e-Scooters on Trains

[LNW-GW Joint]

Although the UK appears to be heading for an outright ban on carrying some li-ion powered e-things on trains, the French have no such inhibitions.
On several Intercités and TER trains last week, I saw e-scooters being brought on board - they are a common sight in towns.
On one occasion, a woman who boarded the train with one collapsed it and then detached the battery section and wandered down the train looking for a power socket.
She got an hour's charging in at SNCF expense before we reached Paris.
I was surprised the power sockets in the Corail stock were suitable for this use, but I don't know the technicalities involved.
Are the batteries any more powerful than those in phones and tablets?

Are we just miles behind in adopting these new gadgets, or are there real safety fears?
It feels a bit like the airlines banning the use of electronics until recently, when they discovered there was no real risk to "sensitive navigation equipment".
If the DfT thinks it should not provide wifi facilities on trains, what's the outlook for charging sockets?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes, we're miles behind adopting e-scooters with requirements on e.g. CE/UKCA approval for them to be sold.

They do need to be legalised and properly regulated. The safety fear is justified - there have been many battery fires. Properly regulated the batteries would be safer.

The need for sockets is likely to diminish over time as battery capacities on phones and laptops get better - for instance all recent Macbooks will easily do 8+ hours. Just as widespread 5G will make wifi less useful and it'll eventually die out - it's basically the "Rabbit phone" of computers.

 

[jon0844]

Now the Universities and Colleges are back, there seem to be loads more e-scooters on the road and being carried on trains. Looks like the railway and police have to start over..

 

[Vespa]

They're also banned in underground stations in Liverpool and London.

I witnessed an incident on the Waterloo and City line a man with his e scooter was turfed off the train, he made a big fuss about it, how he got it on in the first place I dont know.

Fears of Li ion batteries is justified, once they pop its hard to put the fire out and especially dangerous in the underground.

 

[pokemonsuper9]

I witnessed an incident on the Waterloo and City line a man with his e scooter was turfed off the train, he made a big fuss about it, how he got it on in the first place I dont know.

You don't need to pass any barriers at the Waterloo end if you use the right entrance so they might've gotten in there?

 

[Vespa]

You don't need to pass any barriers at the Waterloo end if you use the right entrance so they might've gotten in there?

I thought that might have been the case, I think I recall some entrance that only has a tap in point not sure where exactly, he must have thought he was being clever trying to bypass the barriers, the staff soon confronted him, the threat of the transport police was enough to make him leave the train.

 

[WibbleWobble]

Don't forget that people using privately owned scooters are doing so illegally. Their use is forbidden on the pavements and footpaths (as they are classed as a motor vehicle), and their use on roads is also not permitted.

Only rentable scooters as part of a trial scheme are permitted (such as Beryl, Voi, Lime etc), and the user has to have a driving license - these scooters even have a pseudo-registration plate on the back mud guard.

So by this logic, nobody should be bringing a scooter on the train as they will have most likely broken the law doing so.

 

[jon0844]

They don't care though, which is the problem. Many will travel regardless, until either a driver refuses to move or an REO or BTP officer deals with them (assuming they care).

 

[ChrisC]

Don't forget that people using privately owned scooters are doing so illegally. Their use is forbidden on the pavements and footpaths (as they are classed as a motor vehicle), and their use on roads is also not permitted.

Only rentable scooters as part of a trial scheme are permitted (such as Beryl, Voi, Lime etc), and the user has to have a driving license - these scooters even have a pseudo-registration plate on the back mud guard.

So by this logic, nobody should be bringing a scooter on the train as they will have most likely broken the law doing so.

They may be illegal, but is anything actually done to enforce this. If not, what is the point of them being illegal?
They can be seen daily being ridden around most city and town centres, weaving in and out of people at speed, in pedestrianised shopping streets. The police do nothing about this in the same way that very little seems to be done about stealing from shops. A few weeks ago I narrowly missed being hit by one in the centre of Derby and he whizzed further down the street passing two police officers on the way. The police were standing talking to a member of the public at the time, but the very fact that he did that says something about how little chance there is of the law being enforced. Every time I go into a town I see them riding around so it wouldn’t be a difficult thing for the police to also see them and confiscate these scooters. If the law isn’t going to be enforced why do they continue to be illegal? Regarding taking them onto public transport, I think that is a whole different matter, but again the law has to be enforced or what is the point having laws.

Having said all that, if used safely and responsibly, I think they could be an ideal form of transport for short journeys, especially in urban areas. I live in a more rural area and quite enjoy the walk of around 30 minutes to my nearest station. If I was 40-50 years younger I would perhaps like one myself. Here’s a thought. As I get older and can’t walk distances so easily, should I get one. Could they be useful for older people who can no longer walk far as they once did?

 

[Giugiaro]

eScooters are one of the few light transport vehicles allowed inside buses and the Alfa Pendular in Portugal.

Coach services like Flixbus, Gipsy and Rede Expressos, on the other hand, consider these as check-in luggage and charge extra for their carry.

 

[Bletchleyite]

eScooters are one of the few light transport vehicles allowed inside buses and the Alfa Pendular in Portugal.

Coach services like Flixbus, Gipsy and Rede Expressos, on the other hand, consider these as check-in luggage and charge extra for their carry.

If the legislative and battery safety issue could be sorted out, they're an ideal mode of transport to combine with rail travel as they take up far less space folded than bicycles do, even most folding bicycles bar Bromptons.

 

[TheSeeker]

Snapped this on a tram in Brussels a couple of weeks ago.

 

[jon0844]

I've seen some crazy 'e-bikes'* on trains in this country.

* Not e-bikes, but electric powered mopeds that can do 50-70mph and don't require pedalling.

No idea how the authorities are going to deal with those, or them being used on platforms at ridiculous speeds. I suppose we need to wait until there's a nasty accident.

 

[dubscottie]

They will be banned on public transport in Ireland sooner rather than later. The Chief Fire Officer in Dublin is just waiting for an excuse.
Irishrail are looking at enforcement options for when the new Darts come into service as they are open from one end to the other and there are fears about people self evacuating onto a live railway if one of these goes bang.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Travelling on Great Western Railway services (IET-operated ones, which have a different PIS set up, are an exception) has become a nightmare. After EVERY station:

"The next station is ___. This is a Great Western Railway service to ___. E-SCOOTERS ARE BANNED ON ANY GREAT WESTERN RAILWAY TRAIN! YOU WILL BE REFUSED TRAVEL, IF YOU BRING ONE! More details can be found at www.gwr.com/bikes."

And on most Turbos there seems to be a glitch where it will cut out a third of the way through ("E SCOOTERS ARE BANNED ON ANY-") making it all the more annoying somehow.