TPE Nova 3 (Class 68 + Mk5s) updates and withdrawal from service

[BoroAndy]

So is the Scarborough tmd going to be used during the daytime, or shut completely.?

 

[Watershed]

So is the Scarborough tmd going to be used during the daytime, or shut completely.?

For the time being it won't be used at all.

 

[DarloRich]

For clarification:

At present TPE Class 68's are confined (apart from a couple of staff knowledge retention runs) to York > Scarborough > York shuttles?

 

[Watershed]

For clarification:

At present TPE Class 68's are confined (apart from a couple of staff knowledge retention runs) to York > Scarborough > York shuttles?

There is currently one train each way over the Pennines, and from 16 August that will become two each way. But yes, otherwise just York-Scarborough.

It will take until December for there to be any more services over the Pennines.

 

[DarloRich]

There is currently one train each way over the Pennines, and from 16 August that will become two each way. But yes, otherwise just York-Scarborough.

It will take until December for there to be any more services over the Pennines.

thanks - bit out of touch tbh. I asked as recently I have only seen 68's at York heading over the river towards Scarborough

Are there 800's getting more use ?( OT for this sorry)

 

[Halish Railway]

thanks - bit out of touch tbh. I asked as recently I have only seen 68's at York heading over the river towards Scarborough

Are there 800's getting more use ?( OT for this sorry)

I’m assuming that you’re referring to the 802s. If so the answer is no, we will have to wait for the Newcastle to Manchester Airport trains to be reinstated for that to happen, although we won’t see the fleet being used to its full potential with the Edinburgh extension being binned.

There is a thread about how TPE could utilise their Rolling stock post May 2022 that I would link but I can’t find it.

 

[Watershed]

Are there 800's getting more use ?( OT for this sorry)

802s, yes. The fleet of 19 was sized for an hourly Liverpool to Edinburgh and hourly Manchester Airport to Newcastle service, neither of which will now be returning in full. LIV-EDB will be curtailed at NCL as part of the ECML recast. MIA-NCL will only run between Manchester Victoria and York due to the combination of MRTF and ECML, so it could be operated by 185s or 68s if that ends up working out better.

There will be a couple of units used on minor bits and pieces (e.g. Newcastle-Edinburgh) but with only 7 firm diagrams on LIV-NCL, that leaves about half the fleet unaccounted for. There are certainly a wide variety of options being considered for that remainder.

 

[L+Y]

It will take until December for there to be any more services over the Pennines.

To expand on this a little, if you're at liberty to divulge- I've heard conflicting things about Nova 3 diagram ramp ups, between December 21 and May 22. To your knowledge, will we see additional diagrams from December, with perhaps a further ramp up in May? Or is it more of a "December at the earliest", rather than a December commitment?

There will be a couple of units used on minor bits and pieces (e.g. Newcastle-Edinburgh) but with only 7 firm diagrams on LIV-NCL, that leaves about half the fleet unaccounted for. There are certainly a wide variety of options being considered for that remainder.

Off topic, but am I right to assume the proposed WCML 802 working will cover an additional diagram? I wonder if, capacity and covid loadings permitting, an expanded Liverpool-Scotland via WCML offering could account for some units?

 

[Watershed]

To expand on this a little, if you're at liberty to divulge- I've heard conflicting things about Nova 3 diagram ramp ups, between December 21 and May 22. To your knowledge, will we see additional diagrams from December, with perhaps a further ramp up in May? Or is it more of a "December at the earliest", rather than a December commitment?

Yes to all those questions - nothing is likely to change between 16 August and December. December is slated for a certain degree of uplift, the remainder is currently pencilled in for May but we'll see about both those things!

Off topic, but am I right to assume the proposed WCML 802 working will cover an additional diagram? I wonder if, capacity and covid loadings permitting, an expanded Liverpool-Scotland via WCML offering could account for some units?

At least one unit, yes. I think the WCML certainly offers the biggest scope for a short to medium term increase compared to pre-Covid (you only have to look at how busy some of the LIV-GLC services are getting) but the first step is returning to the pre-Covid timetable, which isn't currently achievable just with 397s.

 

[NorthWestRover]

There is currently one train each way over the Pennines, and from 16 August that will become two each way.

What is the second diagram going to be?

 

[37201xoIM]

What is the second diagram going to be?

See post 957 above...

 

[xotGD]

See post 957 above...

These have produced today, I see.

I might be tempted to have a trip out on Saturday.

 

[NorthWestRover]

I might at some point in the not too distant future. Good +30 connection at Leeds.

 

[xotGD]

I might at some point in the not too distant future. Good +30 connection at Leeds.

+11 at Garforth. But you would have missed it today!

 

[Watershed]

I might at some point in the not too distant future. Good +30 connection at Leeds.

That's the connection the Manchester traincrew make (they work these services Manchester-Leeds-Manchester), so you're effectively guaranteed to make it.

 

[xotGD]

Quite a few doing the Garforth leap today.

Number 20 for number 24.

 

[Cheshire Scot]

Off topic, but am I right to assume the proposed WCML 802 working will cover an additional diagram? I wonder if, capacity and covid loadings permitting, an expanded Liverpool-Scotland via WCML offering could account for some units?

At least one unit, yes. I think the WCML certainly offers the biggest scope for a short to medium term increase compared to pre-Covid (you only have to look at how busy some of the LIV-GLC services are getting) but the first step is returning to the pre-Covid timetable, which isn't currently achievable just with 397s.

Is there a current issue with class 397s which would prevent them covering the full pre-Covid timetable as originally planned? Sorry if I am not up to speed but 10 diagrams from 12, 8 for the Manchester services and two for the Liverpool was the plan. On the face of it as a minimum cl 802 only need to replace cl397 for one leg in each direction to access Craigentinny.

Additional Liverpool to Scotland services would we welcome as traffic levels build up, and with cl802 already being serviced at Edge Hill but maintained at Craigentinny (as well as Doncaster) this would fit nicely but on the other hand the increased capacity of 802 vice 397 (around 20% more seats) might be better utilised on the busiest Manchester to Edinburgh legs.

 

[Watershed]

Is there a current issue with class 397s which would prevent them covering the full pre-Covid timetable as originally planned? Sorry if I am not up to speed but 10 diagrams from 12, 8 for the Manchester services and two for the Liverpool was the plan. On the face of it as a minimum cl 802 only need to replace cl397 for one leg in each direction to access Craigentinny.

Additional Liverpool to Scotland services would we welcome as traffic levels build up, and with cl802 already being serviced at Edge Hill but maintained at Craigentinny (as well as Doncaster) this would fit nicely but on the other hand the increased capacity of 802 vice 397 (around 20% more seats) might be better utilised on the busiest Manchester to Edinburgh legs.

Yes, their reliability is still too low. It's better than it was a few months ago, but you would likely have at least 1 or 2 diagrams cancelled each day if you returned to the 10 diagram (pre-Covid) timetable tomorrow.

That's aside from the benefit of being able to cycle sets in and out of Craigentinny - albeit on that front, the December TT will improve matters considerably.

 

[Cheshire Scot]

Yes, their reliability is still too low. It's better than it was a few months ago, but you would likely have at least 1 or 2 diagrams cancelled each day if you returned to the 10 diagram (pre-Covid) timetable tomorrow.

Ouch!

 

[NorthWestRover]

Quite a few doing the Garforth leap today.

Number 20 for number 24.

What was your move? I considered Manchester to Leeds and back, but decided I needed to rest instead. Had a busy weekend last week and then was out for a meal and some drinks last night.

 

[xotGD]

What was your move? I considered Manchester to Leeds and back, but decided I needed to rest instead. Had a busy weekend last week and then was out for a meal and some drinks last night.

I wondered if we might coincide.

Hudds - Garforth - Hudds makes the most of West Yorkshire validity!

 

[XAM2175]

Is anybody able to give an outline of the booked Mk 5a services on Monday 6 September? I'll be passing through York that day with a bit of time to waste.

Thanks in advance, and apologies if I've not looked hard enough!

 

[Watershed]

Is anybody able to give an outline of the booked Mk 5a services on Monday 6 September? I'll be passing through York that day with a bit of time to waste.

Thanks in advance, and apologies if I've not looked hard enough!

Should be exactly the same as any other weekday, you can look at this Friday for an idea of allocations on RTT.

 

[XAM2175]

Should be exactly the same as any other weekday, you can look at this Friday for an idea of allocations on RTT.

Cheers!

 

[43 302]

68018 reportedly on set TP12 at Basford Hall.

 

[Ryry]

Hopefully this means more testing up towards saltburn

 

[43096]

68018 reportedly on set TP12 at Basford Hall.

68018 isn't one of those modified to work with the TPE sets. So unless it's been modified it can only be dragging the set around not in passenger service.

 

[43 302]

Hopefully this means more testing up towards saltburn

I find it odd as 68018 isn't one of the ones fitted with mods for Mk5 operation.

 

[45039]

185102/124 on 1E41 yesterday what happened ? But got some mileage out of south pennine day ranger so not withered

 

[Killingworth]

New dawn on South Pennine prior to some diagrams running to Liverpool from May. Traction training started today, 0Z31 07.09 Longsight to Sheffield.