LNER advance stop short

[38Cto15E]

If I had a LNER Advance ticket from London Kings Cross to say Aberdeen, and I decided to stop short of my destination at say Dundee.
Would my ticket be valid and work the barriers? If not what fare would I have to pay?

 

[JonathanH]

If I had a LNER Advance ticket from London Kings Cross to say Aberdeen, and I decided to stop short of my destination at say Dundee.
Would my ticket be valid and work the barriers? If not what fare would I have to pay?

Such an advance ticket is not valid to end a journey at Dundee, only to board at London, and end at Aberdeen.

https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/tick...tickets/advance-tickets-terms-and-conditions/

6. Break of journey
6.1 You may not start, break and resume, or end your journey at any intermediate station except to change to/from connecting trains as shown on the ticket(s) or other valid travel itinerary.

The barriers at Dundee may work, they may not. It depends how they have been programmed.

If the barriers don't work, some discretion may be shown by the barrier staff, but it isn't guaranteed. Potentially you could be asked to pay the difference between what you have paid and the relevant fare that would enable you to break your journey at Dundee. However, on balance, it is probably unlikely that this would actually be levied if the view is taken that there is no financial gain from having the wrong ticket.

As LNER sell advance tickets for all journeys on their routes, the best advice for someone travelling from London to Aberdeen who may want to leave the train at Dundee is to buy separate London to Dundee, and Dundee to Aberdeen advance tickets.

 

[Buzby]

Having just completed a journey from Ryde to Falkirk on an 'Advance' ticket - every single barrier I encountered (including those on U1 for the jump between Waterloo and Kings Cross) a total of 7, my ticket did not scan in any of them. The laugh was I was travelling on the service(s) stipulated on my ticket and at the exact changing points. It's worth highlighting that my tickets were issued by a ScotRail TVM, yet even crossing the border and arriving at Waverley, my ticket was again rejected. On complaining to the staff member who had to manually check it, I was told 'they hardly ever work' and to try m-tickets instead which had a higher auto acceptance rate.

My conclusion is that for your journey, in Dundee the barrier will NOT open and you'll need to seek a manual check. Whether the attendant will spot you shouldn't be breaking your journey and try to charge you extra will depend on many factors - anything from what sort of a day they've had to it's almost going home time for them. You'll just have to try it and accept the result!

 

[realemil]

However it is very important to note that the iKB states the following:

Q: Can a passenger alight short of the destination on their Advance ticket, or board after the origin shown on their Advance ticket but on the same booked train?

A: Although Advance tickets are intended to be used only between the origin and destination stations shown on the ticket, there may be occasions where a passenger joins the correct train but at a later station, or alights earlier than the indicated destination. Although this is not strictly in accordance with the rules for Advance tickets, the Rail industry has agreed that in such cases, no additional fare should be charged (unless there is clear evidence of intent to try and avoid a higher fare).

While it's not strictly allowed, I can't imagine anyone really getting annoyed, and you shouldn't be charged an additional fare, but there's also a chance.

 

[38Cto15E]

Thanks for all of your help forum members, this information has been very helpful.

 

[zero]

Having just completed a journey from Ryde to Falkirk on an 'Advance' ticket - every single barrier I encountered (including those on U1 for the jump between Waterloo and Kings Cross) a total of 7, my ticket did not scan in any of them. The laugh was I was travelling on the service(s) stipulated on my ticket and at the exact changing points. It's worth highlighting that my tickets were issued by a ScotRail TVM, yet even crossing the border and arriving at Waverley, my ticket was again rejected. On complaining to the staff member who had to manually check it, I was told 'they hardly ever work' and to try m-tickets instead which had a higher auto acceptance rate.

My conclusion is that for your journey, in Dundee the barrier will NOT open and you'll need to seek a manual check.

Last year I had an advance ticket mainly on the GWR network, with several interchanges, some up to an hour. The barcode ticket opened the barriers at all of them. If challenged I would have said I wanted to use station facilities outside the barriers.

 

[Haywain]

Having just completed a journey from Ryde to Falkirk on an 'Advance' ticket - every single barrier I encountered (including those on U1 for the jump between Waterloo and Kings Cross) a total of 7, my ticket did not scan in any of them. The laugh was I was travelling on the service(s) stipulated on my ticket and at the exact changing points. It's worth highlighting that my tickets were issued by a ScotRail TVM, yet even crossing the border and arriving at Waverley, my ticket was again rejected. On complaining to the staff member who had to manually check it, I was told 'they hardly ever work' and to try m-tickets instead which had a higher auto acceptance rate.

This is likely to be that the data on the magnetic stripe was corrupted, and not due to the programming of barriers. This could have happened when the ticket was issued or subsequently, either through encountering a strong enough magnet (mobile phones used to do this a lot) or by encountering a ticket barrier where the read/write mechanism has been faulty. Because the magnetic stripe can only be read by machines it is extremely difficult to establish when this is happening.

 

[kkong]

This is likely to be that the data on the magnetic stripe was corrupted, and not due to the programming of barriers.

I'd say it's just as likely that the barriers haven't been programmed to accept the mag stripe variants of certain (relatively newly introduced) LNER Advance ticket types.

Posts #9 and #11 on this thread have some information from when I experienced this issue.

 

[ScotTrains]

A more likely story would be to say you've got backache from sitting on an ironing board for hours on end! The LNER seats are awful even in 1st class!

I've previously been refused access through the barriers at Waverly on a slightly unusual routing, despite having a perfectly valid ticket with seat reservations and a print-out of my itinerary. I missed my connection due to some jobsworth barrier staff.

Anyway, I now often buy an additional cheap ticket to get me through the barriers without any hassle or stress. In your case a Broughty Ferry to Dundee single (£1.80 without railcard) should do the trick.

Also, the barriers at Dundee are often left open later in the evening.

 

[CarrotPie]

Anyway, I now often buy an additional cheap ticket to get me through the barriers without any hassle or stress. In your case a Broughty Ferry to Dundee single (£1.80 without railcard) should do the trick.

"Your ticket wasn't scanned, Sir. Doughnutting, are we?"

I could see that becoming a problem in certain situations where that ticket hasn't been scanned at its origin.

 

[Buzby]

This is likely to be that the data on the magnetic stripe was corrupted, and not due to the programming of barriers. This could have happened when the ticket was issued or subsequently, either through encountering a strong enough magnet (mobile phones used to do this a lot) or by encountering a ticket barrier where the read/write mechanism has been faulty. Because the magnetic stripe can only be read by machines it is extremely difficult to establish when this is happening

I’m aware of the vagaries of magnetic stripe - I even had a bulk eraser that slowed down processing cheques by a couple of days until they switched to OCR. The original magnetic tube tickets (yellow) would wipe themselves if you sat next to the motors…. Of course, we’ve all moved on to contactless, and even Glasgow’s Subway issues RFID paper tickets, but not the TOCs. I’ve just collected my tickets for the next Rail Sale adventure in a week or so - I’ll see how well I fare then, but at least barrier use will be less intensive with no retimed services to catch (yet!)

incidentally, I use an app to scan my ITSO cards to check the data etc - Saltire Cards and the Bee Network all work fine - but Oyster? It throws up an error. It it a different standard?

 

[Starmill]

"Your ticket wasn't scanned, Sir. Doughnutting, are we?"

Scanned at Broughty Ferry?

 

[ScotTrains]

"Your ticket wasn't scanned, Sir. Doughnutting, are we?"

One of the many reasons I always use old fashioned paper tickets!

 

[Fermiboson]

"Your ticket wasn't scanned, Sir. Doughnutting, are we?"

It can't be illegal to hold a valid ticket but have another ticket you don't intend to use in order to get through the barrier that you should be able to get through but can't because of artificial settings/uninformed staff, can it? After all, you hold a valid ticket. And it's not a crime not to use a ticket.

 

[Buzby]

One of the many reasons I always use old fashioned paper tickets!

It’s also the paper tickets that won’t read/scan!

 

[CarrotPie]

It’s also the paper tickets that won’t read/scan!

So it can't be paper, it can't be an e-ticket...

Holo-ticket, anyone?

 

[fandroid]

If I had a LNER Advance ticket from London Kings Cross to say Aberdeen, and I decided to stop short of my destination at say Dundee.
Would my ticket be valid and work the barriers? If not what fare would I have to pay?

Why would anyone do this? A change of circumstances maybe, having bought a ticket very early to get the best fare.

However, that would in a way be cheating, as the decision to stop at Dundee comes at a later date, when the cheaper Advance fares have all gone. The honest way would be to buy via CrossCountry and change the ticket without incurring a fee for doing so.

 

[yorkie]

One of the many reasons I always use old fashioned paper tickets!

People can be, and have been, mistreated when using paper tickets too. Paper vs e-ticket debates have taken place extensively in other threads. In any case, it's a moot point as change is coming regardless; even paper tickets are getting barcodes on them, whether people like it or not.

 

[kkong]

"Your ticket wasn't scanned, Sir. Doughnutting, are we?"

Exceptionally unlikely to be asked by any ScotRail barrier staff.

Even if so, there are no private prosecutions in Scotland, no ScotRail penalty fare scheme and no compulsory ticket areas on ScotRail operated stations.