Surely the case is now much stronger for Bere Alston - Tavistock - Okehampton!

[NorthernSpirit]

You're quite right of course. The central section should come back, linking Okehampton and Tavistock into a better regional network, rather than dead-end branches.

The route unfortunately suffers from NBOE (not being outside England).

The "central section" i.e. Okehampton to Tavistock could easily be built as far as the west end of Meldon viaduct, where a new station could be built and named Meldon West (for Okehampton), which as daft as it may sound would be a solution to getting the middle bit connected up much quicker as all that people would have to do would be to walk from one end of the viaduct to the other to continue their journey - this being a short term measure to allow the building of a new Meldon viaduct which could be located around 200 yards north of the existing structure.

On the Okehampton side of the viaduct a new station could be built and named Meldon East (which would be located 100 yards from the disused Dartmoor Railway platform, as this would allow space for the line to be connected up more easily. Once connected Meldon East would close and Meldon West becomes a request stop for walkers.

 

[Irascible]

Exeter was one of the last big PSB schemes done by BR. Its nearly 40 years old, and I have heard that the quality of kit used wasn’t quite as high as that used in earlier projects. However I imagine its good for a deacde or so more. Feltham (1974) is being replaced now, and Preston / Csrlisle of similar vintage are still going strong.

IIRC the main problem is changing anything outside of the immediate St Davids area is extremely hard ( one of the local S&T staff can surely weigh in there, there's been grumbling in the past ) and you can't reconfigure the b0x because the vendor went bust almost immediately after installing the kit.

The "central section" i.e. Okehampton to Tavistock could easily be built as far as the west end of Meldon viaduct, where a new station could be built and named Meldon West (for Okehampton), which as daft as it may sound would be a solution to getting the middle bit connected up much quicker as all that people would have to do would be to walk from one end of the viaduct to the other to continue their journey - this being a short term measure to allow the building of a new Meldon viaduct which could be located around 200 yards north of the existing structure.

On the Okehampton side of the viaduct a new station could be built and named Meldon East (which would be located 100 yards from the disused Dartmoor Railway platform, as this would allow space for the line to be connected up more easily. Once connected Meldon East would close and Meldon West becomes a request stop for walkers.

Well done

 

[RPI]

I think the "middle section" debate has been done to death now, but it will be interesting to see if the new station at Tavistock is built in such a way that doesn't hinder any future extension. There is the obvious issue of the low bridge over what is a relatively main road, should this ever be crossed again one would assume that the trackbed would need to be raised by a few feet, will the new station be built with that in mind.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Has there been much recent discussion on the matter of a reopened station in Tavistock either in the local press or on the local area TV programmes?

 

[Brush 4]

There are reports in the Cornish Times and Plymouth Herald if you search for Tavistock rail reopening. BBC Spotlight local news TV covered it but, interestingly, BBC Devon online ignored it.

Devon Council covered it below. I haven't seen any mention of the scheme being quietly dropped yet, as with say, Leamside.

Government support for Tavistock to Plymouth rail reinstatement earns warm welcome - News

The Government's decision to scrap the extension of HS2 from the West Midlands to Manchester means that investment will be re-directed across the country -

www.devon.gov.uk

The key phrase in there is shown here, even with the inevitable 'subject to'.

Minister of State for Rail Huw Merriman MP has confirmed that “the project will be funded to delivery, subject to future updates to the project business case”.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The key phrase in there is shown here, even with the inevitable 'subject to'.

The important thing to note is in the full wording of the last part of the sentence in the quote...."subject to future updates to the project business case"

 

[Brush 4]

I did note it, as in, 'the inevitable subject to'......

 

[zwk500]

The key phrase in there is shown here, even with the inevitable 'subject to'.

The key phrase *is* the 'subject to'

 

[Brush 4]

That's just the caveat, the key phrase is just before, unless he is lying. Do politicians ever lie? Surely not....

 

[Irascible]

Yeah, Devon news has been very quiet about it - the only reason Cullompton station has made it into the news is the local MPs are having a row involving it. A distinct lack of sensationalism.

 

[Bald Rick]

I think the "middle section" debate has been done to death now, but it will be interesting to see if the new station at Tavistock is built.

Corrected for you!

 

[BrianW]

Corrected for you!

Funding for West Devon Transport Hub in Okehampton announced/ confirmed/ supported???

EDIT: Quote:

'Our programme is supported by over £130 million in grants from Government programmes like the Large Local Major Schemes and Major Road Network programmes (North Devon Link, A382 scheme), Bus Service Improvement Plan (focused on Exeter, Newton Abbot and Barnstaple), Active Travel Fund (various schemes in Exeter, Queen St Newton Abbot and the Tarka Trail), Housing Infrastructure Fund (SW Exeter) and Levelling Up Fund (Dinan Way, Exmouth and Exmouth Gateway, the West Devon Transport Hub in Okehampton).'

(my capitals)

Cabinet approves £154m transport programme - News

Our cabinet rubberstamped its £154m Transport Capital Programme on Wednesday (October 11) which will see an ‘ambitious’ programme of rail and bus

www.devon.gov.uk

 

[Brush 4]

I want your link to be good news for Tavistock but, it isn't mentioned. rail is only mentioned in the first sentence, the rest is all roads and housing. Okehampton Parkway had already been approved.

 

[alf]

I want your link to be good news for Tavistock but, it isn't mentioned. rail is only mentioned in the first sentence, the rest is all roads and housing. Okehampton Parkway had already been approved.

I agree. This Devon County Council “Cabinet” press release is just a PR puff for a councillor, Andrea Davis.
As “Brush 4” says it contains no new news or any reference to the Tavistock extension.

But we should be nice to Cllr Davis. She is county councillor for the entire route of the Lynton & Barnstaple railway which needs all the help & allies it can get.

“BrianW” at post 132 was right to put question marks at the end of his sentence.
‘Funding for West Devon Transport Hub in Okehampton announced/ confirmed/ supported???’

I hope the Tavistock extension goes ahead with a terminus that does not rule out a further advance to Okehampton.

But this Devon release takes the project no further.

 

[Bartsimho]

This might come to the fore again after a train got stranded at Dawlish.

Adds fuel to the fire about the issue as this was a train fault caused by the weather which was bad but not totally unexpected.

It would create a good bit a resilience to the network in the area as well as the local benefits the rest of the time

 

[Bald Rick]

This might come to the fore again after a train got stranded at Dawlish.

It won‘t.

Adds fuel to the fire about the issue as this was a train fault caused by the weather which was bad but not totally unexpected.

Do you spend over a billion quid on a new line, or just make the trains work?

 

[Purple Train]

Do you spend over a billion quid on a new line, or just make the trains work?

Judging by the record of any passenger train built after 1987 on the sea wall, that seems significantly easier said than done.

Has there been any research as to the future effects of climate change on the sea wall section?

 

[Bald Rick]

Has there been any research as to the future effects of climate change on the sea wall section?

Yes, hence the invetment.

 

[Purple Train]

Yes, hence the invetment.

Interesting, I presumed that was a reaction to the 2014 breach.

Back to the subject at hand: the obvious issue with the reopening of Bere Alston-Okehampton as a through route is that it joins the main line heading east at St Budeaux. On the topic of the area, though, has the possibility of sticking in a loop at Bere Ferrers to make an hourly service possible been mooted?

 

[Bald Rick]

Interesting, I presumed that was a reaction to the 2014 breach.

It was both.

 

[Irascible]

This might come to the fore again after a train got stranded at Dawlish.

Adds fuel to the fire about the issue as this was a train fault caused by the weather which was bad but not totally unexpected.

It would create a good bit a resilience to the network in the area as well as the local benefits the rest of the time

If you're building a brand new railway between Plymouth & Exeter, why on earth would you build it through Okehampton. And it would be a new railway the entire way, unless you feel a barely signalled branch line is a suitable alternative.

 

[Brush 4]

If you are talking mega projects, in 1979, I thought the HST's just being introduced in the West Country, were wasted down there with all the sharp curves and many 60 limits. I designed in my head, a new route running parallel to the A38 dual carriageway from Exeter to Plymouth, with steep gradients including Rattery but a fast alignment.

The old line would have been retained for Torbay and become a local route via Totnes to Plymouth, for freight as well. I hadn't got as far as designing a new route through Cornwall. I probably ran out of space on the Corn Flakes packet or something......

 

[Bartsimho]

If you're building a brand new railway between Plymouth & Exeter, why on earth would you build it through Okehampton. And it would be a new railway the entire way, unless you feel a barely signalled branch line is a suitable alternative.

The idea was to combine several known benefits. Exeter to Okehampton has been very popular and could be doubled. Okehampton to Tavistock has been mooted as well citing the overperformance of Okehampton station. Tavistock to Plymouth is bandied around citing the success of Okehampton to Exeter and the current transport situation to Plymouth. Add on top of that extra resilience as it appears any rolling stock built after 1987 can't handle the sea wall in a rough sea state (think about the cost of modifying the fleet and you could use that as part of the funding instead even if that is a small amount of it).

 

[Irascible]

Except it leaves the population of Newton Abbott and the entire Torbay area ( which is big enough to be a UTA ) at the whims of the weather still. Totnes & the South Hams too, but in comparitive terms that's a more equal comparison to Okehampton as a railhead.

 

[Bartsimho]

Except it leaves the population of Newton Abbott and the entire Torbay area ( which is big enough to be a UTA ) at the whims of the weather still. Totnes & the South Hams too, but in comparitive terms that's a more equal comparison to Okehampton as a railhead.

That would only be providing benefit as a diversion though so it harder to make a case for.

Considering it was decided to upgrade the sea wall and get "trains that could handle the sea" (even if they can't) being able to aggregate several benefits into one project is more desirable

 

[The Ham]

Except it leaves the population of Newton Abbott and the entire Torbay area ( which is big enough to be a UTA ) at the whims of the weather still. Totnes & the South Hams too, but in comparitive terms that's a more equal comparison to Okehampton as a railhead.

As I've pointed out before, if there's a failure (and for the foreseeable future such a failure would only ever be temporary) the fact that such a significant area of population wouldn't be sharing rail replacement buses with other significant flows (Plymouth and the combined flow to/from Cornwall) would make it easier to travel.

Especially given there's often not as many bus/coach drivers as is needed to run services in many areas (not sure about local to Exeter/Plymouth/Torbay), which could make travel harder than it needed to be sure to fewer buses being able to operate.

If you've got a half full 9/10 coach 80x unloading 300 passengers that's about 4 buses with 75 on each (so likely double decker), if however that's 1/3 (as the other 2/3 stay on the train to get to Plymouth and Cornwall) that's two coaches. Meaning that it's much easier to provide the replacement transport (of course that goes for any alternative route, not just the visa Okehampton route).

 

[Mark J]

I've said before - a reopened Okehampton to Bere Alston route should be used as a circular route.

Trains going to Plymouth (from Exeter) either go via the Dawlish route, or the reopened Okehampton route. Returning back to Exeter along the other route that was not used to get there. No need to train reversals at Plymouth.

Trains that go to Cornwall continue to use the Dawlish route.

This would not only free up capacity on the Dawlish route, but also rejuvenate North Devon with a regular train service.

 

[The Planner]

I've said before - a reopened Okehampton to Bere Alston route should be used as a circular route.

Trains going to Plymouth (from Exeter) either go via the Dawlish route, or the reopened Okehampton route. Returning back to Exeter along the other route that was not used to get there. No need to train reversals at Plymouth.

Trains that go to Cornwall continue to use the Dawlish route.

This would not only free up capacity on the Dawlish route, but also rejuvenate North Devon with a regular train service.

What train services are being removed to free up capacity? How do you deal with the issue or services going to the same place via two routes, or are you splitting the service into two using the same unit, but different head codes either side of Plymouth? Otherwise you are potentially showing Exeter St Thomas via Okehampton and Plymouth vs the 1 mile from St Davids.

 

[Leuvenn]

It would be interesting to see the Meldon Quarry be re-opened. I went down there this August and was shocked at how well preserved things were. All signals seemed in order and there was even some rolling stock and standby.
If not for Quarry uses, could the Meldon site be used as a freight hub? It would be the only such hub west of Exeter and with decent road links to North and Central Devon might be worth investigating

 

[BrianW]

It would be interesting to see the Meldon Quarry be re-opened. I went down there this August and was shocked at how well preserved things were. All signals seemed in order and there was even some rolling stock and standby.
If not for Quarry uses, could the Meldon site be used as a freight hub? It would be the only such hub west of Exeter and with decent road links to North and Central Devon might be worth investigating

I admire the creative minds of Forumites and the 'what ifs' and 'maybes'; there will be many naysayers and opponents. My inclination is to think I'm probably not the first to have such and such a thought and others, with money, will have considered and rejected the idea. Why did the quarry close? Why is it maintained in good nick? Why is not already a freight hub? Wishing you well Leuvenn, and hoping you stimulate some more supportive responses.