Avanti ticket sales suspension - Making users think it isn't possible to travel.

[modernrail]

To be fair Avanti/LNER/TPE are trying to manage expectations by not selling tickets nominally "for" trains that don't or may not exist. But the approach is cack-handed in the extreme, because it was bodged in rather than properly designed.

I cannot believe a single other European country could be throwing such an utterly confusing situation at customers for such a sustained period. The mix of cancellations and nonsense information on fares etc is making the railway look like an unprofessional joke, at best.

Whilst this nonsense is ongoing they should reduce advance tickets to cover no more than 20% of the train, maybe less. Sell the remainder of all trains including peaks at the off peak fare, declassify first to standard premium and sell standard premium at 20% above standard. That will stop the booking engines throwing nonsense fares out that basically are not honoured anyway when you get on the train. It will also max out limited capacity.

If they are having to cancel 16 trains on a day when they have a massively reduced timetable anyway, that is surely something more than staff refusing to work rest days etc. Surely their actually fully rostered staff can run that level of service? Otherwise what on earth is going on.

 

[VauxhallandI]

It is yes, but that Advance is spectacularly pointless. Wouldn't be the first time though.

Ha I think I missed the point there!!!

I cannot believe a single other European country could be throwing such an utterly confusing situation at customers for such a sustained period. The mix of cancellations and nonsense information on fares etc is making the railway look like an unprofessional joke, at best.

Whilst this nonsense is ongoing they should reduce advance tickets to cover no more than 20% of the train, maybe less. Sell the remainder of all trains including peaks at the off peak fare, declassify first to standard premium and sell standard premium at 20% above standard. That will stop the booking engines throwing nonsense fares out that basically are not honoured anyway when you get on the train. It will also max out limited capacity.

If they are having to cancel 16 trains on a day when they have a massively reduced timetable anyway, that is surely something more than staff refusing to work rest days etc. Surely their actually fully rostered staff can run that level of service? Otherwise what on earth is going on.

I haven't found an advance ticket on Avanti since Covid

 

[Bald Rick]

I haven't found an advance ticket on Avanti since Covid

can’t have been looking very hard!

 

[VauxhallandI]

Ok whatever you say, I have to admit I didn’t notice you in the room with me.

 

[Bald Rick]

Ok whatever you say, I have to admit I didn’t notice you in the room with me.

that’s because I wasn’t there. However I*, and millions of others, have bought advance tickets on Avanti ‘since covid’ which I take to mean in the last 2 and a half years. I have just done a search now, and the very first search I did Sept 14th) produced advance fares Birmingham - London and return for less than £20 each way.

* I get free travel, but have bought tickets for other people, and have had no issue finding advance tickets on Avanti with the exception of the next couple of weeks During the reduced timetable.

 

[VauxhallandI]

that’s because I wasn’t there. However I*, and millions of others, have bought advance tickets on Avanti ‘since covid’ which I take to mean in the last 2 and a half years. I have just done a search now, and the very first search I did Sept 14th) produced advance fares Birmingham - London and return for less than £20 each way.

* I get free travel, but have bought tickets for other people, and have had no issue finding advance tickets on Avanti with the exception of the next couple of weeks During the reduced timetable.

Since the masks ended I have been forced to buy off peaks for several trips to Manchester on Avanti. I have been buying train tickets all my life so know what a ticket offer looks like.

I used to see them at various rates as listed in brfare.com however them are not there when I look anymore.

I can only go on my experience

 

[Bald Rick]

Since the masks ended I have been forced to buy off peaks for several trips to Manchester on Avanti. I have been buying train tickets all my life so know what a ticket offer looks like.

I used to see them at various rates as listed in brfare.com however them are not there when I look anymore.

I can only go on my experience

Sep 14th, 1620, £29.80.

 

[Snow1964]

. I have just done a search now, and the very first search I did Sept 14th) produced advance fares Birmingham - London and return for less than £20 each way.

* I get free travel, but have bought tickets for other people, and have had no issue finding advance tickets on Avanti with the exception of the next couple of weeks During the reduced timetable.

Nowhere on the Avanti website does it say Advance tickets are available, but excluding the next 2 weeks.

Can’t expect the public (any potential traveller) to understand rules that have been changed, but not announced.

I am not sure why you chose to say you have got Advances for others, is that because the others find it to complicated to do themselves, and need someone with better knowledge

 

[Bald Rick]

I am not sure why you chose to say you have got Advances for others, is that because the others find it to complicated to do themselves, and need someone with better knowledge

Because I was booking for a group.

 

[VauxhallandI]

Sep 14th, 1620, £29.80.

I’m not booking for Sep 14th

 

[43066]

I’m not booking for Sep 14th

But he has demonstrated that it’s possible to book advanced tickets for Avanti, despite your previous assertion that you’ve been unable to do so since before covid?

 

[Royston Vasey]

I was emailed this morning to say my advance on the 1S42 0730 Euston to Warrington on Sept 7th was cancelled (which I already knew) and was offered the chance of a fee free refund. My first thought was to wait and take it anyway (or an adjacent service) but the possibility of it being rammed made me accept the refund. Booked via Leeds on a diagrammed 91+Mk4 for less money.

I have a feeling 1S42 will be reinstated, and run half empty and I will be rammed on a substitute 5 car Azuma with no reservations

 

[VauxhallandI]

But he has demonstrated that it’s possible to book advanced tickets for Avanti, despite your previous assertion that you’ve been unable to do so since before covid?

I’ve still not been able to when I’ve tried.

I think we will leave it there there doesn’t always have to be winners

 

[XAM2175]

These two statements:

I’m not booking for Sep 14th

I’ve still not been able to when I’ve tried.

are significantly different in meaning from your original:

I haven't found an advance ticket on Avanti since Covid

The reality is that Avanti absolutely have been making significant numbers of Advance tickets available for purchase over the last two years. What you meant to say is that you haven't been able to find Advance tickets for any of your intended journeys at the time you chose to look for them.

This is not to say that the vastly-reduced sales horizon at this point in time isn't confusing and even off-putting for potential passengers, but fundamentally the idea of not selling tickets for services they're not sure they can actually run is a good one.

I used to see them at various rates as listed in brfare.com however them are not there when I look anymore.

I don't understand this remark, however. I can still see a large number of Avanti-priced Advances between Euston and Manchester when I run that enquiry on BR Fares: https://www.brfares.com/!fares?orig=EUS&dest=0438

 

[VauxhallandI]

These two statements:


are significantly different in meaning from your original:


The reality is that Avanti absolutely have been making significant numbers of Advance tickets available for purchase over the last two years. What you meant to say is that you haven't been able to find Advance tickets for any of your intended journeys at the time you chose to look for them.

This is not to say that the vastly-reduced sales horizon at this point in time isn't confusing and even off-putting for potential passengers, but fundamentally the idea of not selling tickets for services they're not sure they can actually run is a good one.


I don't understand this remark, however. I can still see a large number of Avanti-priced Advances between Euston and Manchester when I run that enquiry on BR Fares: https://www.brfares.com/!fares?orig=EUS&dest=0438

Let’s make it simple shall we.

I haven’t seen a single advance fare whilst I have been looking to travel in a long time on the WCML

I haven’t checked for advance fares in the days I haven’t been looking to travel on

It’s a fact like it or not

 

[Agent_Squash]

Let’s make it simple shall we.

I haven’t seen a single advance fare whilst I have been looking to travel in a long time on the WCML

I haven’t checked for advance fares in the days I haven’t been looking to travel on

It’s a fact like it or not

But they very much do exist. You just need to book well in advance to find them!

I've gone from Lancaster to Euston return with £20 advances (with railcard) both ways - in fact, I'm one on right now!

 

[VauxhallandI]

But they very much do exist. You just need to book well in advance to find them!

I've gone from Lancaster to Euston return with £20 advances (with railcard) both ways - in fact, I'm one on right now!

Great

It’s a shame they don’t realise train times far in advance anymore.

My statement that I haven’t found an advance ticket since covid still stands

You can jump up and down and show screenshots it doesn’t change my statement and it remains a fact

 

[modernrail]

But he has demonstrated that it’s possible to book advanced tickets for Avanti, despite your previous assertion that you’ve been unable to do so since before covid?

He didn’t say he hasn’t been able to find as advance tickets for any random train in the future, but more likely for actual trains useful to his journey?

My experience has been slightly different, vastly reduced overall availability but where they have been available, priced within a few pounds of the equivalent off-peak fare, which is plain underhand as it means passengers are sold them as ‘the cheapest fare’ with the booking engine results set up in a way that you don’t easily see the more flexible fare is there for a tiny bit more.

The LNER site is much, much better at showing the options properly, although not perfect.

 

[XAM2175]

Let’s make it simple shall we.

I haven’t seen a single advance fare whilst I have been looking to travel in a long time on the WCML

I haven’t checked for advance fares in the days I haven’t been looking to travel on

It’s a fact like it or not

I don't have to like it; I just want the information here to be accurate. Now that you've clarified your experiences the inaccuracy is resolved.

But they very much do exist. You just need to book well in advance to find them!

In fairness, this is one of the things that's causing problems at the moment, because that's not strictly true right now and a lot of people who are used to it working that way are getting caught out. A lot of TOCs are still holding back sales until closer than ever seen pre-Covid, and Avanti in particular are all over the place given the emergency timetable and the strikes. Thus the effect is that Avanti purchasers are finding that they can't buy Advances not just not as early as they used to but also not as late as they used to.

I say again: removing Advance sales for trains that they cannot confidently run is a good thing, but it remains off-putting for passengers and becomes especially problematic when the actual 'achievable' timetable cannot be confirmed until the last minute, because it very reasonably creates this criticism:

It’s a shame they don’t realise train times far in advance anymore.

 

[VauxhallandI]

Indeed this was my statement in the first post

“I haven't found an advance ticket on Avanti since Covid”

I’m not sure where I said there weren’t any in existence anywhere

 

[Andy Pacer]

I used to get some very good value advances on Avanti earlier this year on Saturdays from Nuneaton to Euston (and back).
Unfortunately they've withdrawn the service on their latest reduced timetable.

 

[parkender102]

Is the Timetable suspension / delay in finalising a countrywide thing across all TOC's? Daughter brought my attention to this on a planned journey Brixton to St Leonards on Sat 27 August - Trainline added the tickets to basket but no way to check out. Ive just tried the same journey on National Rail site and tickets showed Advance with times but directed me to a new window saying 'we are having trouble processing your request'.

 

[Howardh]

When is an Avanti advance ticket not an advance? Is it simply a price below the normal walk-on price? How late can they be bought to be classified as advance?

 

[Birmingham]

When is an Avanti advance ticket not an advance? Is it simply a price below the normal walk-on price? How late can they be bought to be classified as advance?

An 'Advance ticket' is a specific type of ticket that's valid only on a specific train. https://railforums.co.uk/threads/ra...-1-ticket-types-conditions.70018/post-1179550

 

[Howardh]

An 'Advance ticket' is a specific type of ticket that's valid only on a specific train. https://railforums.co.uk/threads/ra...-1-ticket-types-conditions.70018/post-1179550

Thanks!