Five don't go on a Great Western adventure

[E_Reeves]

I don't know what that means!

It's like Facebook but you have to send a photo, it can't just be text (except private messages)

 

[hexagon789]

It's like Facebook but you have to send a photo, it can't just be text (except private messages)

You misunderstand I know what Instagram is, I meant what does DM mean in the context of Instagram?

 

[E_Reeves]

You misunderstand I know what Instagram is, I meant what does DM mean in the context of Instagram?

Oh my mistake! I have no idea then

 

[hexagon789]

Oh my mistake! I have no idea then

No worries! Ironically I have an Instagram account, but I've never used it!

 

[86206]

Now if only one or two posters were produced & "appeared" at a station....

 

[Bletchleyite]

Are they allowed to do that? I was under the impression that if TOCs cancel services at short notice they have to arrange alternatives.

If they reasonably can. Snow has a habit of having an impact on whether they reasonably can or not.

 

[nottsnurse]

If they reasonably can. Snow has a habit of having an impact on whether they reasonably can or not.

Who decides what is 'reasonable' at the time, rather than what is easiest/most convenient for the TOC?

 

[DarloRich]

quite funny actually. Good effort.

 

[221129]

Who decides what is 'reasonable' at the time, rather than what is easiest/most convenient for the TOC?

The TOC decides. If you can't source a bus then its hotels, IF They can find enough rooms.

 

[nottsnurse]

The TOC decides. If you can't source a bus then its hotels, IF They can find enough rooms.

So what the TOC considers 'reasonable' may be at the whim of whoever is duty decision maker at the time?

 

[Bletchleyite]

So what the TOC considers 'reasonable' may be at the whim of whoever is duty decision maker at the time?

It's most likely to be the whim of the companies that could provide buses.

 

[221129]

So what the TOC considers 'reasonable' may be at the whim of whoever is duty decision maker at the time?

Yes. Which is usually more realistic than what a lot of passengers feel is reasonable...

 

[nottsnurse]

It's most likely to be the whim of the companies that could provide buses.

Are buses the only other means of transport available then?

 

[nottsnurse]

Yes. Which is usually more realistic than what a lot of passengers feel is reasonable...

Oh really?

Someone who works for the TOC, possibly with budgetary responsibilities that may be discussed during their annual appraisal, can be trusted to make a 'reasonable' decision?

I'll have some of what you're smoking.

 

[221129]

Are buses the only other means of transport available then?

In Swansea after a large football match with a Lodon based team, what else do you suggest? Taxis won't be up for it at that time of night with poor weather conditions... same as the buses.

 

[221129]

Oh really?

Someone who works for the TOC, possibly with budgetary responsibilities that may be discussed during their annual appraisal, can be trusted to make a 'reasonable' decision?

I'll have some of what you're smoking.

Yes someone that can see the bigger picture and is the only person in a position to be able to manage the situation.

 

[nottsnurse]

Yes someone that can see the bigger picture and is the only person in a position to be able to manage the situation.

Colour me cynical but I don't believe that a manager, working for a private company that potentially has a complete monopoly of the routes it runs over (and hence isn't at the whims of market forces as experienced in other industries) is really the best person to decide what is 'reasonable' when, for instance, you are stranded in another country due to staffing shortages which said private company is solely responsible for.

I believe there is a term for that...err...conflict of interest?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Are buses the only other means of transport available then?

They are the only means of transport viable to provide an alternative for a large number of people. If you've got 10 people stuck a few taxis will do the job, but normally in these situations it's not 10 people.

There are a very small number of journeys where a charter aircraft could enter consideration, but you'd still need to get people to the airport, and there are other complications like maybe their luggage isn't suitable for airport security. And if the weather is that bad airports will be having trouble long before the railway.

Enough taxis for an HST full (about 100 taxis assuming all seats taken on the HST and no standees) are going to be hard to source quickly.

 

[hexagon789]

Enough taxis for an HST full (about 100 taxis assuming all seats taken on the HST and no standees) are going to be hard to source quickly.

Exactly, buses and coaches are the logical solution. Though I suppose taxis for those who live a bit out of the way isn't unreasonable.

 

[Robertj21a]

Exactly, buses and coaches are the logical solution. Though I suppose taxis for those who live a bit out of the way isn't unreasonable.

Though there won't be many available (with drivers) at short notice in most parts of the country.

 

[hexagon789]

Though there won't be many available (with drivers) at short notice in most parts of the country.

There is that I suppose, didn't really think about it.

 

[BestWestern]

Colour me cynical but I don't believe that a manager, working for a private company that potentially has a complete monopoly of the routes it runs over (and hence isn't at the whims of market forces as experienced in other industries) is really the best person to decide what is 'reasonable' when, for instance, you are stranded in another country due to staffing shortages which said private company is solely responsible for.

I believe there is a term for that...err...conflict of interest?

There are two options, road transport or a hotel. If road transport can be sourced, then it will be. Per passenger, it is unlikely to be more expensive than a very short notice booking at whatever hotel may be available nearby. If it isn't available, due to lack of willing suppliers or unfeasible road conditions, that leaves a hotel as the only other option. On a really bad day, there may be neither. In that case, your punters are likely to be spending the night on a train. Following on from that, the TOC will be paying them a fair bit of compensation. None of the above are cheap, in many cases the TOC won't be paying the final bill anyway, and the decisions are unlikely to be primarily based on cost.

 

[philthetube]

Colour me cynical but I don't believe that a manager, working for a private company that potentially has a complete monopoly of the routes it runs over (and hence isn't at the whims of market forces as experienced in other industries) is really the best person to decide what is 'reasonable' when, for instance, you are stranded in another country due to staffing shortages which said private company is solely responsible for.

I believe there is a term for that...err...conflict of interest?

Interesting, who do you feel is able to make that decision?

 

[Tracked]

(For the visually impaired)

The above image contains a satirical comment relating to the assualt of a passenger by airport security in the US on a United Airlines flight. In particular it parodies the promotional material of United Airlines, by using a paraphrasing a line of dialogue from the 1988 film 'They Live', featuring Roddy Piper. Unfortunately I'm not sure the satirical comment can be repeated in text on this forum due to the incredibly mild 'language' possibly not being permitted by the forum's filters, but I shall try to replicate it.

"We came here to sell seats and kick ass...but we're all out of seats."

This nicely apes the phrase from 'They Live' which is "I came here to chew bubble gum and kick ass...and I'm all out of bubble gum".

This image was included to counter a previous forum members assertion that airlines etc don't receive this form of visual criticism, as directed at railway companies

United also get songs about them;

 

[AlterEgo]

Colour me cynical but I don't believe that a manager, working for a private company that potentially has a complete monopoly of the routes it runs over (and hence isn't at the whims of market forces as experienced in other industries) is really the best person to decide what is 'reasonable' when, for instance, you are stranded in another country due to staffing shortages which said private company is solely responsible for.

I believe there is a term for that...err...conflict of interest?

Just a thought...

How would you feel if someone was as equally cynical about the nursing profession?

I’m really quite sick of reading paranoid stuff like this on these forums, from both passenger and staff side. It stifles any sort of reasonable discussion.

 

[philthetube]

Who decides what is 'reasonable' at the time, rather than what is easiest/most convenient for the TOC?

Who would you suggest does it, Chris Grayling from his office in London perhaps? One of those jobs no one wants, impossible to get fight all the time.

 

[43096]

Exactly, buses and coaches are the logical solution. Though I suppose taxis for those who live a bit out of the way isn't unreasonable.

The logical solution is to run the advertised train service....

But this is the rotten, incompetent mess that is GWR, so why you’d expect them to sort replacement transport I din’t know, given they can’t get enough staff to work to run the trains.

 

[hexagon789]

The logical solution is to run the advertised train service....

But this is the rotten, incompetent mess that is GWR, so why you’d expect them to sort replacement transport I din’t know, given they can’t get enough staff to work to run the trains.

Well yes, that is the logical solution but when have the railways ever been completely logical?

 

[nottsnurse]

How would you feel if someone was as equally cynical about the nursing profession?

We regularly get far worse, especially if we even dare to think about complaining about poor pay and conditions, let alone thinking about balloting for strike action. It's a vocation dontchaknow, only uncaring nurses would take strike action for better pay.

Ultimately though we all make choices. I chose to be a nurse after leaving the military and accept occasional negatives that come with it. I've been assaulted by a DTing patient whilst carrying out CPR on another, I've had faeces thrown at me by a 'regular attendee' because I wouldn't give her an (unprescribed) second dose of Methadone and I've received enough verbal abuse over the years to last a lifetime, but that's part of the job.

Oh dear, I've been a bit cynical about the impartiality of managers who work for TOCs? Perhaps if TOCs didn't receive substantial subsidises from the public purse and generating dividends for their share holders at one end, whilst causing staff shortages and resulting cancellations through cost-cutting at the other I might not view 'the decision makers' so cynically. And let me repeat that, 'the decision makers'. I'm not being cynical about the rank and file who work for TOCs here, who I'm sure work as hard as they can to get the job done under difficult conditions

 

[AlterEgo]

We regularly get far worse, especially if we even dare to think about complaining about poor pay and conditions, let alone thinking about balloting for strike action. It's a vocation dontchaknow, only uncaring nurses would take strike action for better pay.

Ultimately though we all make choices. I chose to be a nurse after leaving the military and accept occasional negatives that come with it. I've been assaulted by a DTing patient whilst carrying out CPR on another, I've had faeces thrown at me by a 'regular attendee' because I wouldn't give her an (unprescribed) second dose of Methadone and I've received enough verbal abuse over the years to last a lifetime, but that's part of the job.

Oh dear, I've been a bit cynical about the impartiality of managers who work for TOCs? Perhaps if TOCs didn't receive substantial subsidises from the public purse and generating dividends for their share holders at one end, whilst causing staff shortages and resulting cancellations through cost-cutting at the other I might not view 'the decision makers' so cynically. And let me repeat that, 'the decision makers'. I'm not being cynical about the rank and file who work for TOCs here, who I'm sure work as hard as they can to get the job done under difficult conditions

The people who arrange road transport or hotels *are* the rank and file. They are not senior management. This will often be done by the junior member of the control team.