Flying Scotsman

[James_D]

My video of the Flying Scotsman pulling into Durham from today. Apologies if that's not the 'done' thing on here! but enjoy.

 

[jonty14]

My video of the Flying Scotsman pulling into Durham from today. Apologies if that's not the 'done' thing on here! but enjoy.

Nice clip. I don't condone trespass on the railways by anyone but the anti enthusiast mentality on this forum is getting worse. Is this forum for enthusiasts and professionals or just for the latter. Not all enthusiasts are the evil anti Christ that a few members on this forum think so!

 

[800001]

My video of the Flying Scotsman pulling into Durham from today. Apologies if that's not the 'done' thing on here! but enjoy.

Good video

 

[tbtc]

This thread is great, if only for DarloRich's use of the word "kettleistas"

Many folks have paid to have Flying Scotsman restored. Most enthusiasts are sensible and know not to go inside the fence. The problems were caused by the general public

Do we know that most of the troublemakers were non-enthusiasts?

It's convenient to blame "normals", but I don't buy it, sorry. Look at the behaviour of enthusiasts at other steam services, idiots getting dangerously close to the track for the sake of a picture...

Don,t jump to concussions before calling people what they are not and my thoughts are not a conspiracy theory, I think you will find that there are plenty high up managers in the company that you work for would love to find away to remove steam and diesel specials if they had there way as it does,t fit the image anymore.

It may be a conspiracy, it may not... but if people at Network Rail wanted to ban steam services then:

(a) ...would you blame them, given the disruption that they can cause (mass trespass, delays where the party at fault don't pay the true cost to TOCs, operators with a cavalier attitude to Health 'n' Safety)? The railway is a twenty first century workplace (rather than a museum) - steam services are non-essential and if they become too much trouble then I wouldn't be surprised.

(b) ...a minority of enthusiasts are giving them a great excuse to stigmatise steam services - a massive own goal.

I was a football fan in the '80s, when the actions of some idiots gave the whole scene a bad reputation - I was realistic enough to recognise this and distance myself from the nonsense.

If the BTP had done the job for which they are paid, one of their functions being to prevent trespass, all this nonsense would have been avoided after the first outing of Flying Scotsman

How do you police hundreds of miles of ECML (including level crossings etc) to stop people getting onto the track, especially people who break through whatever fencing is already there to try to get their "perfect" shot?

How many BTP Officers would you devote to policing these hundreds of miles of track (instead of dealing with the everyday problems of policing the railway)?

I don't think this is BTP's fault.

Yes the trespass incidents were not good, but it wasn't rocket science to realise that having the Scotmans first run for instance on one of the railways most major routes on a weekday was frankly asking for trouble.

Eh?

Are you saying that there would have been fewer trespassers at the weekend (i.e. a time when fewer people are at work and more people therefore have the leisure time to go photographing)?

How would a Saturday trip have stopped people finding the free time to go looking for Flying Scotsman?

 

[D1009]

Don,t jump to concussions before calling people what they are not and my thoughts are not a conspiracy theory, I think you will find that there are plenty high up managers in the company that you work for would love to find away to remove steam and diesel specials if they had there way as it does,t fit the image anymore.

So how do you explain Network Rail and GWR collaborating at senior level to give D1015 on its planned Paddington - Plymouth non stop run a clear road from Airport Jn to Plymouth last Saturday? The train arrived at Plymouth 20 mins early, by the way.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

PiThe foot crossing near Tollerton. Spotted one guy stood on correct side of fence with his camera tripod on wrong side of fence, police helicopter hovering overhead taking a keen interest in his setup......

 

[STEVIEBOY1]

My video of the Flying Scotsman pulling into Durham from today. Apologies if that's not the 'done' thing on here! but enjoy.

Great video there.

 

[BRblue]

Nice clip. I don't condone trespass on the railways by anyone but the anti enthusiast mentality on this forum is getting worse. Is this forum for enthusiasts and professionals or just for the latter. Not all enthusiasts are the evil anti Christ that a few members on this forum think so!

I'm afraid the enthusiasts don't do themselves any favours though when they start to tell the professionals how to do their job and how a professional railway should bend over backwards to accommodate a few steam specials (compared to the amount of normal services).
Maybe you need to consider the fact that a lot of the individuals on here could be the ones having to deal with the aftermath should there be an incident, hence the reason they get so prickly about it.

 

[freelander]

After reading through this thread and very interesting it is, and how wide and varied the views of the members I can only see one way out to solve the issue with all parties is too BAN all rail tours from the main line, this would include steam, electric and diesel. if you want to see your interests be it steam, diesel or electric go to a preserved railway were you can get the photos, video or what else your needs. yes its nice to see locos on the main line under their own power but they can be seen at preserved railways around the country. is that not what the preserved railways and restoration of locos were designed for.

freelander.

 

[DarloRich]

After reading through this thread and very interesting it is, and how wide and varied the views of the members I can only see one way out to solve the issue with all parties is too BAN all rail tours from the main line, this would include steam, electric and diesel. if you want to see your interests be it steam, diesel or electric go to a preserved railway were you can get the photos, video or what else your needs. yes its nice to see locos on the main line under their own power but they can be seen at preserved railways around the country. is that not what the preserved railways and restoration of locos were designed for.

freelander.

that is certainly not my view. I love seeing a steam train flying along the main line and it brings a lot of pleasure to those who travel on them.

What I DO want is a safe operation that complies with the same rules real trains have to comply with and that people watching the steam trains stay behind the fence.

 

[lincolnshire]

This thread is great, if only for DarloRich's use of the word "kettleistas"

The trouble is some people on here jump to conclusion as to there position on a subject and then indirectly insult people which if it was in the work place would be a case for bullying and harassment, they should think first before passing comment.

It may be a conspiracy, it may not... but if people at Network Rail wanted to ban steam services then:

(a) ...would you blame them, given the disruption that they can cause (mass trespass, delays where the party at fault don't pay the true cost to TOCs, operators with a cavalier attitude to Health 'n' Safety)? The railway is a twenty first century workplace (rather than a museum) - steam services are non-essential and if they become too much trouble then I wouldn't be surprised.

(b) ...a minority of enthusiasts are giving them a great excuse to stigmatise steam services - a massive own goal.

I totally agree with your two points above but my first comment is not a so-called conspiracy theory as described its just my views on the subject.
We will just have to wait and see if I am correct or not, we might have to wait a few years.

 

[linesider]

My video of the Flying Scotsman pulling into Durham from today. Apologies if that's not the 'done' thing on here! but enjoy.

Great video and good luck tonight!

 

[Deepgreen]

After reading through this thread and very interesting it is, and how wide and varied the views of the members I can only see one way out to solve the issue with all parties is too BAN all rail tours from the main line, this would include steam, electric and diesel. if you want to see your interests be it steam, diesel or electric go to a preserved railway were you can get the photos, video or what else your needs. yes its nice to see locos on the main line under their own power but they can be seen at preserved railways around the country. is that not what the preserved railways and restoration of locos were designed for.

freelander.

well you wont see electrics at preserved railways anywhere in britain and steam or diesel at no more than 40mph so main line tours give opportunities to experience heritage stock at speed its good to celebrate the history of the railways by permitting such tours especially given the litigous regime of today

sorry couldnt be bothered with capitalisation or punctuation! (except this one).

 

[DarloRich]

The trouble is some people on here jump to conclusion as to there position on a subject and then indirectly insult people which if it was in the work place would be a case for bullying and harassment, they should think first before passing comment.

My response IS me thinking about the rules of this site. I am not allowed to be as blunt as I would like to be.

I totally agree with your two points above but my first comment is not a so-called conspiracy theory as described its just my views on the subject.
We will just have to wait and see if I am correct or not, we might have to wait a few years.

So no evidence then - just your view.

Do you accept the points about safe operation, competence management, trespass, safety culture etc etc. Read the Wooton Basset report. It is shocking. THAT kind of behaviour WILL get steam banned pdq.

 

[infobleep]

I thought there was a move away from caring about safety, if the GTR dispute is anything to go by. Or is that only the case when it suits whoever is in a position of power for it to suit?

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[DarloRich]

I thought there was a move away from caring about safety, if the GTR dispute is anything to go by. Or is that only the case when it suits whoever is in a position of power for it to suit?

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

I am not sure anyone from GTR wants to see people run over by train or seeks to operate their trains in contravention of the rule book :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

 

[ryan125hst]

Getting back on topic, I think it's a shame that this is how it has to be done. After all the money put into getting the loco back on the mainline and with all the public support, they can't be told the times she'll be running. I understand the issues of overcrowding and trespass, but it's sad that this is how it's ended up.

I saw her yesterday which was fantastic, but they attached her in York Holgate sidings and not in the station as they usually do with steam locos. She was at the station for only a few minutes before heading to Newcastle. On the return, people didn't have much time to get photos before she headed off to the sidings and returned through platform 11 (caught me out as it was booked through 9 ) without stopping. It all felt a bit rushed to me, as if they wanted to get her out of the way as quickly as possible. I can see why they feel the need to do this, but it makes me disappointed all the same, in the same way that the final flights of Vulcan were filled with warnings of not going to Doncaster over fears of it getting too busy, and how her final flight was secret until 30 minutes before she took off.

I hope that, while she will always be more popular than other steam locos, things will calm down and next year the rail tours will be more normal without all of these trespass fears.

The times are on RTT for Saturday and Tuesday though

 

[Graeme]

Whilst watching from a bridge parapet a few miles north of Darlington yesterday, I noticed the local police helicopter made a reasonably low pass along the line in advance, presumably looking out for trespassers. One chap walked across a field to get a line-side fence view but at least he stayed on the right side of the fence itself.

 

[Harbornite]

I think the best method for dealing with this is to only publish the times on RTT (which has evidently been done) and on the railtour operators' websites after tickets have been booked. Newspapers and news sites should be dissuaded from publishing information about itineraries featuring the locomotive. This will obviously reduce the publicity for the Flying Scotsman's workings and therefore will reduce the trespass risk as less people will go out and see it. I can see the logic of hiding information, at the end of the day the railway isn't run for enthusiasts.

 

[adrock1976]

Just like we don't know which Muslims might be thinking of blowing us up then? Should be place restrictions on them?

I perceive that to be a racist comment.

Please retract.

 

[Carntyne]

that is certainly not my view. I love seeing a steam train flying along the main line and it brings a lot of pleasure to those who travel on them.

What I DO want is a safe operation that complies with the same rules real trains have to comply with and that people watching the steam trains stay behind the fence.

My view too. it's amazing to see the excitement created by a steam engine and work during a run.

It must be done safely though. If not then it can't be allowed. People must respect the railway.

 

[johnr57]

PiThe foot crossing near Tollerton. Spotted one guy stood on correct side of fence with his camera tripod on wrong side of fence, police helicopter hovering overhead taking a keen interest in his setup......

I was at Tollerton - which footpath do you mean? the one just to the north of the Bridge or the one further north. I was on the wrong side of the fence, on the footpath but hard up against the fence - but no tripod. sat on the stile!

yes the helicopter was flying up and down a lot, police on most of the bridges. had a pleasant conversation with some network rail staff who had no idea of times but knew FS was on its way. also gave sensible advice as to keeping safe

 

[silverfoxcc]

Hopefully the authorities will not get too Draconian in the enforcement of a tripod just over the fence when the operator is the 'right side' I have done that several times as the chicken wire buggers up the focus!

All those who dont know or flout the rules legal or common sense wise for whatever reason, should be heavily fined.

 

[DarloRich]

Hopefully the authorities will not get too Draconian in the enforcement of a tripod just over the fence when the operator is the 'right side' I have done that several times as the chicken wire buggers up the focus!

All those who dont know or flout the rules legal or common sense wise for whatever reason, should be heavily fined.

but not you eh?

 

[6Gman]

I personally agree with the above post, as far as I can see it will be Network Rails best excuse to ban all steam specials from main lines in the country before moving onto diesel specials and only ones left will be such as VSOE Pullmans, Northern Belle & Royal Scotsman that will be able to run on the main lines. Some maybe be allowed to run on certain routes where train delays etc will not cause big problems, if they had there way all will be banned on there lines.

There will be people on here to poo, poo what i say but thats my own opinion, lets just wait and see.

Well, as somebody who was delayed for an hour by a WCRC working a few weeks ago, I can see NR's point of view ...

 

[grumblingalong]

I'm curious as to what difference there is between "amateur spotters/idiots" and 'professional spotters/idiots'?

I would have thought it was quite obvious but apparently not. As previously discussed a lot of the issues with the inaugural run were "amateur spotters/idiots" who had seen it on the news and decided to go and stand in the 4 foot.

Someone with an interest in railways, a "professional spotter" would most likely be more aware of their surroundings.

 

[Deepgreen]

I perceive that to be a racist comment.

Please retract.

I perceive nothing of the sort from the comment - it is saying that not everyone from any one community should be treated as guilty of the crimes of a tiny minority claiming to be from that community. It just so happens that Islam has been adopted as their basis by the terrorists causing most damage of late. In decades gone by it might just as well have mentioned Irish people in the same context.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Hopefully the authorities will not get too Draconian in the enforcement of a tripod just over the fence when the operator is the 'right side' I have done that several times as the chicken wire buggers up the focus!

All those who dont know or flout the rules legal or common sense wise for whatever reason, should be heavily fined.

Well, just be aware that any infringements all add to the pressure to impose more and more restrictions on information and, indeed, possibly on the number of special trains actually run. Even a tripod over a fence may not go down well with some.

 

[northern156]

I perceive that to be a racist comment.

Please retract.

Islam is not a race

 

[Bletchleyite]

Islam is not a race

Even if it were, and it's a bit insensitive, it is true that most terrorists threatening the UK presently call themselves Islamic, even if it is a fact that the vast majority of Muslims are not terrorists.

 

[rangersql]

A quick question from a newcomer to your site, "If I'm on York Station at 1450 on Saturday, will I see the Flying Scotsman preparing to depart for Edinburgh?"