Class 175 to GWR

[John R]

Some of the peak time trains from and to Okehampton are often needing more capacity than a 2 car 150 unit.
With the opening in early 2026 of Okehampton Interchange there will be further growth in the traffic, increasingly the time saving alternative railhead to Tiverton Parkway for West Devon and much of Cornwall.
The question is just how much growth there will be.
With 5 additional Padd/Pgn trains planned by a new Operator there must surely be some consideration needed to start one from Okehampton for Paddington in the morning and return there in the afternoon.
Torbay can’t justify 5 extra daily through trains to and from Paddington.

Well First Group are both the existing operator and the applicant, so you would assume they have access to all the necessary figures and have determined that they can make a 5tpd service work.

 

[Roger B]

Well First Group are both the existing operator and the applicant, so you would assume they have access to all the necessary figures and have determined that they can make a 5tpd service work.

Or, they have noticed an opportunity, done the sums on cost and income from themselves operating the five additional Paignton services in addition to the GWR franchise, and the change in cost and income of the GWR franchise were another another operator to operate the five additional Paignton services, and determined that operating the five additional Paignton services themselves has the most positive (or least negative) impact on First Group P&L. Or am I being too cynical?

 

[Class172]

Torbay can’t justify 5 extra daily through trains to and from Paddington.

It's not all about carting passengers to Paddington, as much as London is a hub for traffic. The proposal will improve links between the Bristol area and the SW: particularly the Torbay area which has a very limited XC service and Bath which currently hasn't got any regular service south towards Taunton and beyond.

 

[Clarence Yard]

Or, they have noticed an opportunity, done the sums on cost and income from themselves operating the five additional Paignton services in addition to the GWR franchise, and the change in cost and income of the GWR franchise were another another operator to operate the five additional Paignton services, and determined that operating the five additional Paignton services themselves has the most positive (or least negative) impact on First Group P&L. Or am I being too cynical?

You are.

The scheme has been developed separately from any knowledge of GWR finances or revenue. Anybody who has such knowledge could not be involved in drawing up the OA scheme. There are strict “Chinese walls” between the OA arm of FG and FG management of the DfT TOCs. That is a legal requirement which is rigorously enforced by FG lawyers.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

It's not all about carting passengers to Paddington, as much as London is a hub for traffic. The proposal will improve links between the Bristol area and the SW: particularly the Torbay area which has a very limited XC service and Bath which currently hasn't got any regular service south towards Taunton and beyond.

Yes, there could be quite a few good connectivity options raised here.

 

[REVUpminster]

I was surprised to see extra trains for Torbay although it makes a convenient reversing point. Torquay and Paignton are the third and fourth largest towns in Devon behind Plymouth and Exeter. Not a very big car park at Paignton although quite a few nearby but not for all day parking.

The whole station needs updating and not just some new front doors it recently had. GWR/Railtrack did have plans as part of the Paignton Plan but that involved closing the level crossing and creating an open crossing ala continent.

When going to London I tend to park at Newton Abbot to catch the train.

 

[The Prisoner]

I was surprised to see extra trains for Torbay although it makes a convenient reversing point. Torquay and Paignton are the third and fourth largest towns in Devon behind Plymouth and Exeter. Not a very big car park at Paignton although quite a few nearby but not for all day parking.

View attachment 171531 The whole station needs updating and not just some new front doors it recently had. GWR/Railtrack did have plans as part of the Paignton Plan but that involved closing the level crossing and creating an open crossing ala continent.

When going to London I tend to park at Newton Abbot to catch the train.

Would have a little more time for that if it was a) readable and b) they could spell Paignton (Paington!)

 

[The_Train]

My source is telling me the early withdrawal of HSTs is the priority.

I think that ship sailed a while ago now

 

[REVUpminster]

Would have a little more time for that if it was a) readable and b) they could spell Paignton (Paington!)

Paington is one of the spellings that was used in the past. I did the post for the image of an open plan level crossing that included a Voyager.

Paignton - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[83G/84D]

At least one of the class 175 units at Laira are now reported as moved inside and receiving attention according to a private WhatsApp group.

 

[Rich McLean]

At least one of the class 175 units at Laira are now reported as moved inside and receiving attention according to a private WhatsApp group.

Maintenance training and familiarisation.

 

[Anonymous10]

At least one of the class 175 units at Laira are now reported as moved inside and receiving attention according to a private WhatsApp group.

Believe it's 175002 as on Facebook.

 

[fgwrich]

Believe it's 175002 as on Facebook.

Correct. Back on one of the former DMU roads (No.2 &3) and soon to return to return to their original intended use of servicing DMUs. It was moved in on Friday.

 

[83G/84D]

Believe it's 175002 as on Facebook.

Yes it is.

 

[northernbelle]

At least one of the class 175 units at Laira are now reported as moved inside and receiving attention according to a private WhatsApp group.

Yes they are being moved around by the depot pilot using a coupling adaptor. This has enabled gauging to be validated and preliminary engineering staff familiarisation to take place - although wider training can't start in earnest until the units are officially on lease to GWR.

 

[Wyrleybart]

Yes they are being moved around by the depot pilot using a coupling adaptor. This has enabled gauging to be validated and preliminary engineering staff familiarisation to take place - although wider training can't start in earnest until the units are officially on lease to GWR.

Haha. God forbid they should actually power up its own engines and move itself !!!
Diesel trains need to be regularly run - engines alternators, compressors etc along with pneumatic and electrical systems.

 

[tfw756rider]

Yes they are being moved around by the depot pilot using a coupling adaptor. This has enabled gauging to be validated and preliminary engineering staff familiarisation to take place - although wider training can't start in earnest until the units are officially on lease to GWR.

Does anyone in here know when they'll officially be on lease to Great Western Railway?

 

[TurboMan]

Haha. God forbid they should actually power up its own engines and move itself !!!
Diesel trains need to be regularly run - engines alternators, compressors etc along with pneumatic and electrical systems.

It's because at the moment there is no one competent to drive them.

 

[windjabbers]

Now Updated

With the arrival of 103 at Ely. Is this now where all the units are I beleive:-

002 and 114 are at LA
006 is still at LE
103 is now at Ely with the rest of the units

and does that make the rest at Worksop? or are some others are also at Ely.

In addition I think that the following units are not in their orginal formation: -

004/005/006/008/101/109/115

Arrival dates at LA

002 - 26.11.24
114 - 05.12.24

Any corrections welcome

 

[Wyrleybart]

It's because at the moment there is no one competent to drive them.

That is a pretty solid reason. Thanks

 

[Snow1964]

There was a debate with MPs in Westminster Hall today (14 January) on rail to South West.

In the Ministers answer towards end of transcript there is reference to Officials (of DfT) and GWR regarding crowding and extra capacity in South West. Doesn't specifically mention 175s, but there is confirmation of higher passenger numbers now. Even suggests Thursdays are joining the busy Friday-weekend.

Rather vague official reply, ignores the detail of many of the specific points eg IETs removed from Bedwyn services, and people getting left behind due to lack of serviceable stock leading to short forms

(transcript is long so not quoting it in full)

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Dr Allin-Khan. The south-west is hugely reliant on the mainline railway—it is an economic lifeline. As I am the MP for Newton Abbot, which includes Dawlish, Teignmouth and Kingsteignton—all towns with strong railway heritage—the railway is a fundamental part of my life and community.

Devon and Cornwall are notoriously underserved by transport: there is one motorway and just two national roads. The road network in Devon is largely minor roads full of potholes. The mainline railway is the key economic lifeline for the entire region. Getting from Exeter to Paddington in a couple of hours makes a huge difference and enables many people to work part in London and part in Devon—including myself, even before I was an MP.

The value of the railway to the economy was demonstrated during the 2014 Dawlish storm incident. From a Transport Committee record, we know that the storms on 4 February and 14 February 2014 caused a 100 metre breach in the sea wall at Dawlish and a 25,000 tonne landslip between Dawlish and Teignmouth, which was exacerbated by a further landslip on 5 March. The incident closed the line for eight weeks. An immediate repair cost of £35 million, including 300 engineers—the much-lauded “orange army”—got the line running again, but the interruption cost the local economy an estimated £1.2 billion. It is estimated that the Plymouth economy alone lost £600,000 each day the line was shut.

Since 2014 a lot has changed, but the dependence on the railway has, if anything, increased. Please do not think of tourism as the only industry in Devon: remote working has blossomed, and it is clear from Office of Road and Rail statistics that the overwhelming majority of rail journeys from Exeter and the other main stations are to and from London.

Why do we need a debate on the topic? The answer is that this vital railway link is again under threat from a number of different sources. After the 2014 storm, the then Prime Minister promised that money was no object and that the line would be made resilient. A five-phase plan was drawn up and work began. The new sea wall was built, and Dawlish railway station had a rebuilt sea defence as well. The first four phases of that plan have been done and are now in place. One massive benefit was the new bridge at Dawlish, which made both platforms accessible without steps—something that we still need in too many other stations, including Teignmouth.

https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2025-01-14/debates/C024F937-AAE2-46D3-8F1B-CED5D7496457/RailwayServicesSouth-West

 

[Pete_uk]

The 175s would look good in GWR livery.
Image is og a class 175 in GWR green

 

[supervc-10]

AI does *weird* things....

 

[JN114]

While it’s unsurprising; gives a very 334 vibe

 

[geoffk]

Is there any more news about the arrival of more 175s at Laira, the start of crew training and, most important, entry into service?

 

[delt1c]

Or, they have noticed an opportunity, done the sums on cost and income from themselves operating the five additional Paignton services in addition to the GWR franchise, and the change in cost and income of the GWR franchise were another another operator to operate the five additional Paignton services, and determined that operating the five additional Paignton services themselves has the most positive (or least negative) impact on First Group P&L. Or am I being too cynical?

Thats privatisation for you P&L before passenger and benefits to economic growth to the area

 

[irish_rail]

Is there any more news about the arrival of more 175s at Laira, the start of crew training and, most important, entry into service?

All rather quiet. No traincrew training yet, or even agreed. Some fitter training has been happening I believe. Regarding entry to service, I've heard March onward, but think that's optimistic, and both May and September also mentioned, so who knows?!

 

[Russel]

All rather quiet. No traincrew training yet, or even agreed. Some fitter training has been happening I believe. Regarding entry to service, I've heard March onward, but think that's optimistic, and both May and September also mentioned, so who knows?!

Hopefully May so I can have a ride on one when I'm in Cornwall over the summer!

 

[Xavi]

Not sure where an extra 150 for Newquay in May will come from if their are no 175s in traffic. TfW to GWR rather than Sims perhaps!

 

[Anonymous10]

Not sure where an extra 150 for Newquay in May will come from if their are no 175s in traffic. TfW to GWR rather than Sims perhaps!

Tfw units are being withdrawn at end of their c6.