UK face coverings discussion

[trainophile]

Only covered areas of platforms require masks to be worn. If you can stand in the open air not under a canopy you don't have to wear them.

Edit: It may be different in Scotland.

 

[Huntergreed]

Only covered areas of platforms require masks to be worn. If you can stand in the open air not under a canopy you don't have to wear them.

Edit: It may be different in Scotland.

That’s right, in Scotland it’s anywhere on the station (even on the open platforms), which has been done purely to be different from England and to make Sturgeon seem “safer” than her English counterpart.

 

[island]

Only covered areas of platforms require masks to be worn. If you can stand in the open air not under a canopy you don't have to wear them.

Edit: It may be different in Scotland.

It’s also different for TfL-managed stations where notices under byelaw 12 require face coverings to be worn everywhere in the station.

 

[trainophile]

It’s also different for TfL-managed stations where notices under byelaw 12 require face coverings to be worn everywhere in the station.

Would that be because those stations are mostly under cover anyway, so no point confusing things by making exceptions?

 

[peteb]

Only covered areas of platforms require masks to be worn. If you can stand in the open air not under a canopy you don't have to wear them.

Edit: It may be different in Scotland.

All these people not wearing masks were under the canopy, we walked to end of platform (not under canopy) but still kept masks on. Most of those not wearing masks looked 16-24 age bracket.

 

[trainophile]

All these people not wearing masks were under the canopy, we walked to end of platform (not under canopy) but still kept masks on. Most of those not wearing masks looked 16-24 age bracket.

Well that's down to the station staff to have a word with them. I have seen youngsters holding the sleeve of a cardigan over their face on a train, then removing it when the guard has gone by. Wondered why nothing was said.

 

[Huntergreed]

Just saw another example of a strong authoritian attitude towards masks on LNER. Train Manager came through to make sure everyone was wearing a mask. One man wasn’t and the conversation went like:

Train Manager: Excuse me sir you need to wear a mask

Customer: I don’t need to if I’m drinking

Train Manager: You only picked the bottle up to takea sip when I walked through, you need to wear a mask

Customer: But I’m drinking

Train Manager: WEAR A MASK! (This was with a raised voice), Do you want a £100 fine??

Customer: But I’m genuinely drinking, I don’t have to!

Train Manager: You only picked it up when I walked through to take a sip, you must wear a mask, I’m going to come through again and check later, if you don’t put it on then I’ll phone the police and you’ll be getting a fine. (Walks away)

That’s my second LNER trip where I’ve seen a strong authoritarian attitude towards masks displayed. Do you think this is worth a complaint?

I should add that this was in first class.

 

[greyman42]

At WOF awaiting 1426 to Stratford. Hardly anyone wearing masks on platform, estimate 4 out of 20 mask wearing. Why???

Because most people don't like wearing masks.

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

Because most people don't like wearing masks.

And they have very little to no benefit outdoors.

 

[island]

Would that be because those stations are mostly under cover anyway, so no point confusing things by making exceptions?

Plenty of outer suburban stations and most of the DLR are above ground.

All these people not wearing masks were under the canopy, we walked to end of platform (not under canopy) but still kept masks on. Most of those not wearing masks looked 16-24 age bracket.

Assuming a National Rail station in England, masks are not required to be worn under canopies, only if there is a complete roof and walls enclosing more than half of the perimeter of the roof.

 

[birchesgreen]

Assuming a National Rail station in England, masks are not required to be worn under canopies, only if there is a complete roof and walls enclosing more than half of the perimeter of the roof.

Though you'll be hard pressed to find any NR or TOC poster which details this.

 

[trebor79]

Because most people don't like wearing masks.

And they have very little to no benefit outdoors.

Very little to no benefit anywhere.

 

[kez19]

Just saw another example of a strong authoritian attitude towards masks on LNER. Train Manager came through to make sure everyone was wearing a mask. One man wasn’t and the conversation went like:















That’s my second LNER trip where I’ve seen a strong authoritarian attitude towards masks displayed. Do you think this is worth a complaint?

I should add that this was in first class.

What difference would the police be on board? Delay passengers further? I didn’t realise incidents like this happened in first class (that’s a first)

I would make a complaint see how far it goes but I could just see them fobbing you off with a “sorry” and probably expect the mask policy in the email

Very little to no benefit anywhere.

I’ve noticed myself whilst I wear a mask at work I’m ok with one, but if I am going to shops or travel I seem to have some sort of anxiety attack (this happens every now and again), I have noticed this since the beginning of it, I doubt I be exempt either since I wear it in one environment but not the other.

 

[CHESHIRECAT]

Travelled on TPE Huddersfield /Darlington Friday evening; sat in aisle seat (don't judge me!)

Conductor walks through and says the word 'ticket'; not 'may I see your ticket' or a general tickets and passes please

Ticket was on table; showed it to him; and he said put your mask on; had it round neck as had drink on table ; he said I should have it on and I was being awkward; I did take a sip at that point whereupon he said I was being silly!; also asked me to move to aisle seat so he could work safely (which I did ) appalling attitude

there then followed numerous announcements that it was not in the spirit to have a drink ready to avoid wearing a mask or people would make the same drink last from Liverpool to Newcastle'

Complaint sent in; have received a response asking for more details (had already sent everything in with copy of ticket)

By the look of it their 'Customer Relations' is outsourced from the way the reply has been written

Had journey couple of weeks ago; I was on table of 4 by window; two couples boarded at York; wanted to it together so offered to move; they said thanks

RPI then comes round and told them all to move to window seats as it wasn't safe for him to work! ; felt sorry for the group of 4 (two couples) who were just enjoying a day out

Was the R.P.I. that was on the recent T.V. series !

 

[Huntergreed]

Travelled on TPE Huddersfield /Darlington Friday evening; sat in aisle seat (don't judge me!)

Conductor walks through and says the word 'ticket'; not 'may I see your ticket' or a general tickets and passes please

Ticket was on table; showed it to him; and he said put your mask on; had it round neck as had drink on table ; he said I should have it on and I was being awkward; I did take a sip at that point whereupon he said I was being silly!; also asked me to move to aisle seat so he could work safely (which I did ) appalling attitude

there then followed numerous announcements that it was not in the spirit to have a drink ready to avoid wearing a mask or people would make the same drink last from Liverpool to Newcastle'

Complaint sent in; have received a response asking for more details (had already sent everything in with copy of ticket)

By the look of it their 'Customer Relations' is outsourced from the way the reply has been written

Had journey couple of weeks ago; I was on table of 4 by window; two couples boarded at York; wanted to it together so offered to move; they said thanks

RPI then comes round and told them all to move to window seats as it wasn't safe for him to work! ; felt sorry for the group of 4 (two couples) who were just enjoying a day out

Was the R.P.I. that was on the recent T.V. series !

Very rude, and clearly very strongly pro-mask. Absolutely right to complain.

I witnessed a passenger having a very similar exchange with a slightly militant TM just a few hours ago.

I’ve recently learned just how the rail industry treats their passengers, if this was any other industry at all they wouldn’t get away with it. How on Earth do we stop this?

 

[Jozhua]

They could also start by stopping authoritarian guards and staff enforcing their own mask agendas above and beyond the legislation. No wonder some people feel discouraged to travel by train, I‘ve had a guard who watches CCTV and confront non-wearers, Two guards from the same TOC telling people off for eating/drinking (one of whom shouted at an elderly lady), and a guard telling someone off for not having an exemption certificate.

Masks are uncomfortable and when staff try to be authoritarian over them it really puts me (a rail enthusiast) off travelling by rail, goodness knows what the general public must think.

Yeah, sounds a bit OTT. You are allowed to take off to eat and drink. Especially if you need to take medication.

Guards should be given disposable ones to hand out in case someone isn't wearing. That has to reduce risk much more than yelling at people...

(Btw, get one of the fabric ones from Wilkos, they are wayy more comfortable and less smelly than the disposables)

 

[ScottGallagher]

Travelled on TPE Huddersfield /Darlington Friday evening; sat in aisle seat (don't judge me!)

Conductor walks through and says the word 'ticket'; not 'may I see your ticket' or a general tickets and passes please

Ticket was on table; showed it to him; and he said put your mask on; had it round neck as had drink on table ; he said I should have it on and I was being awkward; I did take a sip at that point whereupon he said I was being silly!; also asked me to move to aisle seat so he could work safely (which I did ) appalling attitude

there then followed numerous announcements that it was not in the spirit to have a drink ready to avoid wearing a mask or people would make the same drink last from Liverpool to Newcastle'

Complaint sent in; have received a response asking for more details (had already sent everything in with copy of ticket)

By the look of it their 'Customer Relations' is outsourced from the way the reply has been written

Had journey couple of weeks ago; I was on table of 4 by window; two couples boarded at York; wanted to it together so offered to move; they said thanks

RPI then comes round and told them all to move to window seats as it wasn't safe for him to work! ; felt sorry for the group of 4 (two couples) who were just enjoying a day out

Was the R.P.I. that was on the recent T.V. series !

Some people in these situations just get off on being an absolute pr*** full of their own non self importance.
100% right to complain don't hold your breath for an apology but there's a slim chance he will get a talking to.

 

[Fokx]

They could also start by stopping authoritarian guards and staff enforcing their own mask agendas above and beyond the legislation. No wonder some people feel discouraged to travel by train, I‘ve had a guard who watches CCTV and confront non-wearers, Two guards from the same TOC telling people off for eating/drinking (one of whom shouted at an elderly lady), and a guard telling someone off for not having an exemption certificate.

Masks are uncomfortable and when staff try to be authoritarian over them it really puts me (a rail enthusiast) off travelling by rail, goodness knows what the general public must think.

That doesn’t address the issue of the other side of the spectrum of those who feel anxious or discouraged from travelling because people aren’t wearing masks or are wearing them incorrectly.

Masks may be uncomfortable but they’re now a requirement for a large portion of those travelling. I’m of the persuasion of “Don’t want to wear one? Then don’t travel on public transport”. Personally I won’t question anyone who isn’t wearing a face covering but I will rhetorically ask those who are wearing a mask to wear it correctly over both their nose and mouth or in most cases to wear it on their face and not laid out on the table soon after the train departs.

 

[CHESHIRECAT]

It was the initial approach of 'ticket' which I found quite rude anyway; the rest just snowballed... i'm not one of these who think it should be 'Sir' (actually find it a bit subservient to be honest!) but had he said may i see you ticket and when you've had a drink pop your mask on.. would have been a whole different 'kettle de poisson'!

 

[trainophile]

We need to be careful not to give the impression of taking the mick, otherwise they will ban drinking at all on trains.

 

[island]

We need to be careful not to give the impression of taking the mick, otherwise they will ban drinking at all on trains.

It’s getting that way; the current Welsh regulations state that removing a face covering to facilitate eating or drinking must be reasonable (having regard to the length of the journey) and do not have an exemption for those for whom wearing a face covering would cause severe distress.

 

[trebor79]

Just saw another example of a strong authoritian attitude towards masks on LNER. Train Manager came through to make sure everyone was wearing a mask. One man wasn’t and the conversation went like:















That’s my second LNER trip where I’ve seen a strong authoritarian attitude towards masks displayed. Do you think this is worth a complaint?

I should add that this was in first class.

I'd complain. Disgraceful behaviour, first or standard class the staff should not be raising their voice to passengers, nor treating them like naughty schoolchildren.

 

[Ianno87]

It will entirely depend on the state of the country by then of course, but, if we assume the virus is still prominent with no vaccine, I don't see people leaving their 'safe' cars (with no need for masks) for trains (with a need for masks) in mid-winter, unless the train becomes very significantly cheaper than the car, which, if two or more people are involved, is unlikely for many journeys, even at a 20% lower fare. The situation is changing so quickly that I really can't even stab at where we may be by then. An evening-out of the peak/off-peak load would be good in general, but will we ever see the traditional 'high' peak again?

Masks / face coverings might actually be appreciated as winter face-warmers.

 

[birchesgreen]

Masks are uncomfortable and when staff try to be authoritarian over them it really puts me (a rail enthusiast) off travelling by rail, goodness knows what the general public must think.

Try a cloth mask which you can tie behind your head, surgical mask style, much more comfortable than the ones you hoop behind your ears.

 

[Ianno87]

Try a cloth mask which you can tie behind your head, surgical mask style, much more comfortable than the ones you hoop behind your ears.

Given masks are, like them or not, likely to be around for a while, it's worth spending a few quid on a comfortable re-usable one, rather than a fortune on uncomfortable disposible ones.

 

[birchesgreen]

Given masks are, like them or not, likely to be around for a while, it's worth spending a few quid on a comfortable re-usable one, rather than a fortune on uncomfortable disposible ones.

Exactly, i managed a full 6.5 hours with mine yesterday, to be honest i forgot i was wearing it at times. Etsy has plenty of ones people can try.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It was the initial approach of 'ticket' which I found quite rude anyway

I wonder what response you'd have got to "ticket what?"

 

[CHESHIRECAT]

I wonder what response you'd have got to "ticket what?"

I did actually say 'sorry do you mean can I say your ticket !' And he said yes...I'm still in shock lol

 

[packermac]

Very rude, and clearly very strongly pro-mask. Absolutely right to complain.

I witnessed a passenger having a very similar exchange with a slightly militant TM just a few hours ago.

I’ve recently learned just how the rail industry treats their passengers, if this was any other industry at all they wouldn’t get away with it. How on Earth do we stop this?

Aviation gets away with it (as you call it) far more than rail does. Just read some of the aviation press.

 

[yorkie]

That’s my second LNER trip where I’ve seen a strong authoritarian attitude towards masks displayed. Do you think this is worth a complaint?

Yes.

I’ve recently learned just how the rail industry treats their passengers, if this was any other industry at all they wouldn’t get away with it. How on Earth do we stop this?

We can't.

The rail industry has always had a smattering of staff who behave this way, and this pandemic has allowed authoritarians carte blanche to be rude and obnoxious. If you are rude back you can be removed from the train. The Unions are very strong. They hold all the cards. Be very careful when interacting with such people.

It was the initial approach of 'ticket' which I found quite rude anyway; the rest just snowballed... i'm not one of these who think it should be 'Sir' (actually find it a bit subservient to be honest!) but had he said may i see you ticket and when you've had a drink pop your mask on.. would have been a whole different 'kettle de poisson'!

Some authoritarian staff start off by being rude in the hope that things will escalate; they can then say you have committed an offence and must be removed from the train.

Be very careful to remain calm and not to rise to any such provocation; it's not exactly a level playing field...

Northern have instructed their on-board staff staff:

You must not attempt to “police” any Covid-19 passenger instructions

I do not know if any other companies have issued such an instruction.

Of course the vast majority of staff will adhere to this, but I can't see the authoritarian ones sticking to this instruction, and indeed I've heard numerous reports of poor behaviour by a minority of staff. Any instances of poor behaviour should be reported, though it's unlikely to have much effect.