Even though they are on sale from tomorrow?
-
Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Flexible Rail Season Tickets - 2/3 days per week to be introduced by June 2021
- Thread starter itwasntme
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
Paul Kelly
Verified Rep - BR Fares
Yes - new fares normally go on sale 4 weeks in advance of being valid; BR Fares has always only shown them from the date they are valid for travel.
People planning to go to the office on three days a week will mostly expect to be paying 60% of their current season ticket price. Wait for the screams.
Thank you for all the replies.
I was wondering if they would be suppressed until after some news conference given by the Rail Minister or whoever.
Anyway, I look forward to looking up the Flexi season fares on the TOC Website tomorrow morning.
(I'm a little surprised no one has actually posted an example - I'm assuming some posters on here have access to that information. Perhaps someone could post one example? We could then spend the afternoon saying isn't it terrific value/waste of space. Possibly holding both opinions simultaneously. )
I was wondering if they would be suppressed until after some news conference given by the Rail Minister or whoever.
Anyway, I look forward to looking up the Flexi season fares on the TOC Website tomorrow morning.
(I'm a little surprised no one has actually posted an example - I'm assuming some posters on here have access to that information. Perhaps someone could post one example? We could then spend the afternoon saying isn't it terrific value/waste of space. Possibly holding both opinions simultaneously. )
One of the ones to watch will be Reading to London. The Anytime Day Return is expensive but the season ticket reasonable value. Part time commuters will expect to pay the pro-rata season ticket rate.
Stevenage price of £177 was posted earlier and if this is correct it’s not great value but the season ticket from Stevenage to London is poor value anyway being a multiplier if 4.25 times the Anytime Day Return fare.
Stevenage price of £177 was posted earlier and if this is correct it’s not great value but the season ticket from Stevenage to London is poor value anyway being a multiplier if 4.25 times the Anytime Day Return fare.
So it's pointless buying a weekly in any week with a bank holiday in it?
Wallsendmag
Established Member
Try a TOC website, just change the travel date to the 28th
Yes, absolutely. Unless you travel 5 times a week, and at peak times, a weekly isn’t worth it.
Why do discounts, why not do a loyalty card? As you spend you get points to use as money off more tickets. You can be flexible as to how many points you get for different types of ticket. But you reward the big spenders with a decent discount. the once a month guys less so. TOC that sells the tickets pays into a fund to pay for the 'free' tickets.
Sounds pretty complicated to me. Something like the Gold Card is the best kind of loyalty scheme there is. Arguably it should be extended to cover all operators and all stations.
That would be good as I could get a much cheaper qualifying annual season ticket
That's more useful to me as I'll travel in but not twice a week every week and most likely 9:30 will do.
Here is a link to the new season ticket calculator.
Season Ticket Calculator | National Rail
Use the Season Ticket Calculator to find the best ticket option and value for your money. Season tickets are great for regular travel between two destinations during peak times. Choose the best option and you will be directed to a ticket retailer website.
No idea if there is a mobile-friendly version but why would someone travelling by train want a mobile-friendly version. What a silly idea of mine.........
Well I tried Stevenage to London and Flexi season didn't show up. It's the 21st June so no idea why.
According to the News reader on LBC one could potentially save hundreds. Looking up Guildford to London 2 days a week for 4 weeks didn't being up any flexi-fares.
Last edited:
Transpennine Express seem to be showing the tickets now (or at least some of them).
I've just checked and a flexi season between Fratton and London via Three Bridges (SWR ones not showing yet) is £392.60 compared to £490.80 for a monthly ticket. That means in a 31 day month you end up paying £98 less for 23 days less validity, or 15 if we exclude the weekends. Certainly not the incentive I was hoping for.
In a 23 working day month (23 days + 8 weekend days)
Season ticket cost per day: £21.33
Flexi season ticket cost per day: £49.08
You then also lose the ability to use the ticket for leisure travel at the weekends.
I'm lucky in that I can travel into the office as often as I choose, and i was hoping for something which would mean going in a few days a week would be good value, this is not and if I was paying for my commuting, i don't think I'd be seriously considering this as an option.
Maybe I'm not the target market but realistically this only seems suitable for those who are definitely going in 2 days a week, not 3, not 1, and they may feel short changed because of the 28 day limit if they don't use it due to illness or holidays... Obviously it may be more useful to people in different places.
I've just checked and a flexi season between Fratton and London via Three Bridges (SWR ones not showing yet) is £392.60 compared to £490.80 for a monthly ticket. That means in a 31 day month you end up paying £98 less for 23 days less validity, or 15 if we exclude the weekends. Certainly not the incentive I was hoping for.
In a 23 working day month (23 days + 8 weekend days)
Season ticket cost per day: £21.33
Flexi season ticket cost per day: £49.08
You then also lose the ability to use the ticket for leisure travel at the weekends.
I'm lucky in that I can travel into the office as often as I choose, and i was hoping for something which would mean going in a few days a week would be good value, this is not and if I was paying for my commuting, i don't think I'd be seriously considering this as an option.
Maybe I'm not the target market but realistically this only seems suitable for those who are definitely going in 2 days a week, not 3, not 1, and they may feel short changed because of the 28 day limit if they don't use it due to illness or holidays... Obviously it may be more useful to people in different places.
lkpridgeon
Verified Rep - FastJP
Bread & cheese
Member
Reading to London £351.20 = £43.90 per day, a 12.5% discount on the SDR £50.20.
Anyone making three peak journeys per week will save money with a season, 7DS £121.60.
With a Network Railcard a slightly cheaper option than the Flexi Season is PAYG peak single out plus SDS back with Network Railcard £25.10 + £17.55 = £42.65.
Anyone able to travel offpeak in one direction will save money using PAYG, PAC £25.10 + POC £10.90 = £36.00
Last edited:
I don't think flexi pricing is going to do anything for folks hoping for a reduction on the cost of their annual season ticket.
I just ran the numbers, and flexi tickets on my usual route into London are a couple of quid a year cheaper than an annual season ticket. I can't imagine any rail traveller going from an annual season ticket pre-pandemic considers this cost effective from a consumer standpoint. Rather, it looks like a 2.5x doubling of the cost-per-day, approximately, for part time commuters.
Think I shall be telling the boss I'm moving to a Scottish isle and going full remote at this rate.
I just ran the numbers, and flexi tickets on my usual route into London are a couple of quid a year cheaper than an annual season ticket. I can't imagine any rail traveller going from an annual season ticket pre-pandemic considers this cost effective from a consumer standpoint. Rather, it looks like a 2.5x doubling of the cost-per-day, approximately, for part time commuters.
Think I shall be telling the boss I'm moving to a Scottish isle and going full remote at this rate.
The specific journey I have been waiting for details on has never offered season tickets, but currently has a West Midlands Trains "flexcarnet" product offering 10% discount on the anytime return for 10 tickets to be used within 2 months.
The new flexible season ticket surprisingly is available for this journey, so presumably the flexcarnet is on the way out. As with examples posted by others, a discount of 12.5% to be used within 28 days. Slightly cheaper per day, but with a more restrictive time limit. This has presumably been chosen as it works out as 8 days for the price of 7.
The positive for me on the new ticket is that it's a smart product. The old flexcarnet requires a visit to a manned ticket office, but there is no ticket office at either the origin or destination, so meaning a faff every month or two. The new ticket should be achievable with a few taps on my phone.
What will probably end up putting me off it is the restrictive time limit. I will probably be travelling to the office a maximum of twice a week, sometimes less, even before accounting for any periods of leave. So if I miss one day there's no discount at all, and more than one day the new product would be more costly than the anytime return.
That's £16.80 per day, so not too bad.
Last edited:
In this example, I think the problem might be that someone who works five days a week thinks they pay £12.60 per day.
Someone who works 2 days a week might expect to pay the same, so a Flexi season would be about £100. However, theymight still appreciate a saving of £25 or so every four weeks.
Personally, I'm going to be working Flexi Furlough until September, and was thinking of getting one of these either instead of an annual ticket or as an 8 in 28 day rover for travel on days off.
No surprises here. A carnet that offers a piddling ~10% discount on daily tickets isn't even remotely close to being a "flexi season", especially with the rather onerous 8 in 28 restriction.
Hopefully there is a sufficient revolt to force the DfT and Treasury to think again.
Hopefully there is a sufficient revolt to force the DfT and Treasury to think again.
Yes, they will effectively be daily season tickets between A and B on each day they're activated - valid until 04:29am the next day, valid for break of journey and unlimited usage.
Fawkes Cat
Established Member
- Joined
- 8 May 2017
- Messages
- 2,996
For Bootle to Manchester, it's £144.20 (£18.02 per day) against £20.60 for an anytime day return. So around 11.7% off from Bootle. A rather smaller reduction for a different fare which is also valid.
If I know that I will be going in to the office two days a week for the next four weeks it will be worth it. But if I have leave booked it won't. So it's not total simplicity (my Flexi expires: I buy a new one). And if Merseyrail turn out not to be keen on smart cards (I don't know that they're not, but they can be idiosyncratic over all-railway products: one for another thread I think) then that may be the decider to stay with day tickets.
If I know that I will be going in to the office two days a week for the next four weeks it will be worth it. But if I have leave booked it won't. So it's not total simplicity (my Flexi expires: I buy a new one). And if Merseyrail turn out not to be keen on smart cards (I don't know that they're not, but they can be idiosyncratic over all-railway products: one for another thread I think) then that may be the decider to stay with day tickets.
telstarbox
Established Member
I think a rail equivalent of Tesco Clubcard / frequent flyers would be well understood by passengers though. Something like you earn 5p credit per £1 spent on anytime fares and 2p on off-peaks and advances? Then you get a "free" day every so often when you redeem the credit. That would be more flexible than part time season tickets and commuters wouldn't need to commit to an "X days in Y" pattern.
The Gold Card dates from the 80s (?) and the IT systems have moved on massively since then so it could all be bundled into a Great British Railways app.
I understand what you're saying, but ultimately passengers are looking for something that is really simple and easy to understand. Their alternative is typically to turn the ignition in their car, which doesn't require them to think about loyalty points.
Ultimately account based ticketing with capping is going to be the solution, so you don't have to decide how often you're going to travel before you travel to get the best deal.
And I think rail travel is different to supermarkets - they want to "feel" like they are getting good value here and now, not some months down the line.
MadCommuter
Member
- Joined
- 4 Oct 2010
- Messages
- 630
It's the lack of flexibility that is the issue here. Many employers have finally woken up to flexible working but this ticket isn't up to the job. I still don't know what my office pattern will be, but all indications are that office attendance will be for face to face work not face to screen work. Whether that translates to exactly 8 days in 28, remains to be seen.
Still, irrelevant to me as this hasn't been rolled out to Scotland yet.
Still, irrelevant to me as this hasn't been rolled out to Scotland yet.
The season ticket calculator on the national rail website isn't a nice experience.
It now presents as a widget within the page and where there results are presented it isn't wholly obvious you may need scroll the widget to see everything.
It also only seems to present the flex seasons if you choose to travel twice a week or less - otherwise the flexis are hidden unless you select 'show all ticket options' in the results.
It now presents as a widget within the page and where there results are presented it isn't wholly obvious you may need scroll the widget to see everything.
It also only seems to present the flex seasons if you choose to travel twice a week or less - otherwise the flexis are hidden unless you select 'show all ticket options' in the results.
You'd almost want the Flexi season price to be a "base" price, and then subsequent journeys in the month to be charged per day above this at a diminishing rate, capping at the cost of the monthly ticket.
*That* would be "flexible".
Apologies if this question has been answered up-thread, but I didn't see it and the FAQ on Nation Rail Enquiries does not address it either.
Is the 28-day period set in stone? i.e. I plan to use my ticket 2 days a week, but stuff happens at work resulting in the 8 days being burned up in, say, 3 weeks. Can I purchase another Flexi straightaway even though the 28 day period of the previous ticket has yet to expire?
Is the 28-day period set in stone? i.e. I plan to use my ticket 2 days a week, but stuff happens at work resulting in the 8 days being burned up in, say, 3 weeks. Can I purchase another Flexi straightaway even though the 28 day period of the previous ticket has yet to expire?
- Status