Future of TransPennine Express?

[Bletchleyite]

Apart from further separating out suburban services, I wonder if it is worth considering whether there are any routes that would be better off transferred from TPE to Northern or vice versa? E.g. the fast Leeds-Manchester via Bradford could fit better under Transpennine, and there is arguably little justification for intercity-standard trains to be serving Redcar.

Under GBR I'd have 2tph Liverpool-Newcastle fast as true InterCity services using long trains (e.g. 9 or 10 car 80x) and with full on-board service - basically the same as LNER. Similarly the WCML services would change to using as long trains as possible that can be accommodated at Manchester Airport (807s would probably be perfect) and move to the InterCity West Coast operation.

The rest would just go to Northern/Regional Railways/whatever it ends up being called as regional expresses, along with the 185s to operate them, being broadly similar to the Barrow/Windermere and the likes in concept - particularly south TPE. Though that said I could see a case for a fast Liverpool-Nottingham once an hour using 5-car 80x as a true InterCity service.

 

[SamCam]

Under GBR I'd have 2tph Liverpool-Newcastle fast as true InterCity services using long trains (e.g. 9 or 10 car 80x) and with full on-board service - basically the same as LNER. Similarly the WCML services would change to using as long trains as possible that can be accommodated at Manchester Airport (807s would probably be perfect) and move to the InterCity West Coast operation.

The rest would just go to Northern/Regional Railways/whatever it ends up being called as regional expresses, along with the 185s to operate them, being broadly similar to the Barrow/Windermere and the likes in concept - particularly south TPE. Though that said I could see a case for a fast Liverpool-Nottingham once an hour using 5-car 80x as a true InterCity service.

That makes a lot of sense - though I do think sone other places in the northeast deserve better connections to Manchester than a regional service, so I would be tempted to keep those by diverting one of the Newcastle-bound services every two hours to Middlesbrough (and maybe even one to Hull as well).

 

[frodshamfella]

An improved Liverpool - Scotland service would seem an obvious one to me.

 

[Bletchleyite]

An improved Liverpool - Scotland service would seem an obvious one to me.

One option would be to make the Scottish services ten-car north of Preston and to split there for Liverpool and Manchester, though I suspect you could probably fill a ten-car just from Manchester at the right price.

Perhaps the best approach would be for all Glasgows (typically quieter) to do Liverpool and Manchester, but the Edinburghs to only do Manchester as this is a more popular destination. That would give Liverpool two-hourly to Scotland which is an improvement on now.

 

[frodshamfella]

One option would be to make the Scottish services ten-car north of Preston and to split there for Liverpool and Manchester, though I suspect you could probably fill a ten-car just from Manchester at the right price.

Perhaps the best approach would be for all Glasgows (typically quieter) to do Liverpool and Manchester, but the Edinburghs to only do Manchester as this is a more popular destination. That would give Liverpool two-hourly to Scotland which is an improvement on now.

Would be a start.

 

[Meerkat]

Mayors/PTEs should get their own branding, with all/most trains that cross borders get TPE branding. TPE is well known and understood; ‘Regional Express’ is bland and non-descriptive.
How you run them is secondary. To me it seems too much to all be under a GBR Northern management, and in particular the North Eastern bit seems very separate.

 

[A S Leib]

Mayors/PTEs should get their own branding, with all/most trains that cross borders get TPE branding.

Including cases such as Lancashire if / when it gets a mayor, given that I think Preston – Blackpool South, Ormskirk and Colne are the only services which don't leave Lancashire (including Blackpool and Blackburn with Darwen).

 

[LittleAH]

Mayors/PTEs should get their own branding, with all/most trains that cross borders get TPE branding. TPE is well known and understood; ‘Regional Express’ is bland and non-descriptive.
How you run them is secondary. To me it seems too much to all be under a GBR Northern management, and in particular the North Eastern bit seems very separate.

Problem being, most of Manchester services don’t just serve what is now TfGM. Welcome to the modern world where commuter routes are cross boundary.

 

[Manutd1999]

Problem being, most of Manchester services don’t just serve what is now TfGM. Welcome to the modern world where commuter routes are cross boundary.

Is it really a problem if TfGM control routes such as Manchester-Southport/Stoke/Crewe?

With a bit of trust on all sides, backed up by suitable protections built into any devolution agreement to ensure the services are maintained, it could work perfectly well?

The majority of passengers using those services are heading to/from Manchester anyway, so would probably quite like the option of integrating their ticket with a tram journey afterwards.

 

[LittleAH]

Is it really a problem if TfGM control routes such as Manchester-Southport/Stoke/Crewe?

With a bit of trust on all sides, backed up by suitable protections built into any devolution agreement to ensure the services are maintained, it could work perfectly well?

The majority of passengers using those services are heading to/from Manchester anyway, so would probably quite like the option of integrating their ticket with a tram journey afterwards.

Andy burnham and rail outside of Manchester. Not a chance

 

[YorksLad12]

Problem being, most of Manchester services don’t just serve what is now TfGM. Welcome to the modern world where commuter routes are cross boundary.

Not modern at all, it was like that in the 1980s and 1990s as well. WY-branded units often went into SY and GM. Some units were dual branded, with a WY logo at one end and a SY one on the other.