South Wales 'Metro' updates

[positron]

It would seem that all that traffic going south would have to go via customhouse street/penarth road (which is currently a bus lane - are the proposing to allow all cars on it again?).

No it'll stay busses only (except for access to Canal Wharf). They're suggesting people use Central link as the main north south road.

 

[Snow1964]

The South Wales metro consultation opens today for feedback (open for 6 weeks)

Cardiff Crossrail

Have your say on the Cardiff Crossrail project. Cardiff Council and Transport for Wales (TfW) are working together to deliver a new tramway from Cardiff Central to Cardiff Bay, the first phase of Cardiff Crossrail. It’ll enhance connectivity between the city centre and

haveyoursay.tfw.wales

There are 5 public drop in events, today is at Butetown

 

[positron]

Cardiff Crossrail

Have your say on the Cardiff Crossrail project. Cardiff Council and Transport for Wales (TfW) are working together to deliver a new tramway from Cardiff Central to Cardiff Bay, the first phase of Cardiff Crossrail. It’ll enhance connectivity between the city centre and

haveyoursay.tfw.wales

It looks like the Cardiff cross rail consultation is live on the site (I didn't think it was planned till tomorrow?)

The South Wales metro consultation opens today for feedback (open for 6 weeks)

Cardiff Crossrail

Have your say on the Cardiff Crossrail project. Cardiff Council and Transport for Wales (TfW) are working together to deliver a new tramway from Cardiff Central to Cardiff Bay, the first phase of Cardiff Crossrail. It’ll enhance connectivity between the city centre and

haveyoursay.tfw.wales

There are 5 public drop in events, today is at Butetown

Ah interesting looks like it was actually public for a bit now but the actual bit to respond has been added today.

Already got people complaining that east Cardiff has nothing even though this is exactly what is needed to eventually allow east Cardiff there transport...

Though Tfw aren't helping themselves by not explaining the full proposed future scope of cross rail and how this is a vital middle piece of the puzzle.

 

[Bob Price]

A few media outlets running this story today showing some rendered images of the Bay extension.
BBC News - Cardiff Crossrail: New tram could span Wales' capital city - BBC News

Cardiff Crossrail: The new tram which could span Wales' capital city

The first stage of Cardiff Crossrail would connect Cardiff Central station with Cardiff Bay.

www.bbc.co.uk

And there is a video here with some rendered video as well. Looks good.

 

[Meerkat]

Might just be a holding design for the render but the tram stop at Central looks cheap and incongruous (and why the gap in the canopy?), with no connecting roof to the rail station (reminds me of Edinburgh airport tram….)
Is it set up so it can be extended over the river to the west?

 

[AdamWW]

Might just be a holding design for the render but the tram stop at Central looks cheap and incongruous (and why the gap in the canopy?), with no connecting roof to the rail station (reminds me of Edinburgh airport tram….)
Is it set up so it can be extended over the river to the west?

I seem to recall at one point they were suggesting a covered route between the railway station and the new bus station, which has failed to materialise.

 

[Jez]

Just seen the report on Wales at Six (ITV Wales). I think its a good idea having direct trams from Central to Cardiff Bay. It can be a right pain having to go to Queen Street and change. Often need to use 3 trains just to get to the Bay so no wonder many people opt for the bus. Apparently it wont be until 2029 anyway so some way to go yet at the pace these things happen - the trams arent even entering service on the core valleys until next year it seems.

 

[CapitalStar378]

I saw a comment on a Facebook group that the initial plan is for 2tph from Central to the Bay. This would seem a poor service for £100m. I'm hoping it'll be at least 4-6tph.

 

[Tumbleweed]

If true that would improve in time seeing that Cardiff's city centre seems to be relocating to the Bay.

 

[WelshBluebird]

Some fun on the valley lines this afternoon. Not sure what kicked it off but lots of late running putting pressure on later services due to the single track sections and lots of stop skipping too. Does make me question how the infrastructure will cope with more trains but I guess at least by then if a train does skip your stop the next once will be soon - in theory.

 

[AdamWW]

Some fun on the valley lines this afternoon. Not sure what kicked it off but lots of late running putting pressure on later services due to the single track sections and lots of stop skipping too. Does make me question how the infrastructure will cope with more trains but I guess at least by then if a train does skip your stop the next once will be soon - in theory.

Apart from the services which remain half hourly, of course.

Incidentally there were problems in the morning too.

On top of the usual "more trains than usual needing repairs" cancellations.

 

[John R]

Some fun on the valley lines this afternoon. Not sure what kicked it off but lots of late running putting pressure on later services due to the single track sections and lots of stop skipping too. Does make me question how the infrastructure will cope with more trains but I guess at least by then if a train does skip your stop the next once will be soon - in theory.

Though with the existing half hourly services the additional double track sections would have given more flexibility than previously to minimise delays.

 

[MikePJ]

Does make me question how the infrastructure will cope with more trains but I guess at least by then if a train does skip your stop the next once will be soon - in theory.

Last month’s timetable consultation included a desire to increase turnaround times at terminal stations on the Valleys routes so as to enable better recovery from minor delays and disruptions. One thing to bear in mind is that there will be signalling upgrades at Queen St in May next year - I’m not sure of the specifics as nothing has been published, but given the desire to run an intensive timetable I expect that the upgrade will allow more trains through the junctions more quickly. EDIT: having looked back through the consultation document, it mentions Dynamic Route Setting and Digital Conflict Resolution as signalling technologies that will be introduced. There’s also mention of making the Mobile Operations Managers a 24hr service, which will reduce delays when infrastructure problems occur early in the morning or late at night.

 

[John R]

Last month’s timetable consultation included a desire to increase turnaround times at terminal stations on the Valleys routes so as to enable better recovery from minor delays and disruptions.

Hence the additional platforms at Treherbert and Aberdare.

 

[LlanishenBull]

Some fun on the valley lines this afternoon. Not sure what kicked it off but lots of late running putting pressure on later services due to the single track sections and lots of stop skipping too. Does make me question how the infrastructure will cope with more trains but I guess at least by then if a train does skip your stop the next once will be soon - in theory.

I missed a mainline connection recently due to three cancellations in a row (inc two that skipped my stop). Incidents will happen but they need to learn to manage them better, for customers not their own convenience, when things go awry.

 

[positron]

I seem to recall at one point they were suggesting a covered route between the railway station and the new bus station, which has failed to materialise.

I think that's planned as part of the "Metro Central" works on the train station. Stuff like extending platform 0 and other works. So it may still happen one day. If they're going to move the station building forwards there's no point building the roof yet.

 

[WelshBluebird]

I had missed the increasing of turnout times as part of the extra services - very much needed so glad that is part of the plan.

I missed a mainline connection recently due to three cancellations in a row (inc two that skipped my stop). Incidents will happen but they need to learn to manage them better, for customers not their own convenience, when things go awry.

I guess to play devil's advocate a little, I only made my mainline connection yesterday because the stop skipping allowed time being pulled back - had the service run as usual I'd have missed the connection. So there is an element of swings and roundabouts, but yeah there absolutely should be an effort to avoid multiple services in a row doing that (or have them skip different stops if that is needed).

 

[Wuggie Norple]

I have to say, I expect the highway changes proposed will result in a lot of feedback, with a big reduction in capacity, and reduced options for those travelling from north of the main line towards Penarth Road.

View attachment 165553

Hi John,
Very useful plans - where did you find them - or did you make them?

There is a discussion on Cardiff Nextdoor about the consultation and I was wondering if I am free to post these plans there to inform the discussion.

Cheers,
Nick

 

[positron]

Hi John,
Very useful plans - where did you find them - or did you make them?

There is a discussion on Cardiff Nextdoor about the consultation and I was wondering if I am free to post these plans there to inform the discussion.

Cheers,
Nick

They're from the consultation documents on the consultation site.

 

[John R]

I was slightly surprised to see that the Core Valley Lines, although no longer part of Network Rail, are still included in the Sectional Appendix, and are being updated as changes are made. (Although the pages are dated 2009, which is even more bizarre!) Can anyone explain why this is?

 

[Fazaar1889]

Is there a satellite map of the proposed crossrail route? I can't seem to find one online. Perhaps it's been imported into a custom google maps?

 

[Nathan99]

Is there a satellite map of the proposed crossrail route? I can't seem to find one online. Perhaps it's been imported into a custom google maps?

There is a map at this link of possible routes for the eastern part of Cardiff Crossrail. The masterplan for the Arena will surely have the exact route in it.

Future aspirations for Cardiff Central to Newport Road

A new public transport link from Cardiff Central to Newport Road via the Bay has long been an ambition of both Transport for Wales (TfW), the Welsh Government and Cardiff Council. Transport for Wales is exploring potential options for a new public transport link between

haveyoursay.tfw.wales

The western section will use the existing track bed apart from in Fairwater where around 20 homes have been built on the old track alignment on Kirton Close and Fairwood Close.

 

[AdamWW]

I don't believe there is at the other crossing (which couldn't really have better sight lines, unlike Ty Glas).

I've had the opportunity to travel over this line and keep an eye on the speed via GPS.

There doesn't currently seem to be a 20 mph limit on the crossing between Rhiwbina and Whitchurch.

On a train stopping at both stations as normal we went over at about 30 mph.

On a train which was late and ran non stop from Ty Glas to Coryton it managed to reach 45 a little before the crossing and didn't have to brake until well after the crossing.

Before that, after Heath we only got to 40 mph before having to brake for Ty Glas.

So I don't think an increase from 45 to 50 mph between Heath and Ty Glas will have much impact until the new trains are in operation. For now it looks as if the changes will just make things slower.

Maybe with trains with better acceleration the inceased speed on the run between Heath and Ty Glas will more than compensate for not being able to get above 20 mph between Rhiwbina and Whitchurch, though it will have more of an impact on a non stop train.

 

[DD2]

There is a map at this link of possible routes for the eastern part of Cardiff Crossrail. The masterplan for the Arena will surely have the exact route in it.

Future aspirations for Cardiff Central to Newport Road

A new public transport link from Cardiff Central to Newport Road via the Bay has long been an ambition of both Transport for Wales (TfW), the Welsh Government and Cardiff Council. Transport for Wales is exploring potential options for a new public transport link between

haveyoursay.tfw.wales

The western section will use the existing track bed apart from in Fairwater where around 20 homes have been built on the old track alignment on Kirton Close and Fairwood Close.

Regarding Kirton Close and Fairwood Close, could tram street running be possible here to route around the built houses? I am not familiar with the area.

 

[MikePJ]

Regarding Kirton Close and Fairwood Close, could tram street running be possible here to route around the built houses? I am not familiar with the area.

These are built just on the approach to the former junction with the existing railway line (between Fairwater and Danescourt stations). To be honest, it's not immediately obvious how you'd route the line without at least a few demolitions, even if you did use street running.

 

[Smwrff]

I think you would have to demolish around 6 houses - unavoidable - but for the greater good. Cardiff Council should just buy them up as they become available - rent them out until demolition needed.

 

[Tom125]

A letter sent from TfW says that during the upcoming closure of the line they will be working on the passing loop between Fernhill (Glenboi) and Cwmbach. Will this loop be used for passing passenger trains? If not what is the purpose of keeping the loop in situ?

 

[Tumbleweed]

I assume that the loop will still be needed if the line will be handling 4 trains per hour each way? I could be wrong though.

 

[positron]

I'm assuming it's useful for service recovery in the event of disruption, even if it isn't intended to be used all the time (not sure whether it is or not). Probably especially useful to have options on the Aberdare line given the aspirations to extend it to Hirwaun. Those plans do seem to have gone very quiet in recent times, feels like the Welsh government could have avoided some of the moaning with Cardiff cross rail if they had also backed the Hirwaun extension too..

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

Just a quick question. One of the reasons TfW give for the current closures is to remove the old footbridge at Treforest. The press release says it's been donated to a heritage railway. Out of interest, does anyone know which one? The release doesn't say but I guess the Pontypool & Blaenavon could do with one for Blaenavon (HL).