Nottingham 'Bus War'

[Mugby]

Some respected individuals such as Bob Hind were messianic in their pursuit of single decks. The upshot is that a fully single deck fleet is not an issue as long as capacity matches demand,

Exactly my point. Increasingly now, capacity does not meet demand and TB has long since abandoned it's policy of 'like for like' when a vehicle has to be taken out of service. I've seen several instances of Solos being substituted for full size buses on Mickloevers, Villagers and the X38.

On frequency levels I was told at a meeting between our village and Trent in 1996 following bus cuts, that the main core of the Rainbow One was to be increased from 10 minutes to 7/8. Eighteen years later we have new shiny buses, that are overcrowded and regularly leave customers standing at bus stops, just like it used to be before deregulation! No change there then....

The same thing happens every Thursday on the Red Arrow, it's particularly busy on Chesterfield Market day and passengers are left behind at Derby, Ripley and Alfreton. It may only be half a dozen people and the attitude seems to be 'We're not putting another bus on for six people, revenue wouldn't cover the cost, there's another one in half an hour, let them wait.'

Not exactly what you would expect from a really good bus company!

 

[trentside]

Speaking of the "really good bus company", just came across this photo on Flickr.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/guy_arab_uf/15895051138/

Never thought I'd see a TrentBarton bus with a handwritten destination in the window.

 

[Mitch in Notts]

Better than last month. Was waiting for the 27 in Ilkeston when bus turned up - stopped it but it was the 23 and had nothing in the window at all - and I had seen it earlier in the day exactly the same. Obviously couldn't afford the bit of paper!

 

[chessie]

The same thing happens every Thursday on the Red Arrow, it's particularly busy on Chesterfield Market day and passengers are left behind at Derby, Ripley and Alfreton. It may only be half a dozen people and the attitude seems to be 'We're not putting another bus on for six people, revenue wouldn't cover the cost, there's another one in half an hour, let them wait.'

Not exactly what you would expect from a really good bus company![/QUOTE]

I live in Chesterfield and I don't even know when the Thursday market became so popular but its apparently Thursdays we get the most foot fall through town nowadays by a long way. Not only have Trent Barton missed this but so have most coach companies that still visit the other market days more than this one when there's half the stalls on and half the atmosphere. Thursdays are also the same on the x17 with people coming in from Sheffield.

Back to subject though I reckon the Red Arrow could easily become an at least 20 mins frequency between Chesterfield and Derby. I'm a regular traveller and never known it far short of capacity, certainly between Alfreton and Derby no matter the time or day of week

 

[harry42]

Does anyone know how this "17" is going? Saw it through Toton today...not too busy..!

 

[trentside]

Does anyone know how this "17" is going? Saw it through Toton today...not too busy..!

No idea. I understand that they've got a couple of ex-Go North East Dennis Dart SLFs with some of their original branding still in place, so setting the bar high already in terms of quality.

 

[bb21]

The main reason behind the "single deck only" policy I believe was security, as TB admitted themselves a number of years back. The drivers can see immediately all corners of the bus and passengers felt safer as a result. The smoking issue was given as an example.

I am not a fan of Hornby and his "crackpot" ideas, but one must admit that he found his audience in TB land and did a marvellous job with marketing. The "single deck only" policy predates him so is not his fault.

I don't like the new website, or the one before that for that matter. Much too glary for my liking, too many colours and completely ignores all the principles of a good website. But it seems to be the "in" thing at the moment so they have done well.

 

[Mitch in Notts]

Trent are making minor revisions to the Calverton Connection from the end of January, including the withdrawl of Woodborough & Lambley from the early morning journey. This will see the end of Bartons long time links with these villages.

 

[harry42]

Saw a brand new NCC Bus Stop on Coventry Lane in Wollaton, next to the crematorium today. Go down there most days and this is the first time ive seen it. Couldn't catch the number, does anyone know why? No scheduled services stop there currently.

 

[ashworth]

Trent are making minor revisions to the Calverton Connection from the end of January, including the withdrawl of Woodborough & Lambley from the early morning journey. This will see the end of Bartons long time links with these villages.

So many of the old routes that used to be run by Barton have disappeared especially most of those that ran from Nottingham into Leicestershire. I think the same can be said for so many of the old Midland General routes from Nottinghamshire into Derbyshire. It could be just my imagination but it does seem that the routes that Trent have axed most drastically are those that were originally operated by firms such as Barton and Midland General before being taken over by Trent.

Although the Trent Barton Mango Card and Zig Zag Tickets are a good idea and can be useful, as indeed are the Stagecoach Explorer tickets, there seems to be less and less routes that you can now use them on with so many other smaller operators running services.

It would be great if some kind of multi operator ticket could be available in Nottinghamshire, as there are in many other counties, as bus journeys involving more than one bus are becoming very expensive when you have to keep buying different individual tickets. Even Trent/Barton and Stagecoach can't agree on this for the good of the passenger when both refuse to allow their tickets/passes of this type to be used on the joint Pronto Service which is one of the main bus routes in Nottinghamshire.

 

[pjnathanail]

Saw a brand new NCC Bus Stop on Coventry Lane in Wollaton, next to the crematorium today. Go down there most days and this is the first time ive seen it. Couldn't catch the number, does anyone know why? No scheduled services stop there currently.

Do you mean you saw a bus (vehicle) stopping there or you saw a bus stop (street furniture)? If the latter I will cycle down tomorrow and take a look, I don't live far from there.

 

[harry42]

Do you mean you saw a bus (vehicle) stopping there or you saw a bus stop (street furniture)? If the latter I will cycle down tomorrow and take a look, I don't live far from there.

Actual street furniture - a bus stop.

 

[Mitch in Notts]

Nottinghamshire County Councils 510 Beeston to Stapleford is extended to serve Bramcote Crematorium from the 2nd February.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

It would be great if some kind of multi operator ticket could be available in Nottinghamshire, as there are in many other counties, as bus journeys involving more than one bus are becoming very expensive when you have to keep buying different individual tickets. Even Trent/Barton and Stagecoach can't agree on this for the good of the passenger when both refuse to allow their tickets/passes of this type to be used on the joint Pronto Service which is one of the main bus routes in Nottinghamshire.

Need something along the lines of the Derbyshire Wayfarer ticket. Would be great when visiting multiple places on the Robin Hood Line too as that can work out expensive!

 

[Deerfold]

Need something along the lines of the Derbyshire Wayfarer ticket. Would be great when visiting multiple places on the Robin Hood Line too as that can work out expensive!

How about calling it the Shewood Forester?

 

[pjnathanail]

Actual street furniture - a bus stop.

Nottinghamshire County Councils 510 Beeston to Stapleford is extended to serve Bramcote Crematorium from the 2nd February.

I cycled past today and there is indeed a sticker on the flag for the 510. No timetable as yet. Will the service be turning inside the crematorium?

 

[harry42]

. Will the service be turning inside the crematorium?

No clue. Wouldn't have thought it would be allowed to turn inside the place. But where else would it turn?

 

[Mitch in Notts]

Logic (ha!) would say it would at least run to Balloon Wood crossroads to connect with the TWO & 35 etc. Even further logic would have seen it extended past Bilborough & Basford Hall Colleges to Bulwell, like the old 32! But pigs might fly!
As it is only a tiny vehicle I would imagine it might turn in the works access road immediately north of the Crematorium - it is quite a wide turning.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
In fact the new timetable is on traveline. It shows one new stop - 'outside crematorium' for both ways so no clue there.
You would have thought they would have also put an additional bus stop in either side of the road at the bottom of Coventry Lane to serve the housing at Longden Close etc. There used to be an old Barton stop just there.

 

[harry42]

Logic (ha!) would say it would at least run to Balloon Wood crossroads to connect with the TWO & 35 etc. Even further logic would have seen it extended past Bilborough & Basford Hall Colleges to Bulwell, like the old 32! But pigs might fly!
.

Or even to Balloon Woods then down to the Wollaton Vale Terminus to connect with 30 and 35 and alight opposite the play centre for the two.

You would have thought they would have also put an additional bus stop in either side of the road at the bottom of Coventry Lane to serve the housing at Longden Close etc. There used to be an old Barton stop just there.

Indeed, and the housing estate at the top of Coventry Lane if it was extended.

 

[pjnathanail]

Pages 8-10 of this document seem to indicate that it will be turning inside the Crematorium.

http://www.broxtowe.gov.uk/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=30978&p=0

Quite a complex analysis of the situation for what is in reality only 36 buses a week! Shame they didn't get a NCC Enviro200 - but they did know it was an Enviro200 so this has been properly considered.

 

[MCR247]

I took a ride on the (latest style) Enviro 400 demonstrator that Trent Barton are using on the i4 today. A very nice bus. complete with tables!

 

[CallySleeper]

Even Trent/Barton and Stagecoach can't agree on this for the good of the passenger when both refuse to allow their tickets/passes of this type to be used on the joint Pronto Service which is one of the main bus routes in Nottinghamshire.

Welcome to my life.

 

[Ginga]

Was up in Hucknall today riding Aot 8's. Got "new" ticket machines on the way as the Council want them to scan Oap passes etc. Still good value fares. £2 Nottingham -Hucknall Estates. £1.50 Single in the City Zone.

Yourbus are for sale, Bryce said the asking price is £15 Million Im told Abellio offered £6m and was turned down.

 

[winston270twm]

Yourbus are for sale, Bryce said the asking price is £15 Million Im told Abellio offered £6m and was turned down.

What happened to this supposed backer? Why aren't they interested in buying Yourbus?

 

[MCR247]

Was up in Hucknall today riding Aot 8's. Got "new" ticket machines on the way as the Council want them to scan Oap passes etc. Still good value fares. £2 Nottingham -Hucknall Estates. £1.50 Single in the City Zone.

Are they still selling 'illegal' Kangaroo tickets?

 

[Robertj21a]

Was up in Hucknall today riding Aot 8's. Got "new" ticket machines on the way as the Council want them to scan Oap passes etc. Still good value fares. £2 Nottingham -Hucknall Estates. £1.50 Single in the City Zone.

Yourbus are for sale, Bryce said the asking price is £15 Million Im told Abellio offered £6m and was turned down.

Bryce left Yourbus many months ago.

 

[Ginga]

He will never get £15m , just does not have the assets for it. Premiere were getting £1.5m pa for it's 7 Coaches on National Express , Rotala were getting £2.8m pa for it's 14 Coaches. So National Express does not pay as well , as a lot of people think.

Scott Dunn does have Two Children under 5, so I think trips to the Uk leaving them at Home every month will push him to sell, but only for the right price.

Steve Greaves ( ex Premiere Owner) was causing trouble saying Go Ahead were buying them! I think he will sell to Transit Systems.

I have never seen a press statement saying Yourbus have purchased X amount of Vehicles. Which points to all Vehicles being leased .

Nothing wrong with that EVEN the Nottingham City Transport Enviro 200 are Santander. http://www.santandercb.co.uk/news/funding-deal-drives-growth-nottingham-city-transport They also funded the newer Premiere Travel Enviro 200's, Wright Meridian's plus a load of Coaches.

He does own the Freehold on his Heanor Depot ,but Land up that way is dirt cheap and he did lots of the building work himself.

Getting back to AOT he is not selling Kangroos yet .

 

[winston270twm]

Yourbus Accounts to 28.2.14 show the following:

Turnover £18.4 Million (£18.3 Million year before)
Pre-tax profit = £788k (£1.398 Million year before)
Net debt = £7.514 Million (£9.184 Million year before)
Net Assets £3.245 Million (£2.723 Million year before)

 

[Robertj21a]

Yourbus Accounts to 28.2.14 show the following:

Turnover £18.4 Million (£18.3 Million year before)
Pre-tax profit = £788k (£1.398 Million year before)
Net debt = £7.514 Million (£9.184 Million year before)
Net Assets £3.245 Million (£2.723 Million year before)

Interesting pre-tax profit on that turnover.

 

[MCR247]

Yes the Yourbus citaros are leased, although I don't know about the older ones that they have (the original style ones)

 

[Mitch in Notts]

Looks like chaos in Clifton from the 12th February. NCT are forced into running huge circulars on the 48/53 due to the closure of the Green Lane Junction at the same time as the Gotham end of Farnborough Road Junction is closed. Only access INTO Clifton estate will be from the City end of Farnborough Road or from Ruddington!