Open top 80
Member
The open tops change there timetable tomorrow (18/9) 80 withdraw for the winter: 70 is scaled back to operate from East Cliff to Alum Chines
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OptareOlympus
Member
Crane is in Swanage on Monday fitting the remaining 17xx roofs. The14xx and 18xx will still be open top tomorrow but not necessarily on Breezer 60/70 workings as they will now include schools. They are set to appear on several routes and workings until they are all re-roofed later in the week.
At a guess the 13 fleet would be supported by ex uni deckers along with the 5 which is also getting some of the new 400mmc's.
A mix of 28 e200 mmc from Swindon and morebus will have a short stint in Manchester. 18 of those will end up in the Bluestar fleet. The rest will be used to upgrade 1a 1b 1c and obviously allow for removal of older vehicles.
Also 7 Scanias from the isle of white will be freed up soon.
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Thanks for the info Dorsetbus.
I wonder what will happen when Oxford receives its Electric fleet?
Presumably the various Go Ahead operating companies can 'bid' for the redundant diesels?
buscoaster
Member
Thanks for replies. Even an open top on the m1 today!
Fleet standardisation should accour after the 49 400MMCs arrive
Also got my figures wrong 10 e200 MMCs will be off to bluestar with 18 returning to Morebus.
As for Oxford its anyones guess. But my guess would be on Swindon getting some good hand me downs.
Will be interesting to see what approach Swindon Bus Company go after the Double Deckers on the 5 route. Does anyone have any feedback on how this is going?
Upgraded Double Deckers are needed for the school runs in near future and to fill in rush hour additional buses.
Dependant on what Swindon Bus Company decide to do with the 57,08 and 59 plate Scanias could potentially be a big turnover of buses in next couple of years.
Go South Coast currently have 25 Trident/East Lancs Olympus dual door from London General in service, as per 'bustimes' today - 6 at swindon, 4 at Salisbury, 6 at Bluestar & 7 at Southern Vectis. All are Euro 6 compliant/modified.
Variously described as on loan (isle of Wight festival, seasonal - waiting for the open tops to have their roofs fitted in the next couple of weeks, extra routes/contracts).
Also described in some sources as 'disposed' - so are they temp' loans, permanent transfers or maybe country wide 'floating spares' ?
It would be nice to see the whole lot painted blue for Bluestar and replace the older Volvo/Scania deckers.
Variously described as on loan (isle of Wight festival, seasonal - waiting for the open tops to have their roofs fitted in the next couple of weeks, extra routes/contracts).
Also described in some sources as 'disposed' - so are they temp' loans, permanent transfers or maybe country wide 'floating spares' ?
It would be nice to see the whole lot painted blue for Bluestar and replace the older Volvo/Scania deckers.
Temporary on loan. Not sure how long. But with added work that blue star and morebus have and slow to arrive new vehicles I Wouldn't expect the to disappear quickly.
Wychwood93
Member
Showing on the bustimes Bluestar list at the moment:
Working the 14 and 15 today.
Saw three "non-native" liveries simultaneously in Southampton city centre today: the above More 260 working presumably a 20 (it was at the 20 stand), one of the London double deckers on the 19 (and displaying traditional roller blinds in London font!) and Southern Vectis-liveried 1131 double decker on the 1203 round trip on the 13, which then went out of service (which I believe is booked).
I don't think the Southern Vectis vehicle working for Bluestar has been mentioned on here yet?
The 19 also seems to be more of a mixed bag than earlier in the year: formerly it was the preserve of the ex-North East vehicles, now it seems to have more of an assortment of double deckers.
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As a matter of curiosity, what’s the logic in having Vectis liveried vehicles running around Southampton and then London liveried stock on the Island? Would it not make sense to dispatch the Vectis stuff back over the water instead?!
A few other changes I've noticed since earlier in the summer on Bluestar, having been out of the area for a couple of months.
The 1 seems to have reverted to being mostly self-contained, with its own branded E400s operating almost all journeys: in the past 12 months or so (maybe longer) there were one or two diagrams where the 1 and 2 swapped over. The 1710 out of Southampton was one which featured an older bus regularly earlier in the year, and it had been working 2s most of the day. Presumably there was a driver hours reason for the former swap-around.
The 1755 out of Southampton is still the exception, regularly operated with an older bus - I think this comes off the short working from Asda which arrives around 1730, but need to check.
The 20 seems to be more of a random mix of vehicles: formerly purely E200s on Mon-Fri school term times, it now features other "import" single deckers and a couple (?) of the diagrams have gone over to double deckers, presumably those which include particularly busy journeys at some point in the day. It also had the "more" vehicle (260) three days this week, but not on the same diagram.
I believe that a sixth vehicle has been introduced to the route in the evening peak to allow the off-peak 15-min frequency to be maintained, presumably off a school or college service (haven't checked bustimes yet to find out).
The 19 also features additional vehicles in the evening peak, indeed (and this is a rarity these days) actually sees a frequency uplift eastbound for a time in the evening peak.
Not so good is the increased "traffic lag" in the evening peak on the 9, which loses 20 mins or so (00/30 to 20/50, IIRC). Looks like they could do with introducing an extra vehicle off a school or college working on this route, too.
Finally, Empress Road and Eastleigh seem to have given up on showing working numbers on the front of the buses. Totton still do, however.
The 1 seems to have reverted to being mostly self-contained, with its own branded E400s operating almost all journeys: in the past 12 months or so (maybe longer) there were one or two diagrams where the 1 and 2 swapped over. The 1710 out of Southampton was one which featured an older bus regularly earlier in the year, and it had been working 2s most of the day. Presumably there was a driver hours reason for the former swap-around.
The 1755 out of Southampton is still the exception, regularly operated with an older bus - I think this comes off the short working from Asda which arrives around 1730, but need to check.
The 20 seems to be more of a random mix of vehicles: formerly purely E200s on Mon-Fri school term times, it now features other "import" single deckers and a couple (?) of the diagrams have gone over to double deckers, presumably those which include particularly busy journeys at some point in the day. It also had the "more" vehicle (260) three days this week, but not on the same diagram.
I believe that a sixth vehicle has been introduced to the route in the evening peak to allow the off-peak 15-min frequency to be maintained, presumably off a school or college service (haven't checked bustimes yet to find out).
The 19 also features additional vehicles in the evening peak, indeed (and this is a rarity these days) actually sees a frequency uplift eastbound for a time in the evening peak.
Not so good is the increased "traffic lag" in the evening peak on the 9, which loses 20 mins or so (00/30 to 20/50, IIRC). Looks like they could do with introducing an extra vehicle off a school or college working on this route, too.
Finally, Empress Road and Eastleigh seem to have given up on showing working numbers on the front of the buses. Totton still do, however.
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Wychwood93
Member
Morebus - as of now there are 22 of the new ADL Enviro400 MMC for the M1/M2 in service.
Bustimes shows: https://bustimes.org/operators/morebus/vehicles
Bustimes shows: https://bustimes.org/operators/morebus/vehicles
Southampton network seems an absolute shower today, owing to the football traffic. Certainly 1s & 2s have spent the day running around in convoy with enormous gaps in the service, I presume similar issues abound elsewhere.
It really does show the importance of proactive controllers and, crucially, a radio network to allow their decisions to be put into action. I was surprised to learn only a few weeks ago that Bluestar have no radios, and instead appear to be entirely reliant on drivers calling control on their mobiles - in that particular instance a bus had failed, and the driver was unable to get any response to his numerous calls. Busy urban bus networks really shouldn’t be run via drivers leaving voicemails! A very poor show indeed today on what was a busy Saturday for bus users, and with an event that is regular and really ought to have been sufficiently planned for. Resiliance seems sorely lacking!
It really does show the importance of proactive controllers and, crucially, a radio network to allow their decisions to be put into action. I was surprised to learn only a few weeks ago that Bluestar have no radios, and instead appear to be entirely reliant on drivers calling control on their mobiles - in that particular instance a bus had failed, and the driver was unable to get any response to his numerous calls. Busy urban bus networks really shouldn’t be run via drivers leaving voicemails! A very poor show indeed today on what was a busy Saturday for bus users, and with an event that is regular and really ought to have been sufficiently planned for. Resiliance seems sorely lacking!
fgwrich
Established Member
I'm not sure how many Vectis vehicles are currently working in the Southampton area, but over the last week I've seen single deck Scania's, double deck Scania's and E400s all working Bluestar services. Most are still fully branded for the Island too.
I noticed that too. Also very busy, though the city centre was unusually busy (almost reminiscent of early summer or Christmas) even without the football.
I do wonder whether Bluestar could implement a contingency timetable on days when the football is on, as these delays are par for the course, particularly in the normal case where the football finishes around 4.30pm. (Strangely, it was on very early today and over by 3pm, not sure why).
Such a contingency timetable (thinking of the 1 and 2 in particular, due to length of the journey) would much more time allowed for the inbound journey at the start of the match, and outbound journey at the end - and would thus involve a reduction of frequency while the match is on as some diagrams may have to miss one round trip - but at least it would be a published timetable that could be stuck to.
I also wonder whether they could divert the 1 and 2 along Bedford Place and Banister Road on matchdays after the end of the match. The main bottleneck seems to be London Road, which can add almost 30 mins to the time. After that, bus lanes help a great deal.
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The Scanias certianly seem to have made their way back and forth across the Solent over the years! I’m pretty sure Vectis have/had some former Bluestar examples, and there are certainly some former Vetcis HW plated machines in the Bluestar fleet (already there prior to recent events!); presumably the current former Vectis stock helping in Southampton isn’t expected to return to the Island?
WibbleWobble
Member
They use Ticketer messaging instead of radios.
Traffic generally is much higher this weekend due to a high number of cruise ships in port, on top of a home football fixture yesterday.
That would need a number of trees to be cut back, and the council isn't known for being particularly proactive when it comes to buses! This is a council that quickly removed bus lanes overnight when the Tories took control, and when Labour won it back a year later, did nothing to reverse that.
markymark2000
On Moderation
Ticketer messaging is useful for some things (control can send messages to drivers without calling as of course drivers can't answer their phone while driving) but on the down side, for drivers to explain a problem, typing a message back via Ticketer is painful. Radios and phone calls drivers can say what they want easier and can say it a lot quicker than then can type it meaning quicker resolutions. Radios as well, drivers can listen and respond while driving so even quicker results. It is expensive though. It's a system which is liked though as many areas still have and install radios. Liverpool and Manchester have radios for example and they use it for group calls for diversions, it's not used anywhere near as much as Ibus for example and you can't normally see any radio so you'll only know it exists if you hear it. It is somewhat common on Stagecoach Manchester to just endlessly hear 'Hyde Road Group Call'
Pros and cons to radio, Ticketer and mobile phones.
Having had operational experience of a busy urban network where all vehicles were fitted with radios, communication was frequent, instant and effective. I wasn’t aware of a messaging feature on Ticketer, but I’d imagine it’s a rather poor substitute.
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
Given that the 19** ones are now 22/23 years old, I doubt they’ll be around by the time that it’s an issue. Renumber the 1800s to join the other open tops in the 14** and that give 250 numbers for future deliveries
OptareOlympus
Member
The 14xx series denotes 'ferry compatible'. The 18xx, although convertible can't be used on the ferry. This was also why the Swanage depot Evosetis were in their own 17xx series. However, the new E400 MMC arrivals are also now numbered in the 17xx series despite not being ferry compatible.
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TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
Odd that they need a series for ferry compatible when W&D didn’t feel the need! Guess you could use the 13** of if desired