Have electric vehicles been "oversold" to the detriment of public transport, walking and cycling?

[skyhigh]

Quick charging also reduces the lifespan of batteries so you need to replace them more often. The electricity that will be needed to charge them is also never mentioned. It will take more than wind turbines and solar panels to charge up all the electric vehicles on our future roads.

I'm starting to get a feeling of deja vu on this thread. As previously mentioned, any car with a decent battery cooling system (I.e. not the Leaf) can rapid charge until the cows come home with no real ill effects. The battery will outlive the body of the car.

The electricity is never mentioned? It's been mentioned at least 3 times already on this thread....

Long distance driving is impossible with an ev.

Well I must have imagined driving 1600 miles in 2 weeks using only public charging then.

 

[DustyBin]

By the time petrol stations are getting inconveniently scarce, the acquisition cost of a secondhand EV will be similar to that of an equivalent IC car, - the running costs will be much lower, both because the infrastructure will be in place for the majority of motorists and government cost measures to drive the few IC cars off the road and the commercial disincentive to suply a miniscule market of resistant IC users will price them off the road. If the higher cost of IC vehicle use doesn't clear the roads, the increasing restrictions on where their pollution will be tolerated will actually prevent many journeys being completed.

This is where our views differ. I don’t see the need for draconian measures to make life difficult for IC engined car owners. Fuel costs will likely increase that is true, and there will probably be some city centres etc. where they are banned (although that may change once enough people are driving EVs) but that’s as far as it needs to go. I’m confident that whilst I’ll almost certainly have an EV as my daily driver in the next few years, I’ll also still be able to drive one of my IC engined cars whenever and wherever I like.

 

[Factotum]

How many of those times is someone well enough to drive? Not as many as should get a taxi or call an ambulance or just stay at home and not spread illnesses around.

My "emergencies" are difficulties in walking because of back problems. Those are neither infectious nor contagious and are not a problem when I am sitting down either in a chair at home or in a motor car.

If you are not well enough to walk to a local bus stop you should not be driving. Take a taxi. Sounds to me like you shouldn't really own any car. But if you do only do such a tiny mileage and it is non urban, getting your ICE off the road is not a priority.

(Exception would of course be if you have some sort of physical disability that varies by day but does not affect mental capacity in any way)

Are you offering to appoint yourself as my Doctor? If so, I will turn down the offer and stick with the one who agrees that it is quite safe for me to drive.
I have explained my problems
And I really don't appreciate your suggestion that my mental capacity is impaired. The inability to walk a full mile does not mean that one is incapable of driving.

And, in your typical assumption jumping rudeness, you are assuming that I would be the one who drives the car.

No one is suggesting you give up your ICE now and buy an EV now. The suggestion is that when it is time to get a brand new car - of which 2million people do every year - then an EV is likely to be a good choice now. And within a couple of years, a second hand EV will be a good choice for those who buy 2-4 year old cars.

I get the impression that the more evangelical EV supporters on this forum are suggesting just that: changing from ICE to EV.
As I have stated several times if my car expires before I do I will give I will almost certainly buy a used EV

 

[seagull]

Apart from those (including a couple on this thread) to whom BEVs are like a religion and they will brook not even the slightest criticism of any aspect of them, it seems most people (including myself) are relatively open to the concept in general but it's not quite at the stage of working financially or practically yet. Which is something time will address, I feel sure. At least until the "next Big Thing" comes along.

Back to horse and cart perhaps...

 

[87 027]

And so long as there are significant numbers of hybrids on the road into the 2030s, not to mention traditional vans, lorries and HGVs, I treat with some circumspection the view that traditional filling stations are going to die out sufficiently quickly to force people down the pure EV route. Taxes and low emission zones are another thing, but again I suspect anything perceived as too punitive that hits the less well-off hard in the pocket will meet with something of a voter backlash

 

[Bald Rick]

I get the impression that the more evangelical EV supporters on this forum are suggesting just that: changing from ICE to EV.

I’m not suggesting that, apologies if it appeared that way. I am suggesting that those looking for a new car now should at least check out BEVs though.

And so long as there are significant numbers of hybrids on the road into the 2030s, not to mention traditional vans, lorries and HGVs, I treat with some circumspection the view that traditional filling stations are going to die out sufficiently quickly to force people down the pure EV route. Taxes and low emission zones are another thing, but again I suspect anything perceived as too punitive that hits the less well-off hard in the pocket will meet with something of a voter backlash

I agree, with qualifications. The number of petrol stations in the country has been falling for years, and this will continue. However it will be a long time (30 years+) before it becomes difficult to find somewhere selling fuel locally.

 

[Hadleywood]

Right, so to be fair about this, i have just rented an electric car for a week, so as to give a genuine view from experience of a good number of miles at the wheel (1,452 miles in fact). We had a 2020 Leaf. Looked nice and modern.
So. Upsides included a nice quiet journey when we so fancied it, better acceleration, at least initially, than i expected, it was cheap to run of course and a had feeling of driving a simpler car with less parts to go wrong.
Downsides included a couple of times finding the charging bays occupied so we had to wait, a feeling that in the rural areas i live and frequent we are more likely to hit wildlife which can't hear us coming, especially at night, no character compared to even my wife's M140i, let alone my V10 and i still have the yearn for gear changes and the subsequent sound and fun that rising and falling rpm give you.
Old fashioned? Maybe. But just ask yourself this. I used to drive Deltics, 56s, 47s, 46s, 40s, 37s and many more diesels for a living. Were the 86 and 90 electrics i also drove more efficient? Of course.
But. I know which i'd want on my private railway line were i rich enough to own one though! A 55/56 or an 86/90? Behave!

 

[Bald Rick]

We had a 2020 Leaf.

And there’s the problem!

 

[DustyBin]

And there’s the problem!

Agreed, it’s not the most endearing of EVs! To be fair though, for a “petrol head” the concerns @Hadleywood raises would stand regardless had he been driving anything short of a Taycan. If you look at what I consider the next tier down (Model 3, Mach E etc.) they offer little from a driving perspective except impressive 0-60 times, and the novelty of that soon wears off even in a petrol engined car (which is why I drive a Focus RS and not an Audi RS3 for example, not that the former is exactly sluggish!). It is a serious point; there’s not much that can be done about the lack of gears and engine noise unfortunately, but hopefully we’ll start seeing some proper drivers EVs that don’t cost upwards of £100k in the near future.

 

[Pugwash]

I'm starting to get a feeling of deja vu on this thread. As previously mentioned, any car with a decent battery cooling system (I.e. not the Leaf) can rapid charge until the cows come home with no real ill effects. The battery will outlive the body of the car.

The electricity is never mentioned? It's been mentioned at least 3 times already on this thread....


Well I must have imagined driving 1600 miles in 2 weeks using only public charging then.

OK i'll bite,

All this appears to have gone very off topic.

Electric personal Cars still don't solve the basic problem with cars as transport, City Centre access is always going to be difficult due to congestion, why allow the finite resource of City Centre roads and parking space which could be repurposed to be filled with space inefficient vehicles.

If you are going to the edge of a city to get onto a park and ride bus or tram often times it is quicker to get a train or bus the entire way.

With heavily congested roads in towns and cities and the risk of hitting a cyclist on a rural road, driving a modern high performance sports car on the road increasingly feels out of touch.

 

[ashkeba]

All this appears to have gone very off topic.

yes. That does answer the question in one way because it shows that all the sales activity even among communities like this is about promoting electric cars and not electric bikes or human powered ones or walking. This is a surprise because of course putting an electric bike or scooter on trains is much more simple than putting electric cars on them. And we already put cycling and walking people on trains, even if some trains are bad at cycling ones.

If you are going to the edge of a city to get onto a park and ride bus or tram often times it is quicker to get a train or bus the entire way.

How often? Going from my side of Ely to the centre my nearest city (Cambridge) is 75min all by foot+bus (the number 9), or 85 by bus-train-bus because neither city's station is central. Google says it would take 23 min to drive to Milton P+R and then 10 min max wait for a 23 min bus journey, totallying 46-56 min. To Norwich is similar: 115 min bus-train compared to 90 min car-bus. Peterborough only has a seasonal P+R which brokers no comparison.

if you are not going to the centre and need to change buses, park and pedal or park and stride will often be faster than either but I think many cities discourage this. Cambridge is cool with it. Should more cities encourage park and e-bike/e-scooter?

 

[Hadleywood]

Just created a new thread to discuss this as I think it's quite interesting.


Indeed. Governments and car manufacturers have been foolish in the way they have portrayed electric cars as a "knight in shining armour" that will solve transport issues.
They solve point-of-use emissions, and reduce carbon footprint by means of whatever proportion of the national grid's generation comes from renewables, but they are still inefficient in terms of space and still use resources to produce, especially the batteries which are probably worse than petrol engines. They also still cause a lot of noise and road building/maintainence is still disruptive. And they're still expensive, more so than petrol cars.

Society needs to accept that while EVs are definitely an improvement they are NOT the be-all and end-all of environmentally friendly travel. EVs undoubtedly have a place, outside of cities and towns where providing public transport to everyone would be impractical. But we still need to be pushing people towards public transport where possible, especially if we're also electrifying that public transport. And - even more importantly - walking and cycling.

The original post has many good points in it.
Plus, making and disposing of huge numbers of batteries will be an onerous and messy, expensive task.
Renewables will never ever create all the power we need for an exploding human population and ever more cars on the roads of the country/world. Unless we make motoring too expensive for countless people of course and price them off the road...
Live and let live. Drive an EV if you want but don't insist everyone else agrees with you. Is everyone going to become vegan? No. Is everyone going to get a heat pump? No. Etc. Utopia ain't going to happen, well not your Utopia anyway.
Many supporters of EVs assume that a car is a necessary evil and simply a way of getting from A to B as a chore we have to do. Whereas i know personally over 100 people who use their car as their HOBBY, it's as important to them as watching football or fgs train spotting is for others. Indirectly via a motoring forum, i know of literally thousands of other people for whom a car is a pleasure with no connection with needing to get from A to B, they go to B because, simply, they CAN!
Road pricing will be savage for many people and we all know it's coming. Some honesty is needed, many people will be priced off the road and as usual the poorest people will be the hardest hit. I have no axe to grind on that one personally, as i am fortunate to be reasonably comfortably off so will reluctantly pay whatever road tolls we get given, but an all electric vehicle country will be extremely miserable for a stack of friends i have made over the decades via the car and motorcycle scene.
Shock horror for many, but we went to northern Scotland last week, 8 of us. We had my 615 bhp American V10, some friends went in their 2 Italian 4.5 litre V8s and the rest in 350-500 bhp hot hatchbacks. Ford and Audi. Totally irresponsible no doubt, in some eyes. But we had an incredible time. Great memories and we'll do it all again in spring.
UK produces 0.9% of the planet's pollution, so rather than people blocking UK motorways and preventing people going to hospital, school or work, worry far more about the REAL polluters, China for example building hundreds of coal power stations, look elsewhere generally because the UK cutting it's pollution by even half (very difficult) would make the difference a kid not weeing in the sea would. Well, maybe a bit more but the point is there. Look elsewhere. Because we are, pollution wise, dare i say it, a mere drop in the ocean.
Go and campaign against the REAL polluting nations. We are doing our bit in many ways already here. LIKE me cycling probably 3,000 miles a year, walking every single day and recycling absolutely everything we can do.
Then live a little and get yourself a sports car before you get banned from doing so, preferably a screaming naturally apsirated V8, V10 or V12. Heaven on wheels!

 

[DustyBin]

The original post has many good points in it.
Plus, making and disposing of huge numbers of batteries will be an onerous and messy, expensive task.
Renewables will never ever create all the power we need for an exploding human population and ever more cars on the roads of the country/world. Unless we make motoring too expensive for countless people of course and price them off the road...
Live and let live. Drive an EV if you want but don't insist everyone else agrees with you. Is everyone going to become vegan? No. Is everyone going to get a heat pump? No. Etc. Utopia ain't going to happen, well not your Utopia anyway.
Many supporters of EVs assume that a car is a necessary evil and simply a way of getting from A to B as a chore we have to do. Whereas i know personally over 100 people who use their car as their HOBBY, it's as important to them as watching football or fgs train spotting is for others. Indirectly via a motoring forum, i know of literally thousands of other people for whom a car is a pleasure with no connection with needing to get from A to B, they go to B because, simply, they CAN!
Road pricing will be savage for many people and we all know it's coming. Some honesty is needed, many people will be priced off the road and as usual the poorest people will be the hardest hit. I have no axe to grind on that one personally, as i am fortunate to be reasonably comfortably off so will reluctantly pay whatever road tolls we get given, but an all electric vehicle country will be extremely miserable for a stack of friends i have made over the decades via the car and motorcycle scene.
Shock horror for many, but we went to northern Scotland last week, 8 of us. We had my 615 bhp American V10, some friends went in their 2 Italian 4.5 litre V8s and the rest in 350-500 bhp hot hatchbacks. Ford and Audi. Totally irresponsible no doubt, in some eyes. But we had an incredible time. Great memories and we'll do it all again in spring.
UK produces 0.9% of the planet's pollution, so rather than people blocking UK motorways and preventing people going to hospital, school or work, worry far more about the REAL polluters, China for example building hundreds of coal power stations, look elsewhere generally because the UK cutting it's pollution by even half (very difficult) would make the difference a kid not weeing in the sea would. Well, maybe a bit more but the point is there. Look elsewhere. Because we are, pollution wise, dare i say it, a mere drop in the ocean.
Go and campaign against the REAL polluting nations. We are doing our bit in many ways already here. LIKE me cycling probably 3,000 miles a year, walking every single day and recycling absolutely everything we can do.
Then live a little and get yourself a sports car before you get banned from doing so, preferably a screaming naturally apsirated V8, V10 or V12. Heaven on wheels!

I totally agree with you in regard to cars being more than just a means of transport for a good number of people. This is why I brought up heritage railways during my previous debate with @AM9 as an example of a polluting but enjoyable hobby (and one in which I presumed we had a shared interest). Yes clean up everyday transport, but leave room for people to enjoy themselves.

Your trip to Scotland sounds fantastic, I suspect you may have had a Focus RS or two in the convoy?

 

[Bald Rick]

Renewables will never ever create all the power we need for an exploding human population and ever more cars on the roads of the country/world.

By definition, at some point 8n the future renewables (if you include Nuclear) must create all the power we need, as at some point we’ll run out of non-renewables... hence the name!

Road pricing will be savage for many people and we all know it's coming. Some honesty is needed, many people will be priced off the road and as usual the poorest people will be the hardest hit

Road pricing will be hard for some people, particularly those who do lots of mileage. But then we already have a distance/ fuel economy based road pricing now, it’s called fuel duty. Pretty blunt instrument of course, and road pricing, when it comes (which it will, probably shortly after the next election), will be much smarter. But the very poorest will be largely unaffected, as generally they don’t have cars.

As an aside, I love driving, and am rather looking forward to driving my EV when I collect it (in about two years time ). It will not be a Nissan!

 

[The Ham]

The original post has many good points in it.
Plus, making and disposing of huge numbers of batteries will be an onerous and messy, expensive task.
Renewables will never ever create all the power we need for an exploding human population and ever more cars on the roads of the country/world. Unless we make motoring too expensive for countless people of course and price them off the road...
Live and let live. Drive an EV if you want but don't insist everyone else agrees with you. Is everyone going to become vegan? No. Is everyone going to get a heat pump? No. Etc. Utopia ain't going to happen, well not your Utopia anyway.
Many supporters of EVs assume that a car is a necessary evil and simply a way of getting from A to B as a chore we have to do. Whereas i know personally over 100 people who use their car as their HOBBY, it's as important to them as watching football or fgs train spotting is for others. Indirectly via a motoring forum, i know of literally thousands of other people for whom a car is a pleasure with no connection with needing to get from A to B, they go to B because, simply, they CAN!
Road pricing will be savage for many people and we all know it's coming. Some honesty is needed, many people will be priced off the road and as usual the poorest people will be the hardest hit. I have no axe to grind on that one personally, as i am fortunate to be reasonably comfortably off so will reluctantly pay whatever road tolls we get given, but an all electric vehicle country will be extremely miserable for a stack of friends i have made over the decades via the car and motorcycle scene.
Shock horror for many, but we went to northern Scotland last week, 8 of us. We had my 615 bhp American V10, some friends went in their 2 Italian 4.5 litre V8s and the rest in 350-500 bhp hot hatchbacks. Ford and Audi. Totally irresponsible no doubt, in some eyes. But we had an incredible time. Great memories and we'll do it all again in spring.
UK produces 0.9% of the planet's pollution, so rather than people blocking UK motorways and preventing people going to hospital, school or work, worry far more about the REAL polluters, China for example building hundreds of coal power stations, look elsewhere generally because the UK cutting it's pollution by even half (very difficult) would make the difference a kid not weeing in the sea would. Well, maybe a bit more but the point is there. Look elsewhere. Because we are, pollution wise, dare i say it, a mere drop in the ocean.
Go and campaign against the REAL polluting nations. We are doing our bit in many ways already here. LIKE me cycling probably 3,000 miles a year, walking every single day and recycling absolutely everything we can do.
Then live a little and get yourself a sports car before you get banned from doing so, preferably a screaming naturally apsirated V8, V10 or V12. Heaven on wheels!

Whilst we directly produce a very low percentage of emissions there's a big question which needs to be asked, does that 0.9% count only our direct emissions or does it include all the emissions of all the stuff that we import from elsewhere?

However even then it's worth noting that if everyone says "we only produce x% of the emissions others should take the lead" then one of two things happen either those with larger populations say "we shouldn't as we only produce y% of the global average per person" and/or "why should we do anything when the rich nations aren't doing anything".

The good news is that on a per person the UK is broadly at the same level as the global average and so we can show how amongst many of the rich nations we are already leading the way.

However to get more to do more someone needs to take the lead and announce policy to better things. That in turn means that others follow suit.

For instance there's many countries which have net zero targets, they could on their own justify small impacts. However by them all doing something it has a significant impact.

In the same way that me getting rid of my car isn't going to have much of an impact, however 1,000 people saying they'll reduce their miles driven by 10% would have a much bigger impact even though the achievement by each person is much smaller than if I got rid of my car.

 

[DustyBin]

Whilst we directly produce a very low percentage of emissions there's a big question which needs to be asked, does that 0.9% count only our direct emissions or does it include all the emissions of all the stuff that we import from elsewhere?

However even then it's worth noting that if everyone says "we only produce x% of the emissions others should take the lead" then one of two things happen either those with larger populations say "we shouldn't as we only produce y% of the global average per person" and/or "why should we do anything when the rich nations aren't doing anything".

The good news is that on a per person the UK is broadly at the same level as the global average and so we can show how amongst many of the rich nations we are already leading the way.

However to get more to do more someone needs to take the lead and announce policy to better things. That in turn means that others follow suit.

For instance there's many countries which have net zero targets, they could on their own justify small impacts. However by them all doing something it has a significant impact.

In the same way that me getting rid of my car isn't going to have much of an impact, however 1,000 people saying they'll reduce their miles driven by 10% would have a much bigger impact even though the achievement by each person is much smaller than if I got rid of my car.

You’re right, somebody needs to take the lead here.

I think the west in general consumes far too much, and regardless of what we think of the CCP we really do need to stop buying so much tat from China. I try as far as possible to avoid anything made in China, and try and buy British or in some cases European made products. I do however appreciate that this is an expensive way of living and therefore prohibitive for some.

 

[Hadleywood]

There was a fella on the radio last week explaining about the materials and time that goes into making a battery for an EV. Not only is it very expensive and time consuming but uses masses of raw materials. He said EVs were certainly NOT the miracle cure many have been led to believe, just as i always suspected was the case.
Let's not be naive. Diesels a very short time ago were the answer to all our motoring woes and many of us bought the idea. I sold our Range Rover V8 supercharged petrol and got the 4.4 V8 supercharged diesel version, so as to do the ''right thing''. Next thing you know diesels are worse than Satan himself. Certainly worse than unleaded.
If you live in a flat or in housing that isn't charging friendly EVs are a nightmare. I'll get one when and only when it is illegal not to if i want to have the freedom of the road.
In the meantime, i've got a winter project off a mate. An environmentally unfriendly 1974 Jaguar E Type V12 which i will make immaculate over the next 7 or so months and the few journeys it makes next spring/summer even at 12 mpg will be wonderfully enjoyed.
Until the BIG world polluters change THEIR filthy outputs, i ain't worrying about the 0.9% planet pollution WE put out and we are reducing it daily, per person, anyway. Would a shandy be shandy or actually lemonade with just 1% beer?
UK isn't the problem.
For the record i walked 12 miles today and left all the vehicles tucked up. Tomorrow i shall cycle over 30 miles almost certainly.

 

[Roast Veg]

Until the BIG world polluters change THEIR filthy outputs, i ain't worrying about the 0.9% planet pollution WE put out and we are reducing it daily, per person, anyway.

This is an example of moral licensing, and is unhelpful to the discussion at large.

 

[Bletchleyite]

This is an example of moral licensing, and is unhelpful to the discussion at large.

Or as per a certain major supermarket - "every little helps", or put another way "two wrongs don't make a right".

 

[SWTCommuter]

Some of the points raised in this thread are discussed in this series on Radio 4

BBC Radio 4 - Electric Ride UK, Episode 2

Peter Curran travels from Lands’ End to John O’Groats in an electric car.

www.bbc.co.uk

Electric Ride UK
Peter Curran is getting back on the road, in an electric vehicle. When Peter set out on his first adventure in an electric vehicle for Radio 4, ten years ago, owning one was more of a niche interest than a regular part of life.
But things have changed. And with a deadline of 2030 on the last sale of combustion engine cars in Britain, manufacturers and researchers have had to kick their work up a gear.
In this new series, Peter travels from Lands’ End to John O’Groats and asking whether the country is ready for the new era of electric cars.
Along the way he’ll explore what makes an electric car, from mining of lithium and the latest in battery technology, to how manufacturers like Nissan plan to keep up with soaring demand. And he’ll also speak to people pushing electric vehicles to their very limits, whether it be in racing, like McLaren and Extreme-E, to Chris Ramsey, a maverick planning to drive an electric vehicle from pole-to-pole.

 

[The Ham]

Until the BIG world polluters change THEIR filthy outputs, i ain't worrying about the 0.9% planet pollution WE put out and we are reducing it daily, per person, anyway.

The fact that we're reducing our carbon emissions is why we can call on others to do more.

As a note the Chinese have recently announced that they will no longer provide funding for coal powered stations (either domestically or internationally), which will likely reduce emissions across large parts of the world. Not only directly but also through then investing in renewable energy generation schemes.

As part of the same announcement they said that they would reach peak carbon in 2030, with some commentators suggesting that to hit their net zero target of 2060 they'll have to reach their peak before 2030.

Others (including the Chinese) are taking steps to reduce their impact, so what's to stop us doing more?

 

[Bald Rick]

Back on topic, wandering around London today, I noticed several (about 15) minicabs / Ubers that were new or nearly new Kia e-Neros. Evidently the vehicle of choice for minicabs now.

 

[ABB125]

Back on topic, wandering around London today, I noticed several (about 15) minicabs / Ubers that were new or nearly new Kia e-Neros. Evidently the vehicle of choice for minicabs now.

In London maybe. Here in Birmingham it very much still seems to be (appallingly-driven!) Priuses. Which I suppose are at least hybrid!

 

[AM9]

In London maybe. Here in Birmingham it very much still seems to be (appallingly-driven!) Priuses. Which I suppose are at least hybrid!

Many Priuses, especially older ones are effectively IC-only vehicles because their batteries are past end-of-life. Taxis continue to use them to avoid congestion charges. Ideally all hybrid EVs should have their battery mode efficiency checked as part of their MoT, and those that fall below a certain level, prohibited for road use or subject to a VED surcharge.
Of there is any mis-selling of battery vehicles it is here, especially the deceptively marketed "self charging hybrids".

 

[Roast Veg]

Back on topic, wandering around London today, I noticed several (about 15) minicabs / Ubers that were new or nearly new Kia e-Neros. Evidently the vehicle of choice for minicabs now.

My last visit to London saw a huge EV market share within the ulez. The new electric taxis and e-niros particularly dominated, but Konas, Tesla Model 3s, and VW id3s also made appearances. Reminded me of my last visit to Amsterdam, which has a large number of Tesla Model Ss.

 

[BananaRepublic]

Back on topic, wandering around London today, I noticed several (about 15) minicabs / Ubers that were new or nearly new Kia e-Neros. Evidently the vehicle of choice for minicabs now.

More London Taxis are going electric.

London's largest taxi firm to switch to all-electric fleet by 2023 | Autocar

Addison Lee will invest £160 million into switch, targeting 20,000 zero-emissions journeys each day in London

www.autocar.co.uk

Addison Lee will target an all-electric fleet by 2023, which it says is two years ahead of any other private hire vehicle operator in London. It will begin the switch by moving to the new Volkswagen ID 4 SUV, with 450 vehicles joining the Addison Lee fleet.

The private hire firm will update the remainder of its 4,000-strong fleet to electric with 200 fully electric vehicles every month, becoming London’s largest fully electric fleet operator....

 

[Bald Rick]

London's largest taxi firm to switch to all-electric fleet by 2023​

London's largest taxi firm to switch to all-electric fleet by 2023 | Autocar

Addison Lee will invest £160 million into switch, targeting 20,000 zero-emissions journeys each day in London

www.autocar.co.uk

z

that will be a a big boost to the second hand market In a couple of years’ time.

 

[trebor79]

Likewise a boss of mine drove their Tesla to Poland and back a few years ago, they found that by the time they had a coffee the car was good to go for the next leg.

This was my experience a few weeks ago when my boss drove us to various meetings for a day in his Tesla Model 3. Needed a charge at some point in the day, so we stopped near Grantham for a bit to eat. A few.minutes before we got there up popped a.messgae saying it was conditioning the battery for rapid charge. Plugged it in, went for a tea and sandwich and by the time we got back there was another 160 miles of range. Seemed pretty practical to me.
I'm in my way up to Glasgow by train, and am renting a BMW i3 whilst I'm there. This will be my first time driving an electric car..I'll be driving all over rural Ayrshire but there seem to plenty of (free!) chargers so I don't have too many concerns.
And £38 a day, with no mileage or fuel costs makes it an order of magnitude cheaper than renting a petrol or diesel car.

 

[Factotum]

Or as per a certain major supermarket - "every little helps", or put another way "two wrongs don't make a right".

Or as the late Professor David McKay liked to say "If everybody does a little, only a little will get done". Climate change is not something that can be addressed by not leaving TV on standby.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Or as the late Professor David McKay liked to say "If everybody does a little, only a little will get done". Climate change is not something that can be addressed by not leaving TV on standby.

Better than doing nothing.