Fastest Accelerating MUs in the UK

[fgwrich]

Depends on driver (see above ) and conditions. I've seen 0 to 60mph in 27 seconds and 0 to 100mph in under 70 seconds on a 755/3 (electric mode) given the full beans departing Stowmarket non-stop towards Ipswich - which makes it by far - the fastest accelerating train in the UK. And measured with RAcelogic Vbox professional GPS timing gear too - not a Garmin!

I had a 755/4 given full power start from Colchester in torrential rain in electric mode. The traction electronics were working overtime to prevent wheelslip - which even occurred at 80mph - and despite that - it still beat a Class 360 timing recorded in dry conditions! Those Stadlers are phenomenal!


Rail Express is playing catchup - we cannot get the info to them fast enough!
Officially the 755/3's are fastest - 0 to 60mph in 27 seconds, followed by 755/4 (31 seconds from memory) and possibly 331 3-car units after that.
345's were 36 seconds (0 to 80mph in 1 minute!) , and the latest Class 720 seems to be achieving 0 to 60mph in 39 seconds - which is on a par with a Class 745/1.
Class 710's are not so easy to record reliable data on. LO drivers seem to start off in a low power setting for 5 to 10 seconds before giving them full beans - and there is nowhere to record a full 0 to 60mph on the LO network.

The 710's are a lot faster than the 172's for sure, but from 0 to 45mph..the 710's are only slightly faster than a 378.

Out of interest, which is quicker between a 332 & a 397? Old CAF vs New CAF.

 

[py_megapixel]

Out of interest, which is quicker between a 332 & a 397? Old CAF vs New CAF.

The traction equipment for the 332s and 333s was all provided by Siemens, as far as I'm aware. Also I think the 397s will perform considerably differently as they're built for 125mph. The 331s would probably be a better comparison, or even the 700s (since they also are Siemens)

 

[Railperf]

Out of interest, which is quicker between a 332 & a 397? Old CAF vs New CAF.

331 3-car 0 to 60mph in 34s
397 5-car 0 to 60mph in 42s
Best times recorded so far. I am being told 331 drivers are being asked to use full power from rest sparingly.
I have no 332/333 data.

 

[Kneedown]

The data I have recorded for numerous Class 180 vs Class 222 on level track shows my best 222 runs to be faster than my best Class 180 runs. And I verified each time with the driver that all engines running and performing as expected.
The time difference is not much between then. So in the event either unit has an engine out or derate the performance loss is significant.

I'm in the fortunate position of driving and instructing on both forms of traction, over the same stretches of track, and if I was in a drag race between the two, i'd be choosing the 180.

 

[Railperf]

I'm in the fortunate position of driving and instructing on both forms of traction, over the same stretches of track, and if I was in a drag race between the two, i'd be choosing the 180.

Interesting. I hope that EMR can keep them in better running order than we've seen them elsewhere. Too often they have had an engine isolated or 5 engines running but some other issue preventing full power being deployed.

 

[Kneedown]

Interesting. I hope that EMR can keep them in better running order than we've seen them elsewhere. Too often they have had an engine isolated or 5 engines running but some other issue preventing full power being deployed.

Dragging brakes have been a recurring issue with a couple of the sets, but the techy guys believe they have isolated the cause. We've had a few engines isolated, but some for exam/warranty reasons as opposed to faults. Demand for the four units is high. For training we have to have two units ready to go, one for actual training, the other for rescue purposes. Each training run must also be accompanied by a qualified fitter. This fitter also works on the units on depot so his daily hours are limited. Some units have to go to Crofton for heavier maintenance. All this has created a massive challenge in getting sufficient handling hours for the four Drivers per week attending a course. In short, there's currently a limited number of fitters carrying out work on four units that need a fair bit of work. All this with demand for units for training both on depot and on the mainline. Quite a logistical headache!
Apologies for going a tad off topic.

 

[hexagon789]

345s at 34 seconds to 60mph are pretty quick.

I believe 220s are still the fastest accelerating DMUs at least in 0-60mph terms

 

[Prestige15]

From Wikipedia

'''The 331 electric units are noted for their quick acceleration putting them among the fastest accelerating EMUs in the United Kingdom with a rate of 1.3 m/s2.This allows the units to accelerate from 0 to 125 km/h (77 mph) in 45 seconds - by comparison, the ex-British Rail Class 319/321/322 units have an acceleration rate of 0.55 m/s2 and which takes them over 2 minutes to attain the same speed.'''


For diesel i believe is between Class 195, 220 and 8XX in diesel power

 

[py_megapixel]

'''The 331 electric units are noted for their quick acceleration putting them among the fastest accelerating EMUs in the United Kingdom with a rate of 1.3 m/s2.This allows the units to accelerate from 0 to 125 km/h (77 mph) in 45 seconds - by comparison, the ex-British Rail Class 319/321/322 units have an acceleration rate of 0.55 m/s2 and which takes them over 2 minutes to attain the same speed.'''

That particular claim does seem to have a reliable citation behind it, but I'd be cautious about taking railway-related facts you read on Wikipedia at face value.
It has been known to produce absolute nonsense - see this thread for a good example.

 

[43096]

From Wikipedia

'''The 331 electric units are noted for their quick acceleration putting them among the fastest accelerating EMUs in the United Kingdom with a rate of 1.3 m/s2.This allows the units to accelerate from 0 to 125 km/h (77 mph) in 45 seconds - by comparison, the ex-British Rail Class 319/321/322 units have an acceleration rate of 0.55 m/s2 and which takes them over 2 minutes to attain the same speed.'''


For diesel i believe is between Class 195, 220 and 8XX in diesel power

As above, Class 755/4 on diesel, too.

 

[supervc-10]

345s at 34 seconds to 60mph are pretty quick

There are cars out there that are that sort of speed! Very impressive.

 

[Railperf]

As above, Class 755/4 on diesel, too.

755/4 on diesel is in a league of its own. 195's are somewhere in the pack that includes 180, 185 22x
755/3 on electric is again way faster than anything else. 755/4 only slightly slower.

 

[dk1]

755/4 on diesel is in a league of its own. 195's are somewhere in the pack that includes 180, 185 22x
755/3 on electric is again way faster than anything else. 755/4 only slightly slower.

It's good to be top at something for a change out East here in rural East Anglia.

 

[Railperf]

It's good to be top at something for a change out East here in rural East Anglia.

you must be getting bored with warp factor 5 by now . A news article also suggests delays caused by leaf fall were much lower this year too. Are the new trains better at coping with it?
Article link below?

New trains get to grips with leaves on the line in East Anglia

A year after the introduction of Greater Anglia’s fleet of new Stadler trains across the network was blighted partly by problems with...

www.eadt.co.uk

Dragging brakes have been a recurring issue with a couple of the sets, but the techy guys believe they have isolated the cause. We've had a few engines isolated, but some for exam/warranty reasons as opposed to faults. Demand for the four units is high. For training we have to have two units ready to go, one for actual training, the other for rescue purposes. Each training run must also be accompanied by a qualified fitter. This fitter also works on the units on depot so his daily hours are limited. Some units have to go to Crofton for heavier maintenance. All this has created a massive challenge in getting sufficient handling hours for the four Drivers per week attending a course. In short, there's currently a limited number of fitters carrying out work on four units that need a fair bit of work. All this with demand for units for training both on depot and on the mainline. Quite a logistical headache!
Apologies for going a tad off topic.

Given the challenges above, do you feel confident the 180's can be kept running as well as the 222's? From my own experience, i found the 222's generally in much better condition - performance wise - than the 180's in HT or FGW hands. Hull trains had many documented issues - with many services curtailed or cancelled due to a shortage of serviceable trains at one point.

Looking back at my data - comparing the fastest 222 vs 180 runs in my database suggests the 222 is 10 seconds faster from rest to three miles - with the 222 just touching the 'ton' while the 180 is doing around 97mph at that point.

Loughborough starts Northbound are as level as they get on the MML, so be interested to see in the coming months how the 180's fare over that stretch once they are in public service with EMR fitters looking after them.

 

[Jamesrob637]

I always think 350s get away like the proverbial whenever I travel to London via Crewe on cheap Advances.

 

[Railperf]

I always think 350s get away like the proverbial whenever I travel to London via Crewe on cheap Advances.

Yes, the 350's and 360's are some of the faster accelerating units. All can do 0-60mph in 45 to 50 seconds and 0 to 100mph in under 2.5 mins.
The 360's made Class 321's seem pedestrian on the GEML. Now the Stadlers - 745/755 make the 360's feel slow!

 

[100andthirty]

As others have said, the Stadler class 755/3 have the highest power to weight ratio of any trains in the UK; a short train with 2.5MW power is almost unheard of. That said the power is put down though only four wheelsets, so acceleration can sometimes be limited by available adhesion compared with units that have 8 or more motored wheelsets. The LU S8 stock can draw over 3MW from the power rails, but is a much longer and heavier train, so its power to weight ratio is not as good as the Stadler trains, but it does apply that power to the running rails though 32 wheelsets, so will be less affected by poor adhesions conditions.

 

[supervc-10]

The S8 stock is also geared 62mph according to Google, while the Stadlers are for 100mph, which I can imagine helps!

 

[dk1]

you must be getting bored with warp factor 5 by now . A news article also suggests delays caused by leaf fall were much lower this year too. Are the new trains better at coping with it?

We where all expecting the worst but have been pleasantly surprised. Along with much improved reliability it's been an eye opening leaf fall season with the bimodes. The 745s have been good on the wheelslip front but software niggles persist.

 

[100andthirty]

The S8 stock is also geared 62mph according to Google, while the Stadlers are for 100mph, which I can imagine helps!

Good point!

 

[supervc-10]

I would imagine that as technology improves, things have moved on a fair bit in wheelslip protection compared to a tatty 15x!

 

[Railperf]

I would imagine that as technology improves, things have moved on a fair bit in wheelslip protection compared to a tatty 15x!

As I say, the 755's can still accelerate faster in torrential rain - than any legacy GE traction in dry conditions! I'm told some drivers will reduce power slightly - but otherwise the wheelslip equipment is pretty awesome compared to the older stuff.

How do you find the 745's in the wet @dk1 ?

 

[dk1]

As I say, the 755's can still accelerate faster in torrential rain - than any legacy GE traction in dry conditions! I'm told some drivers will reduce power slightly - but otherwise the wheelslip equipment is pretty awesome compared to the older stuff.

How do you find the 745's in the wet @dk1 ?

Initially they're not happy & wont accept full power. This however improves no end once above 30mph & then they just take off.

 

[Railperf]

Initially they're not happy & wont accept full power. This however improves no end once above 30mph & then they just take off.

It's a shame they don't have more powered axles - because the bodies are very light and that doesn't help adhesion. Still double the powered axles of a loco hauled set. An additional couple of powered bogies per 12-car set would have helped. The Norwegian 5-car versions have three powered bogies - but mainly for the 200km/h (124mph) top speed. The 12-car 745's are effectively a pair of permanently coupled six-car sets with only two powered bogies per six-car unit.

 

[Skoodle]

378s definitely have better acceleration compared to 377s and 700s. They do have more traction motors per motor vehicle than a 377. Many times I've started moving at same time as one in platform next to me at Norwood Junction, them never passing me until I'm halfway in the platform at Anerley. 378s also do have a massive difference between running on DC and AC.

 

[20atthemagnet]

Class 710's are not so easy to record reliable data on. LO drivers seem to start off in a low power setting for 5 to 10 seconds before giving them full beans - and there is nowhere to record a full 0 to 60mph on the LO network.

The 710's are a lot faster than the 172's for sure, but from 0 to 45mph..the 710's are only slightly faster than a 378.

I definitely dont do that. Like Dk1 its beans everywhere unless there's a reason no to . A 710 0-60mph is 31 seconds in 8 formation (but that includes powering back at around 55 as you'll bust 60 if you shut off any later) 4 would be faster, by how much not sure, dont drive them regularly enough to test. They (much like 745s) will not accept full power when its wet either. You need to start really low (around 30%) to get any sort of momentum.

Personally I dont think theres anything that can pip a 755/3 on electric at full power. I'd say they are on the border of whats acceptable for passenger travel

 

[Taunton]

It's good to be top at something for a change out East here in rural East Anglia.

The old Class 309 Clacton express electrics were pretty astounding on the same tracks 60 years ago, especially in their original 10-car format. I seem to recall Cecil J Allen finding them starting from Chelmsford up to 100mph in less than 3 minutes.

 

[Railperf]

The S8 stock is also geared 62mph according to Google, while the Stadlers are for 100mph, which I can imagine helps!

I've yet to record any decent acceleration for S8 stock. Seems okay up to 30mph, but in common with most 3rd rail units, the acceleration above that is feeble compared with anything on the 25kV AC system.

The old Class 309 Clacton express electrics were pretty astounding on the same tracks 60 years ago, especially in their original 10-car format. I seem to recall Cecil J Allen finding them starting from Chelmsford up to 100mph in less than 3 minutes.

The reports I've read of 309's and similarly regarding 321's is that they struggled to reach 100mph on level track.
Renatus Class 321's are much improved acceleration wise, but the braking performance is said to be less smooth and consistent than the standard 321 setup.

 

[rebmcr]

[The S8] does apply that power [3MW] to the running rails though 32 wheelsets, so will be less affected by poor adhesions conditions.

You would think, but at non-leafy times of year, on the Bow-West Ham section of track, any amount of rain would reliably produce very lively acceleration as the whole train seems to struggle with its WSP.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

For diesel, and I have said it before, a 185 will out-accelerate pretty much everything. Even a voyager, especially when second gear kicks in. Even tho the drive train is the same the 185 will outperform a 180 on acceleration and despite its much heavier weight. The lower top end speed of the 185 is what initially gives it the edge but it is also where the adelante and voyager both eventually catch up and overtake.

However since this post has been revived I would be tempted to think a 185 may have met its match in the 68/mk5 combo. 900hp per axle And ac traction more than outweighs the extra weight and is more powerful than an 802 on diesel. Them things seem to take off like a demented bat out on Man Vicc and storm up !Miles Platting