Yes, it will be interesting! Demand will still be lower than it usually would be though.
-
Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Brexit matters
- Thread starter Xenophon PCDGS
- Start date
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
Busaholic
Veteran Member
- Joined
- 7 Jun 2014
- Messages
- 14,125
Not been abroad since 1992, not further than Northern France since 1986, not out of Europe since 1979. Haven't got a passport, my last one expired three years ago having seen no use. Never had the time or money, now I'm retired I don't have the physical stamina, nor the mental stamina required to deal with airlines, Covid etc.
My only time abroad was in 1993 when I went on a band tour in Paris. I travelled on one of those cardboard temporary passports which was issued at the main post office in town. While I wouldn't say that I have no interest in foreign travel - there are definitely places I'd like to visit - it just hasn't been a priority for me.
My driving licence has always been sufficient ID whenever I've needed to produce it, and there was never any need to obtain a full passport for that reason. I do have some regrets that I've never held full EU passport, though; perhaps if I'd held one I might have been more inclined to bugger off for a weekend break somewhere.
Xenophon PCDGS
Veteran Member
Early in the 1980s, our family travelled with my mother to Rome for a two-week holiday but that is the only one abroad we have ever taken. There are so many places in England, Wales and Scotland worthy of holidaying. I must confess that Dorset, East Sussex and Hampshire have always been particular favourites of ours.
I certainly agree there are some really worthy locations to holiday in the UK. Scotland and Norfolk being two of my favourites, and cities like Bristol good for city breaks. I agree with East Sussex too, that is beautiful. Being from Kent, I can go on day trips, and it feels noticeably less cramped and congested than Kent.
Part of the joy I have with travelling is the differences in culture and language. It’s fascinating to see how different cultures are, especially so close to the UK. But also interesting to see how similar they are. I must confess to being slightly xenophobic as a teenager, but travelling around Europe and especially Eastern Europe really opened my eyes. For example, it made me realise the impression the right wing media gives of Eastern Europe is complete rubbish.
I fear both Covid and Brexit will lead to less connections being made between us and the continent. Less educational trips, less experiences of each other’s culture. These connections help to build relationships and help build tolerance of other cultures. I want the continental countries to continue to feel like neighbours, rather than strangers.
arbeia
Member
Less educational trips? Apparently the Erasmus scheme while in the European Union meant approx 18000 students etc. going overseas. The British Turing alternative is apparently catering for approx. 32000!
I will believe that when I see it funded. Last I heard it was somewhat lacking.
arbeia
Member
40,000 students funded to study across the globe by Turing Scheme - Turing Scheme
More than 40,000 young people are set to study and work around the world under the Turing Scheme. Read more in our latest news item.
www.turing-scheme.org.uk
Already funded apparently
Yes. In my comment I did say both Covid and Brexit.
In Kent, there have been no groups of language students, and no groups of French/Belgian students on day trips over the summer like there normally was. Covid is mainly to blame for that, but will it be as easy for school groups to pop over for the day to/from France with more time wasted at the borders? It will be interesting to see when things are slightly more ‘normal’.
Regarding the Turin programme, I don’t see any European countries mentioned there. Of course, it’s great to see it including Japan, Canada and the US, but I feel it’s important to also have those connections to neighbouring countries.
There's promised funding and then actual funding. This government is very good at the former, but they have history in failing at the latter.40,000 students funded to study across the globe by Turing Scheme - Turing Scheme
More than 40,000 young people are set to study and work around the world under the Turing Scheme. Read more in our latest news item.
Already funded apparently
Remember when the idea of drafting in the Army to deal with Brexit problems was part of Project Fear?
Army 'on standby' to deliver food amid shortage of lorry drivers
Britain faces a shortage of 100,000 truckers according to the Road Haulage Association.
metro.co.uk
Last edited:
brad465
Established Member
The Telegraph, Mail and Express now have articles from today on this subject, so it must be serious.Remember when the idea of drafting in the Army to deal with Brexit problems was part of Project Fear?
Army 'on standby' to deliver food amid shortage of lorry drivers
Britain faces a shortage of 100,000 truckers according to the Road Haulage Association.
Doppelganger
Member
- Joined
- 27 Jun 2011
- Messages
- 397
Sadly most Brits have their heads firmly up their @r$e$ and will deny there is an issue.
The widely reporty issues with empty shelves and logistical problems are being ridiculed by many, despite hard evidence to the contrary.
I think the likes of the Express and Mail will only reinforce the views of some that it is the EU who are responsible. Funnily the UK government are firmly laying the blame on COVID, but if you look across the water, shelves are full and there are no issues with delivery of produce.
I'll let you draw your own conclusions...
Intercity 225
Member
- Joined
- 2 Mar 2014
- Messages
- 329
I’m as pro-European as they come but in the interest of balance isn’t this because of the “pingdemic” not Brexit?
It’s both.
The government's mishandling of Covid plays into it, but it's mainly due to their mishandling of Brexit. As others have noted, our European neighbours aren't suffering the same supply-chain issues that we are.
Covid has slowed the rate of training new HGV drivers everywhere, but older drivers are still retiring. Drivers who need to isolate also reduces the number of drivers available.
EU nationals who were driving in the UK, can now pick up work in the EU, and avoid dealing with queues and paperwork at the border. They don't then risk being on the wrong side of the border it all kicks off between UK and France. They have a choice, and the UK either needs to pay them more, or get by with fewer drivers.
AlterEgo
Veteran Member
HGV driver pay has now increased with some retailers and places like Tesco and John Lewis are even offering sign-on “golden handshake” bonuses. John Lewis raised the salary by £5,000!
Seems a good time to be a British HGV driver.
The unlimited tap marked “cheap labour” has been turned off for many industries. Hospitality has a recruitment crisis because, essentially, they don’t pay people enough.
Wages and productivity are pretty poor in this country and one of the side effects of Brexit is having much less cheap labour coming in without any checks whatsoever.
Seems a good time to be a British HGV driver.
The unlimited tap marked “cheap labour” has been turned off for many industries. Hospitality has a recruitment crisis because, essentially, they don’t pay people enough.
Wages and productivity are pretty poor in this country and one of the side effects of Brexit is having much less cheap labour coming in without any checks whatsoever.
Last edited:
Pay is part of it, but mainly people don't want to do the jobs, regardless of pay (within reason, of course).
Xenophon PCDGS
Veteran Member
Could the fact that this country is both no longer part of the trading bloc and also separated from the European mainland by the English Channel be another matter that these drivers do not have to face when coming and going to mainland Europe countries?
class ep-09
Member
- Joined
- 5 Sep 2013
- Messages
- 526
As many EU truckers get paid per kilometre any delays with new red tape , on a return trip back to mainland Europe is a big set back to their earnings , hence they choose other European destinations.
There is also an issue of reduced number of pickups and drop offs in the UK.
In the past they could do number of drop offs and pick ups on the way to a place, where they collected a final load to the continent .
For example they could have a load from the continent to say Plymouth but return load was from say from Newcastle .
They could do number of collections on the way ( say from Plymouth to Brum , layer Brum to Leeds , Leeds to York , York to Newcastle ).
I think ( but I am not sure 100%) that stopped or has been vastly reduced .
What it means is that there is less opportunity to get kilometres in, plus there are more empty runs to do , making the continental transporting companies charging more the deliveries to UK consumers.
But hey that is what brexiters voted for .
There is also an issue of reduced number of pickups and drop offs in the UK.
In the past they could do number of drop offs and pick ups on the way to a place, where they collected a final load to the continent .
For example they could have a load from the continent to say Plymouth but return load was from say from Newcastle .
They could do number of collections on the way ( say from Plymouth to Brum , layer Brum to Leeds , Leeds to York , York to Newcastle ).
I think ( but I am not sure 100%) that stopped or has been vastly reduced .
What it means is that there is less opportunity to get kilometres in, plus there are more empty runs to do , making the continental transporting companies charging more the deliveries to UK consumers.
But hey that is what brexiters voted for .
The rules work both ways of course - in the old days UK drivers could head over to the continent, go round a load of places and then head back to the UK and drop off at a number of destinations, along with shifting stuff around the EU while doing so. I believe they're now limited to two stops while in the EU, so the ability for one driver to do multiple trips in one has been curtailed. It also means cost of transport has gone through the roof, the effects of which haven't yet really started to be felt.
British pilots are also getting a bit grumpy - turns out that by not remaining part of EASA that British pilot licences aren't as useful as they were a couple of years ago. They seem especially annoyed by jobs in the UK for EU registered airlines not accepting UK licences (while it also being quite correct that UK registered operators can only use UK licenced pilots).
Sadly all this was predicted, but simply dismissed as part of project fear.
British pilots are also getting a bit grumpy - turns out that by not remaining part of EASA that British pilot licences aren't as useful as they were a couple of years ago. They seem especially annoyed by jobs in the UK for EU registered airlines not accepting UK licences (while it also being quite correct that UK registered operators can only use UK licenced pilots).
Sadly all this was predicted, but simply dismissed as part of project fear.
YorkshireBear
Established Member
- Joined
- 23 Jul 2010
- Messages
- 8,699
I still don't understand how this sort of thing has occured. It's like they have just sold everyone down the creek to achieve a Brexit in the timescales defined. I think the impact of these small changes, and things like the HGV driver rules discussed above are not going to fully become clear until COVID is no longer impacting logistics in a major way.
Also notice today Vodaphone now introducing roaming charges for EU use.
That's exactly what has happened!
That's the danger of having a government lead by ideologues.
edwin_m
Veteran Member
Some of them are ideologues. Some of them are snake oil salesmen who are willing to ditch any principles they had, and see government as an extension of the Eton College debating society and getting one over the other guy as more important than doing what's best for Britain. Neither is a good qualification for running a government.
Oh, the current leadership of the Tory party are all ideologues. Some are committed to the idea that they're better than us, and the others are committed to the idea that we're not as good as them.
Xenophon PCDGS
Veteran Member
Have a look at the lyrics of the "Eton Boating Song".
DarloRich
Veteran Member
So we now need the army to deliver our food. in't brexit brilliant!
we will overlook the fact that the army will offer a fraction of the manpower required to fix the problem, that such manpower is not a long term solution, that we shouldn't be needing the army to deliver our food ( they have, you know, army jobs to do !) and that many of the TA people who drive army lorries also drive..................... commercial lorries for a living!
It is. A fantastic time according to one of my distant relatives who drives wagons. There is good money to be made. However, there aren't enough British HGV drivers because the pay has been poor for a long time and the hours long and unsociable so the bonuses don't actually help fix the problem.
A sensible leadership would have planned for this before deciding to turn off the taps of unlimited cheap labour!
we will overlook the fact that the army will offer a fraction of the manpower required to fix the problem, that such manpower is not a long term solution, that we shouldn't be needing the army to deliver our food ( they have, you know, army jobs to do !) and that many of the TA people who drive army lorries also drive..................... commercial lorries for a living!
It is. A fantastic time according to one of my distant relatives who drives wagons. There is good money to be made. However, there aren't enough British HGV drivers because the pay has been poor for a long time and the hours long and unsociable so the bonuses don't actually help fix the problem.
A sensible leadership would have planned for this before deciding to turn off the taps of unlimited cheap labour!
What a quaint concept...
All the shortage of workers is going to do is push up inflation, which then costs more to service the national debt, which then leads to further austerity and will eventually push up interest rates for mortgages while savers have the value of their money reduced due to piss poor interest rates.
Xenophon PCDGS
Veteran Member
The Bank of England currently seem to be looking at forward inflation with a different financial eye than they had pre-Covid 19 times.