RailExplorer
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It’s either rear 4 or rear 5 depending which end you are driving from.
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Elizabeth line reliability issues
- Thread starter mrmartin
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I really think when the E lines are blocked between Stratford and Ilford like in this case EL services ought to run fast as the disruption to GA services was much more wide ranging fitting in between trains calling at all intermediate stations which to be fair can be reached by bus or even in the case of Maryland walking, something you cant do if you are trying to get to Kelvedon or Manningtree!
Agreed contingency plans are in place between both MTR / GA via Network Rail so the pain is “shared” somewhat. If you run fast you deprive certain stations of a service completely.
You wouldn’t be depriving Kelvedon or Manningtree of a service but people might have to change additionally (likely Shenfield) to make their connection or may be delayed.
Does seem odd to whack a rail tour in the middle of the morning peak, but the path must have been validated by Network Rail.
Some severe delays atm on the line around the cos.
Seems also that bidirectional running is taking place for Westbound service going via the eastbound tracks usually heading from Westbourne / Acton into Paddington.
Seems also that bidirectional running is taking place for Westbound service going via the eastbound tracks usually heading from Westbourne / Acton into Paddington.
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DynamicSpirit
Established Member
Wow, those are some extraordinary delays currently showing on Live Departures
(Picture is a screenshot of livedepartureboards.co.uk for Tottenham Court Road, taken just now, and showing delays of up to 84 minutes). Nothing is showing as on time.
(Picture is a screenshot of livedepartureboards.co.uk for Tottenham Court Road, taken just now, and showing delays of up to 84 minutes). Nothing is showing as on time.
Yeh trouble train was a 9W76. It was 50mins delayed when I checked it and then several trains were 30mins or above delayed with cancellations occurring to allow reversing of said train as a step up to recover the service.
Some trains were held a bit longer than they should have due to uneededly quick attempts to step up without yet finding out if said driver was ready to take over the new service.
9R22 was delayed about 14mins more at Farringdon even with clear track all the way to Paddington as they were waiting for a 9W at Tottenham to turn around that seemed quite unprepared.
Good however now service is resumed alas there will be many drivers and trains displaced but things are running now!
Some trains were held a bit longer than they should have due to uneededly quick attempts to step up without yet finding out if said driver was ready to take over the new service.
9R22 was delayed about 14mins more at Farringdon even with clear track all the way to Paddington as they were waiting for a 9W at Tottenham to turn around that seemed quite unprepared.
Good however now service is resumed alas there will be many drivers and trains displaced but things are running now!
This morning a train broke down in the core at Paddington. Since 10:30 only one XR train has run from Reading. Every other train has been cancelled with absolutely no communication. GWR staff said their control weren’t being told anything by XR, and XR staff were nowhere to be seen. Finally at 12:55, 2 hours after the last XR train, it was finally posted on TfL distruption that there is ‘no service between Reading and Maidenhead’.
No alternatives have been given, everyone is having to travel on the half hourly GWR service, many of which are 4 car because XR has reduced demand, and therefore the one I was on ended up full and standing.
My question is is this the plan for service recovery? When the Elizabeth Line was being promoted, we were told delays wouldn’t pass on because they could split the section off, yet in this case they just canned almost everything, and once they could run in the code again, they’ve cut off a section nothing to do with the incident for seemingly no reason?
No alternatives have been given, everyone is having to travel on the half hourly GWR service, many of which are 4 car because XR has reduced demand, and therefore the one I was on ended up full and standing.
My question is is this the plan for service recovery? When the Elizabeth Line was being promoted, we were told delays wouldn’t pass on because they could split the section off, yet in this case they just canned almost everything, and once they could run in the code again, they’ve cut off a section nothing to do with the incident for seemingly no reason?
There would be cancellations on top of that too.
The problem train appeared to fail in all driving modes, and even once it went in recovery mode, even that initially failed. It then crossed back from Eastbound to Westbound line ECS from Bond Street to go to Old Oak depot.
It will explain why there was some weeks ago testing with a GBRF unit for possible rescues. Results of that unknown. For now luckily we've not had a train completely breakdown in the COS.
There was nothing running at all on the western section, yet the only information was that services were "suspended between Paddington and Abbey Wood" (and later, as you say, a further bit about Reading to Maidenhead). Failures happen, but it's staggering that a large, well-funded and modern railway can't communicate absolute basic information to passengers.
ChrisHogan
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This has happened before; XR concentrates on points closest to the central core and makes no attempt to provide any sort of service west of Hayes & Harlington. I have noted instances of no service westwards from West Drayton for up to three hours in disruption. West Drayton has its fifth platform perfectly capable of being used for terminations in both directions, but the number of times it has been used in anger during disruption is minimal.
TfL advises using "local buses" from West Drayton westwards during service disruption but there aren't any, unless you catch the U3 and 350 to Heathrow and try you luck there. Correspondence with the completely useless TfL Customer Services reveals that non-provision of services west of Greater London is part of the contingency plan agreed with Network Rail and GWR.
You’d have to define “completely”. Very few trains are declared complete failures!
Unfortunately it appears a points failure at Ilford (again) hampered all the recovery on the line so services on the GEML have been delayed - in various states - for about 12 hours today.
Unfortunately it appears a points failure at Ilford (again) hampered all the recovery on the line so services on the GEML have been delayed - in various states - for about 12 hours today.
There seems to be a train fail at Paddington every day at the moment after completing an AR move. With 100+ moves a day they need to make it significantly more reliable.
Is Auto Reverse enabled at Westbourne Park?? I seem to remember that it was deactivated after issues. Plus from when I see trains stabled at the sidings there often looks to be enough time for drivers to walk back to the other end ahead of MA for the next service run.
It is meant to be permanently active, but it is occasionally turned off when there are issues.
The Paddington EB trains failing is becoming quite a trend, and it seems to be not just train related but infrastructure related too.
Indeed. Heathrow Airport unable to reach minimum numbers so have closed T4.
As a result, 2tph to Heathrow Central (ECS to T4 like in the pandemic) & 2tph to Hayes / West Drayton.
Ah I see. Interestingly enough the Abbey Wood - Plumstead Sidings Auto Reverse system never really got the go ahead or at least finished. That one in particular would be quite useful considering the way of stabling trains into that siding via a two part move.
I believe planned to be closed all day. A bit of a pain I’d imagine for departing customers given that there’s no direct rail connection from T123 to T4, you’d have to go via Hatton Cross. I believe a halfhourly bus replacement is running.
Saying that it probably makes more sense than closing T5, as well as being much busier closing T5 also affects LU services. It seems that of the 4tph to T4, two are using the station running empty; one is going round at Hayes & Harlington and the other West Drayton.
Indeed. Yeh usually Drivers doing Hayes And Harli services will turn round using T4 as the loop.
Coming back to the 7th June failure, i got caught up (but benefitted on this).
around 8am I arrived at Farringdon, being told no west bound services and limited eastbound.
(suited me as I was going to Excel).
On the EL platforms, the Eastbound platform was closed, and everyone was being diverted to the Westbound platform, which was announcing trains to Paddington. of course everyone was confused, but staff reassuring them this was going east.
We then wrong lined ourselves all the way to Custom house, but which time it was back on the right track.
Given the event was AWS summit (15k people) EL was causing chaos, but those of us coming from Thameslink had seats on a train which wasnt overfull at that time in the am… and I was ontime.
At Custom House, another was waiting to enter what was effectively a single line section to Farringdon.
so kudos to staff in a crisis, they got something going out of nothing, rather than just shutting down.
around 8am I arrived at Farringdon, being told no west bound services and limited eastbound.
(suited me as I was going to Excel).
On the EL platforms, the Eastbound platform was closed, and everyone was being diverted to the Westbound platform, which was announcing trains to Paddington. of course everyone was confused, but staff reassuring them this was going east.
We then wrong lined ourselves all the way to Custom house, but which time it was back on the right track.
Given the event was AWS summit (15k people) EL was causing chaos, but those of us coming from Thameslink had seats on a train which wasnt overfull at that time in the am… and I was ontime.
At Custom House, another was waiting to enter what was effectively a single line section to Farringdon.
so kudos to staff in a crisis, they got something going out of nothing, rather than just shutting down.
redreni
Member
Arrived at Abbey Wood this morning to be greeted by no EL information again. Just a message advising me to "listen to staff announcements", although there were none and the rather weary-looking chap on the platform confirmed the PA still isn't working.
The PA issue must be more complicated than I'd appreciated, or it's just not considered worth fixing? Like the escalators?
It's such a shame that, having spent billions on a top-notch bit of infrastructure, relative pennies can't be spent to fix basic items like escalators, PA systems and information screens.
The PA issue must be more complicated than I'd appreciated, or it's just not considered worth fixing? Like the escalators?
It's such a shame that, having spent billions on a top-notch bit of infrastructure, relative pennies can't be spent to fix basic items like escalators, PA systems and information screens.
The problem is where the MTR side of gateline is the PA there doesn't work. Its been mentioned severally but its still "under works". Usually there should be platform staff albeit agency, not however to be mistaken by train coordinators and technicians who although where the high vis aren't actually customer service but some will try and help out.
What is more interesting is that the upstairs gateline PA does work but it will send a PA thru to all four platforms. I do believe aswell early morning to a certain time PA announcements are not allowed or have been agreed to some degree to be halted due to neighboring homes complaining about the noise(dunno why considering they hear constantly the train doors and traction motors but ah well) but this however still doesn't agreed explain why the downstairs gateline PA is still awaiting repairs.
In serious disruption you'll see the megahorns get used as a mitigation to the PA
Its true ABW is neglected it seems on the line, countless issues that need to be resolved especially when MTR staff are now mainly the sole staff of the station for as well southeastern and thameslink side platforms which I assume will be quite a workload.
Not reliability but I've ended up on Heathrow-bound trains from Stratford a lot recently and noticed there seems to be a bug where just before Bond Street, the announcement that Oyster isn't valid between West Drayton and Reading will play every time. Often the driver (I assume) will abruptly stop the announcement which means the announcement ends up saying "Oyster isn't valid". Cue a lot of confused faces from Heathrow-bound tourists every time! Does this happen on Heathrow trains from Abbey Wood too?
It's not the driver stopping it. The PIS stops itself and pauses before announcing the next station.
I heard this announcement at Hayes & Harlington on a Heathrow-bound service. Is it a bug necessarily?
Yes it is. Announcements that Oyster is not valid should not be played on services that operate wholly within the Oyster area.
But it's not the most pressing issue when we see constant calamitous breaks in the service to Heathrow (and elsewhere), ever since the last upgrade. It's starting to get into aviation articles about Heathrow, it was never an issue on the Piccadilly, the HEx used to go through periodic patches, but not like we have had since the integrated Liz running started.
And I don't want to say 'told you so' about the auto-reverse at Westbourne Park inevitably giving trouble, but ...
For goodness sake, there are three reversing sidings there. Surely that is adequate for the drivers to walk through a walk-through train and set up the opposite cab without this over-clever silly stuff.
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