Manchester - Liverpool Electrification

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The Ordsall Chord hasn't got final approval yet - it's rumoured that the Minister has put off the decision at least until next month and possibly until after the election. Network Rail was expecting it in November. So I suppose it would be premature to say the extra platforms are definitely going ahead, but the money for them is there and I'm sure they'll happen if the Chord does.

Others will know better than I do about the services but it seems likely.

We could use the new descriptive phrase that is now part of the English patois to describe the tardiness of the Minister...Todmorden Chord syndrome..

 

[DJH1971]

We could use the new descriptive phrase that is now part of the English patois to describe the tardiness of the Minister...Todmorden Chord syndrome..

So does that mean that the reported diversion of TPE Manchester to Scotland services to Manchester Victoria from May won't be happening?

 

[LDECRexile]

I have

1. completed the reconfiguration of the combined album
2. inserted George Rear's contribution
3. inserted Phil's latest contribution

It can be found here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

The structure is fundamentally unchanged, but more regularised. The essential features are:

a) newest first, oldest last. That means, for example, that Phil's latest are at the very end because they date from 2005-6
b) number by location-date. So if I went clicking at Roby then Huyton on 23rd Feb 2014 and Phil went clicking at Huyton and Huyton Quarry on the same date and Paul went clicking at Huyton on the 25th there would be four location-date sets:

1. mine at Roby-23rd
2. mine and Phil's combined at Huyton-23rd (this happened once during the July blockade when it turned out that Phil and I photographed both sides of the same works train, unbenknown to us then)
3. Phil's at Huyton Quarry-23rd, and
4. Paul's at Huyton-24th

Each location-date can have any number of shots, the max in practice has been 24 so far, with 3-7 being typical. Shots are differentiated by the 5th character of the identifier, which is a letter, in descending order.

The above might therefore contain:

1538m Roby, 1538l Roby and 1538k Roby
1534m Huyton, 1534l Huyton, 1534k Huyton, 1534j Huyton, 1534i Huyton and 1534h Huyton
1530m Huyton Quarry and 1530l Huyton Quarry
1526m Huyton, 1526l Huyton, 1526k Huyton, 1526j Huyton and 1526i Huyton

The ordering within each location-date is based on my judgement of what I hope will look and feel best to a viewer. It would, of course, been far easier to simply wang things out in reverse date order, which would work a treat if the album rarely contained more than one or two shots per location-date. In practice shots are taken at the mercy of the elements, what the photographer spots in what order as s/he's wandering around and so on.

In a few cases I have combined shots from several dates, for example Tom sent the superb set of shots of the UTXs at Wavertree. I reckon they are best presented as one set, though in fact one was taken weeks before the others which were in turn taken over a couple of days.

I've burdened you with all this so you can follow the method, though you are at liberty to think it simply madness.

Ee, it's fun.

Dave

PS, in case anyone is still awake, I've been sent a smashing set of shots some going back to the end of steam. Alas, when I uploaded them they present at postage stamp size and I can't enlarge them. Anyone know what to do?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

So does that mean that the reported diversion of TPE Manchester to Scotland services to Manchester Victoria from May won't be happening?

My comment appertained solely to the delayed Ministerial decision on the Ordsall Chord project, so any proposed May 2015 changes to which you allude cannot possibly be a part of the delayed approval decision on that specific project.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

My comment appertained solely to the delayed Ministerial decision on the Ordsall Chord project, so any proposed May 2015 changes to which you allude cannot possibly be a part of the delayed approval decision on that specific project.

The diversion to Victoria was for enabling works on the Castlefield Viaduct for the Ordsall Chord.
No point in doing that before the planning permission is granted.
For once, it doesn't appear to be a Ministerial delay.
The inspector is independent and can take as long as he needs to issue his report and recommendations.

 

[HowardGWR]

T
The inspector is independent and can take as long as he needs to issue his report and recommendations.

Not quite as carte blanche as that. They are normally given a time guide which is a multiple of how long the Inquiry took. I don't know how long that was but, IIRC, just a few weeks at most. I forget what the multiplier is as I am long out of this area (I am pleased to write).

 

[snowball]

The inspector is independent and can take as long as he needs to issue his report and recommendations.

Is it known that he hasn't yet done so?

Incidentally, in the newish system for approving nationally significant infrastructure (which was nearly used for the Chord before it was deemed not quite big enough and was switched to the Transport & Works Act), there's a time limit for each stage. After the examination is completed, the inspectorate has 3 months to make a recommendation, and the minister then has three months to make a decision.

 

[LDECRexile]

I withdraw my plea for help, I've cracked it.
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I'm delighted that Wavertreelad has sent 40 photos of Wavertree Technology Park and Olive Mount Cutting, plus 2 of the Gridiron in 1968.

I have put them in his own album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157647960413204/

I will annotate them properly and add a large selection of them into the combined album in due course.

Thank you Wavertreelad.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I have selected 15 of Wavertreelad's photos and melded them in the combined album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

The 15 comprise an East facing and West facing from Mill Lane bridge on the four dates he took shots (8) two from Rathbone Rd bridge (10) two of Bootle Branch jct (12) one of Princess Elizabeth at WTP (13) and a W/E facing pair at WTP (15). I'm in discussion with Wavertreelad about how to weave the Gridiron shots in, my historical geography isn't good enough to do so unaided.

Thank you Wavertreelad.

 

[DJH1971]

Just waiting on news on the fourth portal at Sankey Viaduct, as it was due to go up on the 14th.

 

[mcnw35282]

I work at the maintenance section of a large housing association in St helens, so I drive past Sankey Valley most days. The 4th portal was still not up as of today (15/01) but I'll let you know if anything changes!

 

[PDG1949]

Just waiting on news on the fourth portal at Sankey Viaduct, as it was due to go up on the 14th.

No 4th Portal up this afternoon, but the others have registration arms now. Very windy.

 

[DJH1971]

No 4th Portal up this afternoon, but the others have registration arms now. Very windy.

Least that's still a bit of progress.

But only just over 3 weeks to go until the first electric services are reportedly starting.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Least that's still a bit of progress.

But only just over 3 weeks to go until the first electric services are reportedly starting.

Sorry - but I aint holding my breath on this one.

 

[DJH1971]

Sorry - but I aint holding my breath on this one.

I am starting to side with you on this one, but with almost all the ironwork up at Sankey and Huyton-Roby, perhaps they can finally put up the wires shortly!

 

[LDECRexile]

I'm delighted that Paul Gaskell has sent another photo, this time of progress at Sankey Viaduct.

It is in his album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157649792560381/

and also in the combined album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

Thank you Paul.

 

[Billyblue]

Huyton Footpath
Knowsley Council have contacted me to say they are on the case and the damage to the path will, shortly, be made good. They have given a third party the opportunity to repair the damage and, failing that, will do the work themselves.

 

[8A Rail]

Huyton Footpath
Knowsley Council have contacted me to say they are on the case and the damage to the path will, shortly, be made good. They have given a third party the opportunity to repair the damage and, failing that, will do the work themselves.

Cheers. I had misread the original message, not realising that it was contractors for a nearby dwelling was the cause of the path problem - they should make good regardless.

 

[TheKnightWho]

Huyton Footpath
Knowsley Council have contacted me to say they are on the case and the damage to the path will, shortly, be made good. They have given a third party the opportunity to repair the damage and, failing that, will do the work themselves.

Presumably they'll bill the 3rd party?

 

[LDECRexile]

Did a lightning tour today, first time out of the house since Sunday.

1. Roby Jct, one pair of goals still without a crossbar; one portal absolutely festooned with danglies; danglies-in-waiting piled at the base of one TGBU. No wires.

2. Huyton Station, the lone mast at the east end of the platforms is still without partner or crossbar.

3. Rainhill, no change since last weekend, three headspans still bearing wires using temporary fixings

4. Collins Green, no visible change

5. Earlestown, no visible change

6. Sankey Viaduct, no portal on Pier 1, scaffolders working on Pier 10, couldn't make out what they were doing.

7. Lots of Orangemen all over the place, all trains audible from miles away, working their horns

8. RHTT went over Sankey Viaduct while I was there, I thought they'd finished.

9 Carr Mill Viaduct, the bitumastic painting and topping out Tom described the other day has been done. All scaffolding has been dismantled, Harris fencing removed and the site is expected to be cleared by close of play today.

Electric trains on 8th Feb looks to be a challenging target.

Photos later.

Dave

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Did a lightning tour today, first time out of the house since Sunday.

Well done Dave.
I shouldn't think the windy/snowy weather has helped this week, and it will continue to be difficult this weekend with snow/ice around.
I don't suppose the Burgy Pond One was up, was it?

 

[LDECRexile]

Well done Dave.
I shouldn't think the windy/snowy weather has helped this week, and it will continue to be difficult this weekend with snow/ice around.
I don't suppose the Burgy Pond One was up, was it?

I was forced onto the road by the need to avoid infecting folk and haste and to be able to retreat if I felt crap and to be able to visit Sankey Viaduct rather than just view it, so my report covers the lot I'm afraid.

Paul reckons it'll be a right so-and-so to view the mastless Burgies other than by train.

I hope to venture out by train on Monday, when the results of the first Sunday Wigan Branch blockade might be evident.

Kind regards

Dave

PS, let's not confuse nowt much appears to have happened with nowt much has happened

 

[Billyblue]

Presumably they'll bill the 3rd party?

Yes, they have been warned they'll be billed for any work done.
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Cheers. I had misread the original message, not realising that it was contractors for a nearby dwelling was the cause of the path problem - they should make good regardless.

Yes, I agree. Unfortunately, some people don't appear to appreciate that a public footpath is just that . I.e a public right of way.

 

[LDECRexile]

I am delighted that Peter Conroy has sent me two images from the 1960s on 'our' lines.

I have added them to Peter's album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/16108295609/in/set-72157649772527390

and to the combined album at the very end of here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

Thank you Peter.

Edit:

I have now also added 20 shots taken today here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

 

[Billyblue]

I am delighted that Peter Conroy has sent me two images from the 1960s on 'our' lines.

I have added them to Peter's album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/16108295609/in/set-72157649772527390

and to the combined album at the very end of here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

Thank you Peter.

Edit:

.

I have now also added 20 shots taken today here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

Thanks to you, Peter and all the other contributors for the brilliant photos in your album. Peter's are interesting in that there are so few photos showing the former 4 track layout, stations and platforms etc

 

[Dixie]

A TGBU (Thundering Great Big Un) has danglies at its foot - are they for both structural integrity and hanging wires?

I can't remember whether someone else has commented elsewhere on this, but this portal appears to be going be used to terminate and/or tension some lengths of catenary.

 

[ironstone11]

I can't remember whether someone else has commented elsewhere on this, but this portal appears to be going be used to terminate and/or tension some lengths of catenary.

Yes, this was mentioned in Post 3286.

Portals of this type, usually over four track lines, always come in pairs and are used for end of wire terminations, which may include the line tensioners. Spring loaded tensioners rather than weights.

This type of portal, heavy as it looks, is a more elegant version of the ones being used on the Great Eastern upgrade.

Looks as though it won't be long before we find out!

Many thanks to LDECRexile and others for the excellent coverage.

 

[LDECRexile]

Thanks to you, Peter and all the other contributors for the brilliant photos in your album. Peter's are interesting in that there are so few photos showing the former 4 track layout, stations and platforms etc

Thank you for your kind comments.

Anyone wishing to contribute photos just send me a 'Private Message' within this site and I'll get back to you.

Dave
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Yes, this was mentioned in Post 3286.

Looks as though it won't be long before we find out!

Many thanks to LDECRexile and others for the excellent coverage.

Thank you for taking the trouble to look it up, is there a search facility to enable users to do this, or is it just hard graft?

Thank you also for your kind comment, it dunnarf lend encouragement.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I don't think it has been noted before, but the section between Ravenhead and St Helens Central on the Up has now been (roughly) wired.
So both tracks now have wires almost up to the overbridge south of the station.
There was also a squadron of cherry pickers in the yard north of the station.
This rather goes against the theory that the main line has priority.
I didn't get a good view of the Carr Mill area.

Nothing much seems to have changed on the main line in the last week, except registration gear on the 3 portals over Sankey Viaduct (still 1 to go up).
There are about 7 portals around Huyton without registration gear (and still a few with booms missing).

 

[ironstone11]

... is there a search facility to enable users to do this, or is it just hard graft?

Yes, assuming you are logged in, there is a Search button, the third item from the right in the menu bar just below the thread title OR at the top right of each page, Forum or Thread, just below the page number selector.

However the search does not seem very 'intelligent'. For example, tensioner finds tensioner but not tensioners and conversely tensioners finds tensioners but not tensioner. It is case insensitive, TGBU or tgbu finds TGBU. You can enter multiple words, but this seems to be an OR rather than an AND. There may be more to it, but perhaps the moderators can advise.

 

[LDECRexile]

Yes, assuming you are logged in, there is a Search button, the third item from the right in the menu bar just below the thread title OR at the top right of each page, Forum or Thread, just below the page number selector.

However the search does not seem very 'intelligent'. For example, tensioner finds tensioner but not tensioners and conversely tensioners finds tensioners but not tensioner. It is case insensitive, TGBU or tgbu finds TGBU. You can enter multiple words, but this seems to be an OR rather than an AND. There may be more to it, but perhaps the moderators can advise.

Helpful, thank you.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I don't think it has been noted before, but the section between Ravenhead and St Helens Central on the Up has now been (roughly) wired.
So both tracks now have wires almost up to the overbridge south of the station.

Splendid
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
I am delighted that Peter Conroy has sent some more older photos. I have added them, with interim notes, to Peter's album here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157649772527390/

Some of them are not related to the NW electrification so I have not added them to the combined album. They are all of local interest.

I have also had a first stab at doing a 'Now' photo to match Peter's wonderful 1964 shot of Huyton Quarry. I haven't got the angle quite right but there's enough there to tickle the imagination. I've wanged it into both Peter's Pictures and the combined album, which is here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127646831@N03/sets/72157648494725811/

Thank you Peter.