve seen recently was a train in section, one stopped at Gaerwen’s section signal, one at the home signal and one at Llanfairpwll. I think the train in the section was a stopper, which obviously exacerbates the issue.)

Edit: the times I’ve given above are at Llanfairpwll, not Gaerwen, but the point stands.