Supermarkets discussion

[styles]

What I am finding increasingly irritating is the large queues of people waiting to use a self service till that takes cash, making it difficult to get to a vacant card only till without making it look like you are jumping the queue.

Mildly irritating having to, but I find that just asking people in front if they're paying by card works. The Lidl in Shepherd's Bush was bad for this with lots of cash payers, and I usually got through a lot quicker by just asking people and then they'd move aside.

I suppose the British thing to do is stand quietly, mentally tutting.

 

[Calthrop]

What I am finding increasingly irritating is the large queues of people waiting to use a self service till that takes cash, making it difficult to get to a vacant card only till without making it look like you are jumping the queue.

Mildly irritating having to, but I find that just asking people in front if they're paying by card works. The Lidl in Shepherd's Bush was bad for this with lots of cash payers, and I usually got through a lot quicker by just asking people and then they'd move aside.

I suppose the British thing to do is stand quietly, mentally tutting.

A propos @Mag_seven 's post -- respectfully, I feel you're perhaps being here, a bit over-considerate and -sensitive to people's presumed disapproval. I'd think that any person with half a brain, would understand what's happening: you're not queue-jumping; you're going to an appliance which they can't / don't wish to use, and you can / wish to. Though of course, people can be remarkably dim -- and more so in supermarkets, than in many other places !


@takno writes: "...the Tesco trick of forcing you to go to the (largely unattended) till to pay cash, and wait behind the people dithering over lottery tickets..."

Taking it that human-operated tills are referred to here (the kind which I always use -- am an extreme technophobe; don't understand the self-service things): this touches on an extreme "pet hate" of mine; applying not just to supermarkets, but shops of any kind -- people who first, lengthily faff around at the till getting lottery tickets -- then proceed to "do the business" with same, right there; and if they win anything, require the money there and then, from the salesperson -- while the queue behind, lengthens and grows homicidal. In the vein of the (Comedic) Things You Would Ban thread: if I were dictator, those wretches would get just one put-the-fear-of-God-into-them warning; and if that were to fail ...

 

[route101]

One of my local Lidl's now has one of them receipt gates upon exit from the self scans. Silly me put my receipt at the bottom of my bag!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

It's not too bad if they've got a decent number of cash ones - probably at least a third. I really dislike the Tesco trick of forcing you to go to the (largely unattended) till to pay cash, and wait behind the people dithering over lottery tickets or playing a game of "guess which cigarettes are behind door one".

Which is why I used a credit card to buy a £1.50 sandwich in a Tesco in central Manchester last week. Dozens of card only self service tills, no cash & card tills, one staffed kiosk.

One of my local Lidl's now has one of them receipt gates upon exit from the self scans. Silly me put my receipt at the bottom of my bag!

At Morrisons I just gently push the barrier open, is that why an alarm goes off? Are there instructions to scan a receipt? I just see a barrier which doesn't open when I approach it so it needs some human assistance. What if you decline a receipt when the till prompts you?

Another inconvenience is the sandwich and associated items in Asda (Rawtenstall) which are outside the security area. So you collect your meal deal items then walk through the entrance gates to pick up any other items. If buying just the sandwich items there is the cigarette kiosk adjacent or you walk into the self-service payment area via the ungated exit, but it has those upright hoop things so going the wrong way sets an alarm off. It is also one of those two-storey stores which has sales areas on both floors (rather than just parking underneath). So you shop food upstairs, pay upstairs, exit the secure area then re-enter the secure area to go down the travellator and pass a second security point, a couple of self-serve tills adjacent and exit the secure area.

 

[Bald Rick]

It's not too bad if they've got a decent number of cash ones - probably at least a third. I really dislike the Tesco trick of forcing you to go to the (largely unattended) till to pay cash, and wait behind the people dithering over lottery tickets or playing a game of "guess which cigarettes are behind door one".

The Tescos near me, the self service are card only, if you have cash you go to the staffed till. More often than not there is a longer queue for the self service tills than the staffed till.

Also, I can’t remember the last time I saw anyone buy cigarettes there.

 

[High Dyke]

Another inconvenience is the sandwich and associated items in Asda (Rawtenstall) which are outside the security arareaa.

I've noticed this in numerous Asda stores. My own local store has the security sensors at the doors, but the sandwich section is outside of the till area. So, you either get your sandwich etc before you visit the rest of the store, or you have to do a couple of circuits of the tills to pay.

 

[Russel]

At Morrisons I just gently push the barrier open, is that why an alarm goes off? Are there instructions to scan a receipt? I just see a barrier which doesn't open when I approach it so it needs some human assistance. What if you decline a receipt when the till prompts you?

My local Morrisons has this, I was told it was done by facial recognition?

However it works, it's not a great system, it regularly fails to open for me, the checkout assistant usually says you'll have to wait for another customer to go through then follow them... Yeah, sure I'm doing that...

 

[styles]

At Morrisons I just gently push the barrier open, is that why an alarm goes off? Are there instructions to scan a receipt? I just see a barrier which doesn't open when I approach it so it needs some human assistance. What if you decline a receipt when the till prompts you?

I've had this receipt issue when Tesco Express and Sainsbury's Local tried this nonsense in London early dasys. I always decline the receipt, as I really don't need/want a receipt for a meal deal.

I got around this in future by just refusing to shop at places who employ such a system. I'm sure that at some point in my life I'll just have to accept things like facial recognition to leave shops, but I don't particularly want to support it.

 

[D6130]

I've had this receipt issue when Tesco Express and Sainsbury's Local tried this nonsense in London early dasys. I always decline the receipt, as I really don't need/want a receipt for a meal deal.

I got around this in future by just refusing to shop at places who employ such a system. I'm sure that at some point in my life I'll just have to accept things like facial recognition to leave shops, but I don't particularly want to support it.

This system is now widespread in Italian supermarkets.... especially in the larger towns and cities.

 

[Hadders]

I've had this receipt issue when Tesco Express and Sainsbury's Local tried this nonsense in London early dasys. I always decline the receipt, as I really don't need/want a receipt for a meal deal.

Just to confirm that in stores that have a scan receipt to exit system installed you can't decline a receipt. It gets issues automatically.

These systems have been commonplace in Europr for years. I saw it in use in Carrefour in Toulouse at least 10 years ago.

 

[hexagon789]

This system is now widespread in Italian supermarkets.... especially in the larger towns and cities.

Just to confirm that in stores that have a scan receipt to exit system installed you can't decline a receipt. It gets issues automatically.

These systems have been commonplace in Europr for years. I saw it in use in Carrefour in Toulouse at least 10 years ago.

First place I saw one was the foodhall of a Coop department store in Switzerland, that would be 9 years ago this June.

I've since seen it in supermarkets in Spain, The Netherlands, France and Belgium as well as here in the UK, though it seems more commonplace abroad.

 

[Hadders]

First place I saw one was the foodhall of a Coop department store in Switzerland, that would be 9 years ago this June.

I've since seen it in supermarkets in Spain, The Netherlands, France and Belgium as well as here in the UK, though it seems more commonplace abroad.

Despite rumours to the contrary, my experience is that supermarkets on the continent often seem to be much more officious when it comes to security and the checkout experience. experience.

 

[hexagon789]

Despite rumours to the contrary, my experience is that supermarkets on the continent often seem to be much more officious when it comes to security and the checkout experience. experience.

That reminds me of going into a Carrefour Express in Belgium last year, the scanner at the barriers wasn't working, so the security guard was inspecting everyone's receipt and being very thorough with it too before opening the barrier himself with brute force and closing it again in the same manner!

 

[Russel]

I've had this receipt issue when Tesco Express and Sainsbury's Local tried this nonsense in London early dasys. I always decline the receipt, as I really don't need/want a receipt for a meal deal.

I got around this in future by just refusing to shop at places who employ such a system. I'm sure that at some point in my life I'll just have to accept things like facial recognition to leave shops, but I don't particularly want to support it.

Unfortunately, shoplifting has gotten out of hand and if measures like this help combat it, then it's something I'm happy to accept.

At the end of the day, scanning a receipt on a barrier to leave is no real hardship and we all end up subsidising shoplifting with higher prices.

 

[styles]

Just to confirm that in stores that have a scan receipt to exit system installed you can't decline a receipt. It gets issues automatically.

Wasn't the case in either the Tesco Express nor the Sainsbury's Local in London where I ran into this issue.

Probably fixed now, sure.

Unfortunately, shoplifting has gotten out of hand and if measures like this help combat it, then it's something I'm happy to accept.

At the end of the day, scanning a receipt on a barrier to leave is no real hardship and we all end up subsidising shoplifting with higher prices.

Sounds great on paper, but I expect it'll make little difference when you consider the modus operandi of shoplifters from UK supermarkets.

People who fill their bags and leave without paying for anything will either continue their pretence that they didn't buy anything.

People who loot the shelves without caring that people see they're robbing the place aren't going to be put off by a flimsy barrier, and as we know security guards rarely intervene (understandably so).

People who scan blocks of cheese as jacket potatoes will have a receipt to open the barrier - if they weren't caught under the old system, they won't be caught under the new one.

Thankfully none of the supermarkets this far north appear to be adopting this policy, and I'm trying to buy from independent places anyway so if it starts creeping in, it'll probably nudge me that way a bit more.

 

[Hadders]

Wasn't the case in either the Tesco Express nor the Sainsbury's Local in London where I ran into this issue.

Probably fixed now, sure.

As far as I know, convenience stores don't have these barriers.

Sounds great on paper, but I expect it'll make little difference when you consider the modus operandi of shoplifters from UK supermarkets.

People who fill their bags and leave without paying for anything will either continue their pretence that they didn't buy anything.

People who loot the shelves without caring that people see they're robbing the place aren't going to be put off by a flimsy barrier, and as we know security guards rarely intervene (understandably so).

People who scan blocks of cheese as jacket potatoes will have a receipt to open the barrier - if they weren't caught under the old system, they won't be caught under the new one.

Thankfully none of the supermarkets this far north appear to be adopting this policy, and I'm trying to buy from independent places anyway so if it starts creeping in, it'll probably nudge me that way a bit more.

Shoplifting (like rail fare evasion) is on the increase. There are several reasons for this and barriers on their own will not sort it but they part of an overall strategy to deter and reduce theft.

 

[styles]

As far as I know, convenience stores don't have these barriers.

They do, that's how I experienced the issue... it wasn't a dream!

Shoppers furious as London Tesco requires barcode receipt to exit store

Shoppers vowed to disobey the rules as one Tesco branch introduces a new exit system supposedly to prevent shop thefts

www.mylondon.news

In fact I think they came to some of the local/express stores in London before they came to the bigger shops.

Shoplifting (like rail fare evasion) is on the increase. There are several reasons for this and barriers on their own will not sort it but they part of an overall strategy to deter and reduce theft.

It is on the rise. That doesn't mean the barrier will make much difference.

 

[Hadders]

It is on the rise. That doesn't mean the barrier will make much difference.

Shoplifting has increased significantly in recent years. There are many reasons for this but I don’t see it reducing to the levels of a few years ago until the police and criminal justice system are fully funded and shoplifters see a consequence.

Retailers try lots of different solutions to try and reduce theft. Some work, some don’t. These barriers are part of an overall package of measures to try and deter theft. They will not solve theft on their own, they won’t work everywhere but that doesn’t mean retailers shouldn’t try these things.

 

[Mojo]

In fact I think they came to some of the local/express stores in London before they came to the bigger shops.

The shop in this article isn't one with barcode scanners in the style being referred to. The Chiswell St Express is one of the "prototype" shops where customers can grab items from the shelf and then walk out, it's a rival technology to one used in the Amazon Fresh shops.

 

[styles]

Shoplifting has increased significantly in recent years. There are many reasons for this but I don’t see it reducing to the levels of a few years ago until the police and criminal justice system are fully funded and shoplifters see a consequence.

Retailers try lots of different solutions to try and reduce theft. Some work, some don’t. These barriers are part of an overall package of measures to try and deter theft. They will not solve theft on their own, they won’t work everywhere but that doesn’t mean retailers shouldn’t try these things.

I don't think anyone is suggesting they'll solve theft "on their own" - that would be a terrible prediction.

My point is that they will barely make any difference at all. It's just another hostility for shoppers.

The shop in this article isn't one with barcode scanners in the style being referred to. The Chiswell St Express is one of the "prototype" shops where customers can grab items from the shelf and then walk out, it's a rival technology to one used in the Amazon Fresh shops.

Eh?

From the article:

Posting on Reddit, one Londoner shared a picture of a receipt that had a barcode printed on it. Customers are expected to scan the barcode at a turnstile near the exit to be able to leave the store, the catch being they’d need to buy something to get the receipt.


The new system was reportedly introduced at a Tesco Express store near Old Street in Islington, but shoppers have reported seeing these turnstiles at other Tesco branches across London, as well as some Sainsbury’s stores.

At the time this article was published at least, it was a barcode-to-exit. Maybe it's changed to some other system since.

This is different to Tesco's 'GetGo', which is the Amazon Fresh style experience you're thinking of (such as that in Chiswell St you mention).

 

[Mojo]

The article is referring to the Chiswell St express branch, there's a picture in it which clearly says "Chiswell St Express" on it. You scan to exit if you aren't participating in the 'GetGo' but that isn't the same as everyone having to scan a receipt like you do in the full-size Sainsburys shops.

 

[styles]

The article is referring to the Chiswell St express branch, there's a picture in it which clearly says "Chiswell St Express" on it. You scan to exit if you aren't participating in the 'GetGo' but that isn't the same as everyone having to scan a receipt like you do in the full-size Sainsburys shops.

Yes and as I said, at the time the article was published, this wasn't the case.
These receipt gates were introduced to convenience stores in London years ago.

I don't know the exact dates they introduced them but I was caught out by a Tesco Express in 2020, so the practice isn't new.

 

[Mojo]

Yes and as I said, at the time the article was published, this wasn't the case.

Yes it was. The Chiswell Street shop opened as a 'GetGo' format on 1 November 2022, as per this press release. The article you linked to was published on the 7th December 2022.

 

[Baxenden Bank]

So I go into one of these stores, shove a bottle of spirits, a nice steak and a block of cheese in my 'shoplifters jacket' pockets, then buy a banana for 19p cash to get a receipt to exit the store. Got to get your five-a-day I say merrily to the security guard.

And those people who leave without taking / immediately bin their receipt? You are supposed to keep hold of your bus ticket until your journey has been completed but how many people receive a ticket and put it immediately in the bin by the driver. One of the (many) announcements on trains nowadays is 'to retain your ticket until you exit the station as barriers are in operation'. I assume this is because many people did with their train tickets similar as they did with their bus tickets, put it in the bin on the train as they alighted.

 

[SteveM70]

And those people who leave without taking / immediately bin their receipt?

They generally tailgate someone who did retain their receipt

 

[Baxenden Bank]

They generally tailgate someone who did retain their receipt

As people do with rail station barriers I suppose.

I say bring back the long counter with racks of items displayed behind that you request and an assistant retrieves. You know it makes sense. It is, after all, simply an extension of click and collect. Perhaps those stores with a serious shoplifting problem could introduce mandatory reservations compulsory click and collect, available up until 15 minutes before departure shopping time?

 

[Peter Sarf]

As people do with rail station barriers I suppose.

I say bring back the long counter with racks of items displayed behind that you request and an assistant retrieves. You know it makes sense. It is, after all, simply an extension of click and collect. Perhaps those stores with a serious shoplifting problem could introduce mandatory reservations compulsory click and collect, available up until 15 minutes before departure shopping time?

LIKE BUTTON deprressed !.

I am sure the measures being introduced to improve security will have some effect. How much effect they have against the tide of increased shoplifting is anybodies guess. I notice the Morrisons near me now has a minimum of two security staff - one hanging round near the self scan exit barrier. The alternative is fr supermarkets to turn a blind eye and just put the prices up to cover the costs of theft. Then see how many shoppers demand the costs are controlled !.

We could ask why shoplifting is getting more common. Times are hard OR is it that more and more people seem to think they can get away with it ?.
Time for another thread ?.
Quote me in a new thread !.

 

[sor]

At Morrisons I just gently push the barrier open, is that why an alarm goes off? Are there instructions to scan a receipt? I just see a barrier which doesn't open when I approach it so it needs some human assistance. What if you decline a receipt when the till prompts you?

In my experience elsewhere, such as at Albert Heijn, the tills always print something. Whether it is a full receipt or a little slip of paper on it that can open the barrier (and there's usually a bin overflowing with said slips).

It is rather repressive. More than once I ended up buying something just so I didn't have to ask someone to let me out, which perhaps is one of the reasons for introducing it!

 

[Hadders]

So I go into one of these stores, shove a bottle of spirits, a nice steak and a block of cheese in my 'shoplifters jacket' pockets, then buy a banana for 19p cash to get a receipt to exit the store. Got to get your five-a-day I say merrily to the security guard.

A bit like someone 'doughnutting' on the railway, buying a ticket to the next station to get through the barriers! As I say, these barriers wson't on their own solve shoplifting but they are part of an overall package in the same way that barriers at railway stations are part of a revenue protection strategy.

I am sure the measures being introduced to improve security will have some effect. How much effect they have against the tide of increased shoplifting is anybodies guess. I notice the Morrisons near me now has a minimum of two security staff - one hanging round near the self scan exit barrier. The alternative is fr supermarkets to turn a blind eye and just put the prices up to cover the costs of theft. Then see how many shoppers demand the costs are controlled !.

There's a Greggs store in west London that often has two security guards.
I know coffee shops with security guards.

 

[Peter Sarf]

.......................

There's a Greggs store in west London that often has two security guards.
I know coffee shops with security guards.

This must be adding significantly to overheads for such a small shop !.