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Derailment near Grange Over Sands

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westcoaster

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Looks about the same, also you can see the snapped signalling wires in the second picture.

Could the debris / missing ballast etc have gone in the golf course direction. Incase it was undermined on the flooded side.
One of the drone pictures shows murky water (showing moving water) in the flooded area.

From a drivers point of view, I'd be asking previous drivers over the route if it was bumpy/ wet beds present/ areas of low ballast.
 
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TT-ONR-NRN

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Which currently would actually be the quicker journey from Barrow-in-Furness if say to Carlisle? The Cumbrian Coast rail route via Whitehaven, or a rail replacement bus to Lancaster, and then North by rail along the WCML?
I doubt there’s much in it. It took me two hours fifteen minutes to get from Lancaster to Ulverston earlier today. Very cramped minibus dragging in traffic.
 
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Interesting video form a couple of years ago, showing the flood pumps in operation, and it then goes on to show the culvert (with new protection rails) which I think is at Aitkinsons yard and which was dug out by the golf club a few years back to improve drainage (it didn't)
 

stuving

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Interesting video form a couple of years ago, showing the flood pumps in operation, and it then goes on to show the culvert (with new protection rails) which I think is at Aitkinsons yard and which was dug out by the golf club a few years back to improve drainage (it didn't)
We had a quote in post #81 from The (NWE) Mail, about the golf club (and perhaps their neighbours) doing work on the Seldom Seen culvert:
Grange Golf Club has a permit to excavate silt from the outfall of Seldom Seen Culvert, under J T Atkinson Builders’ Merchant, out into Morecambe Bay for a distance of 30 metres, once a year until 2027.

The club has applied to the Environment Agency (EA) to vary this permit further to allow it to form a channel from the outfall of Seldom Seen Culvert to the River Kent in the bay.
He (a director of the club) also said:
If the two outlets were working to how they were designed to be then there wouldn’t be the accumulation of water there is. Water would fall and it would discharge into the bay.
That may be optimistic - the expert view is that this part of Morecambe Bay is filling up with sand, so while the high tide level has gone up a little (due to global warming), the low tide level has gone up more. The culvert and flap valve can discharge to the sea only near low tide, and if they discharge less and for less of the tide's cycle, the drain will fill and overflow with less rain input. The only way to make the current arrangement work as intended is to add a big pump (as suggested by AECOM).

That article also had this:
The EA said it carried out extensive repairs to part of the River Winster flood embankment in 2022. During this time they also installed a new headwall structure and flap valve, as well as carrying out channel maintenance on Meathop Road Drain.
That wasn't the work on the sea wall in TE's videos (which must have been done by NR), that was the river bank of the Winster near the sluice. The contractor was Volker Ground Engineering, who produced a description of the work with pictures. They do not mention the flap valve; perhaps someone else did that.

Another article from The Mail has pictures of the crane coming to do its stuff, and also this half-helpful statement:
Around 150m away from the derailment location, a void in the ground had opened which has been described as a sinkhole.
For context, from the Seldom Seen culvert at the eastern end of Meathop Drain to the collapse (also the site of NR's pump hoses and the old channel of the Winster) is 300m, to the western end and the flap valve into the Winster New Cut is 1750m.
 
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a_c_skinner

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I doubt there’s much in it. It took me two hours fifteen minutes to get from Lancaster to Ulverston earlier today. Very cramped minibus dragging in traffic.
Then I owe the BBC an apology, as the 19:12 Barrow to Carlisle gets in at 21:45.
 

Greybeard33

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An amateur video of the re-railing operation has been published on YouTube. It includes shots of the sink hole, drainage hoses and surrounding area:
 

IanH440

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excellent piece of citizen reporting there Matilda and Mum .... a future at BBC Cumbria awaits.. who needs the RAIB....
 

swt_passenger

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Have they moved the train closer to the wall when they have lifted it, or has it ended so close to the wall when it derailed?
Following up in addition to my previous reply, towards the end of the latest video it suggests the wall has been damaged in a few places.
 

PyrahnaRanger

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Following up in addition to my previous reply, towards the end of the latest video it suggests the wall has been damaged in a few places.
In earlier videos, you saw it bounce off the wall, but looking at the latest video, it appears to have struck the wall once at speed and been pushed up and back, and then further along, and one final time shortly before it came to rest. Seems like a good job the wall was there!

It also appears from the video some ballast has dropped from the land-side track as well - definitely not good.

NR have lots of work programmed to take place over the Easter weekend - presumably this will have an effect on the resources available for this, or will it just be held back until they complete the programmed work?
 

BrianW

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An amateur video of the re-railing operation has been published on YouTube. It includes shots of the sink hole, drainage hoses and surrounding area:
Excellent clear footage, commentary, editing and enthusiasm- a career beckons. Well done, Matilda and Mum.
 

Bertie the bus

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In earlier videos, you saw it bounce off the wall, but looking at the latest video, it appears to have struck the wall once at speed and been pushed up and back, and then further along, and one final time shortly before it came to rest. Seems like a good job the wall was there!
The last 2 bits of damaged wall weren't caused by the accident. They must have been deliberate to allow access to the leading bogies of the first 2 carriages.

Photo here showing no damage to the wall towards the front of the train - https://www.blipfoto.com/entry/3217882837726267765/gallery/3217883140550822055

And photo from Monday from a similar angle showing debris from damage to the wall towards the front of the train - https://www.flickr.com/photos/britishrail1980sand1990s/53611585345/in/dateposted/
 

Zooty

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LancasterRed

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Even a shuttle to Arnside would be better than nothing if the section beyond is blocked.
I'm convinced I've been on a train that's turned at Arnside before. I don't remember much but I recall it only using the far/Lancaster-bound platform.

If my memory is correct, I wonder if this can be done again.
 

M&NEJ

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I'm convinced I've been on a train that's turned at Arnside before. I don't remember much but I recall it only using the far/Lancaster-bound platform.

If my memory is correct, I wonder if this can be done again.
During the refurbishment of the Kent Viaduct ("Arnside viaduct") they installed temporary buffers at Arnside station and worked trains from Manchester / Lancaster to Arnside and return. It must have been single line working from Carnforth as there's no crossover.
 

yorksrob

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I'm convinced I've been on a train that's turned at Arnside before. I don't remember much but I recall it only using the far/Lancaster-bound platform.

If my memory is correct, I wonder if this can be done again.

Definitely makes sense if the lines going to be blocked for any amount of time.
 

thenorthern

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I saw the crane move earlier and one of the derailed 195s move earlier through Grange. I assume the 195s are going to be stored at Barrow until the line reopens?
 
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