Westlink - Demand Responsive Transport (West of England Combined Authority)

[richw]

Surely that should be the other way around - Big Lemon running services on hire to Westlink / E-Zec?

It would be correct if it’s using a Lemon o licence.

 

[Citistar]

It would be correct if it’s using a Lemon o licence.

Given the fuss made previously by the Western area Traffic Commissioners regarding dry hiring of vehicles and a separate party who isn't the licence holder paying the drivers, i would sincerely hope that vehicles operated by Lemon using Lemon staff are on a Lemon O licence.

 

[bristol1996]

Given the fuss made previously by the Western area Traffic Commissioners regarding dry hiring of vehicles and a separate party who isn't the licence holder paying the drivers, i would sincerely hope that vehicles operated by Lemon using Lemon staff are on a Lemon O licence.

Yes I am pretty sure they are on a Big Lemon O license; again comments when you do not have a clue.

 

[Marcus Fryer]

I was speaking to a Westlink driver yesterday and he said they are getting an additional 7 vans and recruiting more drivers.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I was speaking to a Westlink driver yesterday and he said they are getting an additional 7 vans and recruiting more drivers.

Thus increasing the cost?

This is the problem with these schemes - to make them genuinely usable they cost more, and serve fewer people well, than reverting to timetabled rural bus routes.

 

[Marcus Fryer]

Thus increasing the cost?

This is the problem with these schemes - to make them genuinely usable they cost more, and serve fewer people well, than reverting to timetabled rural bus routes.

I think it’s because the demand has been higher than expected. I’ve had several instances recently where no rides have been available when I’ve requested one.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think it’s because the demand has been higher than expected. I’ve had several instances recently where no rides have been available when I’ve requested one.

This is almost universal in these schemes and is not because they serve large numbers of people, but rather because journeys usually don't match up and so they basically just operate as a subsidised taxi service for the few that manage to get one. You can see that that has been accepted in Milton Keynes as quite a few MG5 estate cars are running around on it now...

 

[Marcus Fryer]

This is almost universal in these schemes and is not because they serve large numbers of people, but rather because journeys usually don't match up and so they basically just operate as a subsidised taxi service for the few that manage to get one. You can see that that has been accepted in Milton Keynes as quite a few MG5 estate cars are running around on it now...

Yes, I agree with that to some extent. Most of the rides I’ve had, I’ve been the only passenger. I don’t think the software is as good as was promised, in that it should be in identifying more shared rides opportunities.

 

[Dai Corner]

Yes, I agree with that to some extent. Most of the rides I’ve had, I’ve been the only passenger. I don’t think the software is as good as was promised, in that it should be in identifying more shared rides opportunities.

Yes, the Via software that TfW's Fflecsi DRT uses just allows you to check whether a journey you specify can be fulfilled. It doesn't check whether one involving a longer walk at one or both ends and/or a different time could be. I'd say those were fairly obvious enhancements.

 

[TheManOnThe172]

This is almost universal in these schemes and is not because they serve large numbers of people, but rather because journeys usually don't match up and so they basically just operate as a subsidised taxi service for the few that manage to get one. You can see that that has been accepted in Milton Keynes as quite a few MG5 estate cars are running around on it now...

Constructing efficient routes is complicated.

A friend with a PhD in scheduling did some work for a major delivery network, writing software that would decide which half-day delivery slots it could offer you when you bought something from one of the firms using them for fulfillment.

AIUI, for every possible half-day, the software looked at every vehicle going anywhere within a wide radius of the customer - to see if the drop could be accommodated efficiently by modifying an existing schedule. If not, the software then tried to shift existing bookings (also in half-day slots, so usefully flexible) between vehicles to find the least-expensive set of routes. So if you were needing a delivery to Chesterfield, it would see if it could shift someone else's drop in Sheffield from vehicle A (mostly delivering in Derbyshire that day) to vehicle B (mostly delivering around Barnsley that day), so that Vehicle A would then have time to fit the Chesterfield drop in between existing drops to Alfreton and to Dronfield. And it did this within about a second so that the customer could be offered the options without a noticeable delay.

By contrast, anywhere-to-anywhere DRT software fixes exact pickup and dropoff times at the point of booking, so giving no flexibility to re-order pickups in light of bookings that come in later. And many DRT schemes have a single vehicle per zone, meaning that there is no scope to shuffle bookings between vehicles.

It's no surprise that DRT utilisation is so poor, and costs so high.

 

[Marcus Fryer]

Chaotic journey with WESTlink this afternoon. I wanted to book a ride from Axbridge to Weston-super-Mare for around 14:00. After trying unsuccessfully at intervals from about 08:45, at around 13:10 I finally managed to book a ride which at that time was expected to arrive about 13:45. Watching on the app, the van seemed to get stuck at Congresbury. Then I got a call from WESTlink support who said they’d had to cancel the ride because there were problems with the bus and they would send a taxi for me and another person who also wanted to go to Weston. However, the bus continued on its journey and arrived at Axbridge about 14:05, before the taxi arrived. We got on, but were then told we had to get off and wait for the taxi as WESTlink control had cancelled the ride. By then the taxi had arrived. The taxi driver told us this had happened to him before. He was being paid £21 to come out from Weston and collect us. The WESTlink driver didn’t make any comment when we told him his control had said there was a problem with the bus.

 

[Dai Corner]

Chaotic journey with WESTlink this afternoon. I wanted to book a ride from Axbridge to Weston-super-Mare for around 14:00. After trying unsuccessfully at intervals from about 08:45, at around 13:10 I finally managed to book a ride which at that time was expected to arrive about 13:45. Watching on the app, the van seemed to get stuck at Congresbury. Then I got a call from WESTlink support who said they’d had to cancel the ride because there were problems with the bus and they would send a taxi for me and another person who also wanted to go to Weston. However, the bus continued on its journey and arrived at Axbridge about 14:05, before the taxi arrived. We got on, but were then told we had to get off and wait for the taxi as WESTlink control had cancelled the ride. By then the taxi had arrived. The taxi driver told us this had happened to him before. He was being paid £21 to come out from Weston and collect us. The WESTlink driver didn’t make any comment when we told him his control had said there was a problem with the bus.

What better example could you wish for to show that a subsidised taxi service would be better than the 'solutions' being peddled by booking app and minibus suppliers?

 

[Marcus Fryer]

I was waiting for a T1 in Thornbury yesterday afternoon when a WESTlink van arrived and about 8 people got off! I think they were all travelling together as a group (possibly on ENTCS passes), and some weren’t local as they got on my T1 to get to Bristol Parkway (they knew they had to walk from Great Stoke). I suspect they had come from a pub somewhere in the South Gloucestershire countryside.

 

[The exile]

I become more and more convinced that DRT only has a chance of working properly when it is basically determining what size of vehicle is used for timetabled runs (or indeed if the service runs at all). Means less flexibility but greater reliability- which is probably the single most important thing for public transport.

 

[MotCO]

I was waiting for a T1 in Thornbury yesterday afternoon when a WESTlink van arrived and about 8 people got off! I think they were all travelling together as a group (possibly on ENTCS passes), and some weren’t local as they got on my T1 to get to Bristol Parkway (they knew they had to walk from Great Stoke). I suspect they had come from a pub somewhere in the South Gloucestershire countryside.

You'll probably find it was Roger French and his friends doing some 'research' trips on DRTs! https://busandtrainuser.com/a-short-history-of-drt/

 

[Callum15632]

What age do you have to be to work for WESTlink?

 

[Marcus Fryer]

What age do you have to be to work for WESTlink?

I don’t know. If you’re talking about driving, I would imagine it would be the same as any other minibus driver. However they’re not recruiting at present:

PCV/minibus driver

We have a fantastic opportunity for Drivers to join our new Community Care Team based in Bristol. Due to expansion here at EMED Group, we are looking for experienced drivers who hold a D Licence, D1 Licence or PSV Licence to join our Demand Response Transport (DRT) team to provide a...

emedgroup.bamboohr.com

 

[Marcus Fryer]

There is a zoom talk (open to all) by Jason Stevens-Read (National Operations Manager, Local Government Services, EMED Community Care) to the Omnibus Society on February 8th. He will look back over the last year at WESTlink.

SWW Zoom talk on WESTlink | Omnibus Society

www.omnibus-society.org

 

[Callum15632]

Are WESTlink on strike tomorrow as I can't get a ride? There are no rides available for tomorrow what so ever.

 

[Marcus Fryer]

Are WESTlink on strike tomorrow as I can't get a ride? There are no rides available for tomorrow what so ever.

It’s probably a software problem.

 

[Peter Philips]

There is a zoom talk (open to all) by Jason Stevens-Read (National Operations Manager, Local Government Services, EMED Community Care) to the Omnibus Society on February 8th. He will look back over the last year at WESTlink.

It was cancelled at the last moment unfortunately.

 

[Callum15632]

It’s probably a software problem.

It's okay it is fixed. I booked a ride at 09:30 for tomorrow so it was just a glitch I think.

Short of Westlinks today in The Future Transport Zone (FTZ) as I had a westlink ride earlier and it had to get cancelled as 1 WESTlink had a flat tyre and 1 had engine problems.

 

[Marcus Fryer]

It's okay it is fixed. I booked a ride at 09:30 for tomorrow so it was just a glitch I think.

Short of Westlinks today in The Future Transport Zone (FTZ) as I had a westlink ride earlier and it had to get cancelled as 1 WESTlink had a flat tyre and 1 had engine problems.

Did they arrange a taxi in lieu?

 

[Callum15632]

Did they arrange a taxi in lieu?

No, had to get the bus instead. They left me a voicemail to say about the vans had problems. It said in the text, if I want I can now book another westlink but it was 15:40 and there was no other westlinks available.

 

[freetoview33]

I tried the service on Thursday for the first time and I was so lucky as there was one going from where I was to where I wanted to go and I only had to wait 60 seconds for it to arrive.

 

[Dai Corner]

Westlink to change as minibus scheme is being 'abused'

One transport boss said the scheme was launched "at the worst possible time"

www.bristolpost.co.uk

Major changes to Westlink planned after minibus scheme ‘abused’
One transport boss said the scheme was launched "at the worst possible time.Major changes to the Westlink minibus service are planned next month to stop commuters from “abusing” the scheme. The dial-a-ride minibuses operate across the Bristol region but some users are booking trips far longer than intended, causing the service serious issues.

Westlink was launched in April last year, and is known as “demand responsive transport”. Passengers book a trip on an app, and a bright green minibus picks them up and in theory takes them to existing bus routes, for a £2 fareBut the service, set up by the West of England Combined Authority, has faced several problems including a shortage of drivers. From this April, the transport zones will be made much smaller, to stop passengers from booking excessively long trips, such as to Bristol Airport.

Bob Scowen, interim head of integrated transport operations at the combined authority, said: “There are changes to zones, and there also changes to what you can do. If an alternative bus service exists already, then you have to take that rather than take the whole journey from A to B on the minibus. There’s also some improvements to through-ticketing arrangements.”. He was speaking to councillors on the West of England audit committee, during a public meeting on Monday, March 4. Through-ticketing means passengers will be able to book just one ticket for a journey involving more than one bus ride, instead of paying for each ride.The scheme was “launched at the worst possible time”, according to Mr Scowen, due to a lack of bus drivers across the country. At the same time, almost half the subsidised bus routes in the West of England were withdrawn. These routes were unprofitable but received public funding, until local councils decided they could no longer afford to support them.

Mr Scowen said: “It wasn’t a direct like-for-like replacement and there has been confusion, quite understandably given its timing, about what Westlink was designed to do. It was never designed to and never can replace the withdrawn fixed services in rural areas.

“It was designed entirely differently, for a different purpose. That’s to complement the existing network, which many rural areas had no connection whatsoever to. It’s been unfairly blamed in many ways, for something it could never deliver in the first place.“We launched it at the very worst possible time, it was quite ambitious to launch it in three months. The truth is there was a national shortage of bus drivers, which is still actually an issue. To try and launch it when First Bus, the principal operator in the region, had 250 agency drivers was obviously quite challenging. It’s now vastly more reliable than it was when we launched it.”

 

[Callum15632]

Westlink to change as minibus scheme is being 'abused'

One transport boss said the scheme was launched "at the worst possible time"

www.bristolpost.co.uk

Does anyone know if the Future Transport Zone will still be there as I use WESTlink regularly to get to college and it takes 2 or 3 buses to get there if there wasn't WESTlink?

 

[-Colly405-]

From looking at the WECA registrations published today, it looks like FTZ stays. The registrations are for the following 'routes': Boyd Valley, Bristol South, Future Transport Zone, Portishead, Thornbury Rural, Weston, and Yate & Thornbury Town.

Info taken from https://travelwest.info/bus/registrations/register-of-local-bus-services-applications/

 

[Callum15632]

From looking at the WECA registrations published today, it looks like FTZ stays. The registrations are for the following 'routes': Boyd Valley, Bristol South, Future Transport Zone, Portishead, Thornbury Rural, Weston, and Yate & Thornbury Town.

Info taken from https://travelwest.info/bus/registrations/register-of-local-bus-services-applications/

That means that the Future Transport Zone goes doesn't it as it's not on the Registration list?

 

[lukem]

That means that the Future Transport Zone goes doesn't it as it's not on the Registration list?

Probably not being removed because it hasn't been deregistered, it's just that the other zones are new and th thus they are the only ones needing to be registered.