Blackpool - Manchester Electrification

[rebmcr]

That’s the problem with most programmes and projects in my line of work. Outcomes, timeframes and costs have already been decided by those above - before anyone with experience of actually doing the job gets involved.

Depressingly familiar. Once the person with experience does get involved and starts taking it into account to make decisions (because there are aspects that impact the final design), they get treated like a five-headed alien for worrying about 'unnecessary detail'...

 

[GRALISTAIR]

And the politicians are only after the glory

 

[snowball]

Has any electrification project in recent times come in on time and on or under budget?

If yes, can we learn from it/them?

I haven't seen any figures for budget performance of any electrification schemes except GWR. Are they in the public domain?

Given that just about all of them seem to overrun on time, it's plausible that most of them are over budget too.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I am the eternal optimist and strongly feel if we kept going all the lessons would be learned and we would get better at running to time and budget. Politicians attention spans are short though and at very best 5 years.

 

[Mollman]

Railtrack management must have been real muppets though, to agree those contracts with Opraf/Virgin.
Did they really think moving block signalling would work by 2005?

Just look at the obsession with Digital Railway and what that is used to justify (think long delays in Manchester Picc improvements)

 

[LDECRexile]

ALX400 has kindly sent heartening photos of progress at Adlington and Blackrod.

I've added them to his album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157651121057352

and to the Combined Volume here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157661069863633

These shots take ALX past the 400 items submitted mark, for which, warm thanks.

 

[Geeves]

Not sure if it has been mentioned but the previous problem with the HV cables going over the soon to be wired lines at Clifton seems to be fixed. There is a deceased pylon lay on the ground at the side of Lumns Lane. Another one to cross off the list of issues.

 

[Bertie the bus]

I haven't seen any figures for budget performance of any electrification schemes except GWR. Are they in the public domain?

Given that just about all of them seem to overrun on time, it's plausible that most of them are over budget too.

It isn't plausible they are over budget it is absolutely guaranteed. The additional compensation paid to Northern will see to that by itself. How much are Network Rail compensating Northern for the additional weekly weekend closures for at least 7 months between Preston and Manchester? I don't know the answer but there will be a lot of zeroes.

 

[LDECRexile]

Not sure if it has been mentioned but the previous problem with the HV cables going over the soon to be wired lines at Clifton seems to be fixed. There is a deceased pylon lay on the ground at the side of Lumns Lane. Another one to cross off the list of issues.

No, it's only been mentioned as a worry, so that's good news. Thank you.

 

[Garry Waters]

I see all the wiring is up at BPN

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I see all the wiring is up at BPN

Outstanding so I assume it is just Poulton-le-Fylde missing now?

 

[LDECRexile]

Outstanding so I assume it is just Poulton-le-Fylde missing now?

I'm optimistic that that's the case, but to be sure we need someone with eyes (camera, even better!) on Layton and Kirkham and Wesham, where the most recent reports showed one track still to be wired.

 

[swanhill41]

On a very reliable facebook site they are saying that there has been numerous thefts of wiring,OHLE ,and also signalling cables....Calling it that there maybe further delays to job !!!!!!!
Frankly I cannot believe the thought process etc that creates these actions...And where is there any form of security for storage of items etc.?

 

[PR1Berske]

Took this at Blackpool North earlier. This is a photograph of Blackpool North station with electrification equipment in place.

 

[Elecman]

I’m not aware of numerous thefts of cables

 

[GRALISTAIR]

This is from the Preston Area Facebook page and the poster was Graham Jones Quote [Was working at BPN yesterday good to see the wires are up. However the date for completion is in doubt. There have been thefts of the main power cabling from all 4 stations and one section of signalling cabling has been stolen and replace three times] end quote

 

[Bertie the bus]

Perhaps the cabling hasn't been stolen but lost in the deep snow.

 

[InOban]

Surely signal cable is all fibre optic nowadays? Don't tell me heard still using copper...

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Well I am hoping LDECRexile aka Dave can glean some gen to confirm or hopefully deny this

 

[The_Engineer]

Surely signal cable is all fibre optic nowadays? Don't tell me heard still using copper...

The control of signals is via data links, so can use fibre or copper. The powering of trackside signals and the trackside control cabinets requires good old electrical power (amps and volts) and that doesn't flow down fibre optic cable.......

......plus the idiots who steal trackside cable tend to pinch the cable no matter what it's made of. No doubt disappointed when it is fibre-optic cores.

 

[LDECRexile]

Wrinkley has done a tour from Lostock to Farnworth. He's kindly sent several photos which I've added to his album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157654034635234

I've also added them to the Combined Volume here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157661069863633

He added that there is still no sign of base work between Farnworth footbridge and Rawson St bridge.

Thank you Wrinkley.

 

[LDECRexile]

View attachment 44543

Took this at Blackpool North earlier. This is a photograph of Blackpool North station with electrification equipment in place.

Thank you for this photo. Please may I add it to the Combined Volume?

Ah, I've just seen your kind note. No need to answer this!

Welcome and thank you.

 

[edwin_m]

Even if the major signalling and telecoms data cabling is fibre optic, the "tail cables" linking individual devices are still likely to be copper.

 

[LDECRexile]

Well I am hoping LDECRexile aka Dave can glean some gen to confirm or hopefully deny this

I've no info about this on "our" project, but the time between wires up and power on is especially prone to theft.

 

[LDECRexile]

As above, I'm delighted to welcome PR1Berske to the ranks of people kind enough to submit photos and films to the Combined Volume.

I've created an album for his work here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157689367931770

and added the shots to the Combined Volume here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/albums/72157661069863633

Smashing, thank you.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

9868K and M - I see Wrinkley calls it - "The base of the century" - saves coming up with something like AFGTBU or similar. I mean it must be about 3 cubic meters of reinforced concrete in that thing.

EDIT Just had another look - camera angle judgement but looks like 2 x 1.5 x 1.5 above ground so with what is below ground could be 5 cubic meters - enormous.

 

[LDECRexile]

9868K and M - I see Wrinkley calls it - "The base of the century" - saves coming up with something like AFGTBU or similar. I mean it must be about 3 cubic meters of reionforced concrete in that thing.

Even if it just sits on the ground I reckon 3 cu m is conservative. I went past it on the train and was amazed.

 

[InOban]

I've no info about this on "our" project, but the time between wires up and power on is especially prone to theft.

Don't they use Smartwater or other tracing system.?

 

[seaside14]

New member, I've been reading this thread with interest in recent weeks. Took a few photos around Poulton station / Tithebarn street on my walk this morning. Didn't expect to see anyone working on Easter Sunday but caught a slightly blurry bit of activity by chance! Poulton station looks much more complete than it did a few weeks ago, platforms seem re-laid etc. Please do add these to your shared albums if they are useful.

 

[thealexweb]

We had BBC Parliament on the TV in the waiting room the other day. Chris Grayling was on trying to justify the Lostock-Wigan electrification cancellation with the use of these 769s.

Edit: Was an April Fools, please disregard.