Arriva Buses (including Greenline)

[Fleetmaster]

Metrobus made a success of Crawley because they were astute, locally focussed and knew their strengths. They were basically still the same outfit which ran the original Metrobus in Orpington, with much eye for detail, innovation, kept high standards, and able to smell out a commercial venture, but with the benefit of access to big group funding.

The tragedy being many of Arriva's purchases were well suited to such things, such as Northumbria. Opportunity missed.

 

[DunsBus]

Drawlane was also busy purchasing in 1987 but it was a much murkier state of affairs. Not least they got caught with an associate firm attempting to subvert the bidding process (in excess of the three businesses that you were allowed to buy) but there were further allegations of collusion and connections with ATL Holdings as well as buying stuff like London Country SW but the property going to a partner bidder so dubious that they really received the full benefit of the property portfolio. Remember that Stagecoach and Badgerline Holdings were both a) early in the privatisation game b) invested in new fleet and c) continued to be acquisitive (though I do agree that the overtures of Stagecoach could be persuasive based on fear). That Drawlane that begat British Bus, that then became Arriva (at least in part) had the purchasing bug but never seemed to have the money to really improve the fleet profile despite having some form of vertical integration from the ownership of East Lancs. It seemed under-capitalised with a focus on market share without the money to sustain; something that Stagecoach (and Badgerline) were able to do initially before floating in 1993 whilst Drawlane never had access to that sort of capital nor could generate enough internally.

Seem to recall the vehicle Drawlane used to try and get around the NBC bidding process was called Allied Holdings. Drawlane/British Bus never seemed to play by the rules, not least financially and it was trying to get extra funding by means of bribery which led to Dawson Williams' subsequent incarceration.

 

[Lynford1976]

Seem to recall the vehicle Drawlane used to try and get around the NBC bidding process was called Allied Holdings. Drawlane/British Bus never seemed to play by the rules, not least financially and it was trying to get extra funding by means of bribery which led to Dawson Williams' subsequent incarceration.

Quite. One wonders how different my career in the bus world may have progressed had Maidstone & District sold out to someone other than British Bus!

 

[DunsBus]

Quite. One wonders how different my career in the bus world may have progressed had Maidstone & District sold out to someone other than British Bus!

As @TGW has mentioned, Drawlane aka British Bus always seemed to have plenty of money for expansion but very little money for anything else. If I'm correct it was originally known as Endless Holdings, named after the street in Salisbury where the group HQ was located.
I suppose the frequent changes of name and the even more frequent group restructures should have set alarm bells ringing at the time, instead we had news of the dirty dealings at Endless Street emerging within days of the sale to Cowie.

 

[Tetchytyke]

What is this 5 year period people are talking about, because i'm sure West Riding/Yorkshire received new buses most years, unless it was before British Bus purchased them?

The new buses at West Riding/Yorkshire Woollen did dry up in the early 90s, to be fair. After the Lynxes there wasn’t much until the Striders. I honestly can’t remember if it was five years, but there was a gap.

Not sure comparing Busways and Northumbria is a fair comparison mind.

One is a complete gold mine with short fares through some of the most dense parts of Newcastle. The other mostly suburban routes other than North Tyneside which had the Metro and Northern to fight with

There are no trains to Blyth or Ashington, and the station in Morpeth is inconveniently sited.

If you can’t make serious money on expresses from Blyth and Ashington then you’re in the wrong game.

Standard capitalism. When things are being sold off en masse but there is a limited supply, you grab what you can and delay any other business imperatives. Market share is king. We can all name several smaller groups that stopped at a couple of divisions and then set about investing in vehicles and the like.

Absolutely. Yorkshire Rider got gobbled up by Badgerline because it didn’t continue expanding, it invested in its existing business.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The new buses at West Riding/Yorkshire Woollen did dry up in the early 90s, to be fair. After the Lynxes there wasn’t much until the Striders. I honestly can’t remember if it was five years, but there was a gap.

Last Lynxes arrived in Jan 1992 and the Striders began arriving in late 1993.

 

[Snex]

There are no trains to Blyth or Ashington, and the station in Morpeth is inconveniently sited.

If you can’t make serious money on expresses from Blyth and Ashington then you’re in the wrong game.

Had me confused for a second there, I meant Northern as in the pre Go North East rather than the railway company. Yeah agreed with the Blyth and Ashington expresses though, mind the Blyth and Tyne Railway reopening could change that.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Had me confused for a second there, I meant Northern as in the pre Go North East rather than the railway company. Yeah agreed with the Blyth and Ashington expresses though, mind the Blyth and Tyne Railway reopening could change that.

The rail reopening will definitely have an impact - we've seen that with other rail reopenings such as the Ebbw Vale, Bathgate and Borders schemes.

The Blyth to Newcastle expresses will be impacted but that's limited as Bebside station is peripheral though the X7 will lose some business from Seaton Delaval. The big loser will be the Ashington to Newcastle corridor with Ashington getting a centrally located station, whilst Bedlington station will doubtless suck up some traffic from the X21 too.

 

[Snex]

The rail reopening will definitely have an impact - we've seen that with other rail reopenings such as the Ebbw Vale, Bathgate and Borders schemes.

The Blyth to Newcastle expresses will be impacted but that's limited as Bebside station is peripheral though the X7 will lose some business from Seaton Delaval. The big loser will be the Ashington to Newcastle corridor with Ashington getting a centrally located station, whilst Bedlington station will doubtless suck up some traffic from the X21 too.

Yeah totally agreed, be interesting to see if they react to it or just sit back and then moan when people move across or actually try to rebuild the network with the trains in mind. Mind Blyth could be impacted more as Newsham could hit the X8, X10 and X11 aswell to the South of the town.

Arriva as it is now I wouldn't surprised for the former though, they've already tried to block it.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Yeah totally agreed, be interesting to see if they react to it or just sit back and then moan when people move across or actually try to rebuild the network with the trains in mind. Mind Blyth could be impacted more as Newsham could hit the X8, X10 and X11 aswell to the South of the town.

Arriva as it is now I wouldn't surprised for the former though, they've already tried to block it.

Can't blame any business for wishing to protect its patch but I think they will be some pretty big changes, some on the Blyths but mainly on the Ashingtons. Sadly, I've long given up on Arriva NE - I can't even recall who the MD is now.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Had me confused for a second there, I meant Northern as in the pre Go North East rather than the railway company.

Ha, see what you mean. And I’d agree about North Tyneside being increasingly thin bus territory, Go North East (nee Coastline) have given up on much of Wallsend now. And both Go and Arriva are (sort of) co-ordinating on the Coast Road too. Although Stagecoach Busways are steadily muscling in, some commercial and some tenders, so it can’t be that thin.

be interesting to see if they react to it or just sit back and then moan when people move across or actually try to rebuild the network with the trains in mind

I think we all know the answer to that one. They’ll do some misguided competition with the train, lose a load of money, and then pull out of Ashington entirely citing economic pressures.

To the city centre the bus is still likely to be competitive with the train on times, but no doubt Arriva will do something stupid.

 

[Geordie driver]

Can't blame any business for wishing to protect its patch but I think they will be some pretty big changes, some on the Blyths but mainly on the Ashingtons. Sadly, I've long given up on Arriva NE - I can't even recall who the MD is now.

Regarding the new Northumberland Line and how it may affect Arriva.

I used to live in Blyth and relied on their buses for the last few months before my retirement from the NHS, I also have driven many thousands of express and service buses to and from Blyth. I can't speak for Ashghanistan ( Ashington) as I haven't been there for decades.

Both Morpeth and Cramlington have train stations but few use them, they are only a bit out of the way but I don't know anyone who regularly uses them. It's not free for the pensioners either.They go directly into Newcastle, so no change to the Metro like the Northumberland Line, yet still It's more convenient to get the bus.

The stations at Bebside and Newsham are even more out of the way relative to Blyth. The densest population part of Blyth is near the town centre, car ownership is very low ( one of the reasons I liked living there, easy to get parked) .

So a trip into Newcastle ( which will be the majority of trips) will involve a bus ride, then a train ride, then a metro ride. When this was first being mooted many people in Blyth would tell you the Metro was coming, I got tired of explaining a yellow diesel train isn't the Metro. In the end, I gave up and joined in.

Or Arriva could expand its X30, I used this all the time, 40 minutes from Blyth to the Haymarket. If the new line takes off they could focus on Cramlington, turn the expresses there.

It might make some of the marginal expresses unprofitable. I know these are big earners for Arriva, but they still haven't recovered from COVID.

The car park at Newsham looks huge. I can see it might be an attractive option for commuters.

I can't find any information on pensioners fares, it will be interesting in the first few weeks to see how many people turn up at 09 15 expecting a free ride.


Will it be free?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Regarding the new Northumberland Line and how it may affect Arriva.

I used to live in Blyth and relied on their buses for the last few months before my retirement from the NHS, I also have driven many thousands of express and service buses to and from Blyth. I can't speak for Ashghanistan ( Ashington) as I haven't been there for decades.

Both Morpeth and Cramlington have train stations but few use them, they are only a bit out of the way but I don't know anyone who regularly uses them. It's not free for the pensioners either.They go directly into Newcastle, so no change to the Metro like the Northumberland Line, yet still It's more convenient to get the bus.

The stations at Bebside and Newsham are even more out of the way relative to Blyth. The densest population part of Blyth is near the town centre, car ownership is very low ( one of the reasons I liked living there, easy to get parked) .

So a trip into Newcastle ( which will be the majority of trips) will involve a bus ride, then a train ride, then a metro ride. When this was first being mooted many people in Blyth would tell you the Metro was coming, I got tired of explaining a yellow diesel train isn't the Metro. In the end, I gave up and joined in.

Or Arriva could expand its X30, I used this all the time, 40 minutes from Blyth to the Haymarket. If the new line takes off they could focus on Cramlington, turn the expresses there.

It might make some of the marginal expresses unprofitable. I know these are big earners for Arriva, but they still haven't recovered from COVID.

The car park at Newsham looks huge. I can see it might be an attractive option for commuters.

I can't find any information on pensioners fares, it will be interesting in the first few weeks to see how many people turn up at 09 15 expecting a free ride.


Will it be free?

This was what I was alluding to. Where a station is in the heart of the main population centre, bus services will suffer from abstraction. Granted, the twirlies will still be a market but I can see in Ashington, with the X21 as it runs near Bedlington Station, they'll be more directly impacted.

I see less impact on the Blyth routes for the reasons you outline. Yes, there will be some impact from Bebside and Newsham but for the majority of the town, a direct bus will still be the better option.

 

[Snex]

Ha, see what you mean. And I’d agree about North Tyneside being increasingly thin bus territory, Go North East (nee Coastline) have given up on much of Wallsend now. And both Go and Arriva are (sort of) co-ordinating on the Coast Road too. Although Stagecoach Busways are steadily muscling in, some commercial and some tenders, so it can’t be that thin.


I think we all know the answer to that one. They’ll do some misguided competition with the train, lose a load of money, and then pull out of Ashington entirely citing economic pressures.

To the city centre the bus is still likely to be competitive with the train on times, but no doubt Arriva will do something stupid.

Yeah think it's the Metro which is the issue and high car usage added to the mix. Can't see anyone being able to do much with North Tyneside hence the majority of it is subsidised. I believe the Stagecoach 22 Cobalt extension was subsidised from Cobalt aswell. Not sure if they're still paying for it now though.

Regarding the new Northumberland Line and how it may affect Arriva.

I used to live in Blyth and relied on their buses for the last few months before my retirement from the NHS, I also have driven many thousands of express and service buses to and from Blyth. I can't speak for Ashghanistan ( Ashington) as I haven't been there for decades.

Both Morpeth and Cramlington have train stations but few use them, they are only a bit out of the way but I don't know anyone who regularly uses them. It's not free for the pensioners either.They go directly into Newcastle, so no change to the Metro like the Northumberland Line, yet still It's more convenient to get the bus.

The stations at Bebside and Newsham are even more out of the way relative to Blyth. The densest population part of Blyth is near the town centre, car ownership is very low ( one of the reasons I liked living there, easy to get parked) .

So a trip into Newcastle ( which will be the majority of trips) will involve a bus ride, then a train ride, then a metro ride. When this was first being mooted many people in Blyth would tell you the Metro was coming, I got tired of explaining a yellow diesel train isn't the Metro. In the end, I gave up and joined in.

Or Arriva could expand its X30, I used this all the time, 40 minutes from Blyth to the Haymarket. If the new line takes off they could focus on Cramlington, turn the expresses there.

It might make some of the marginal expresses unprofitable. I know these are big earners for Arriva, but they still haven't recovered from COVID.

The car park at Newsham looks huge. I can see it might be an attractive option for commuters.

I can't find any information on pensioners fares, it will be interesting in the first few weeks to see how many people turn up at 09 15 expecting a free ride.


Will it be free?

I haven't seen it mentioned much in recent times but I know in earlier stages there was discussion of integrating the ticketing within the Metro zones. It's been quiet in recent times though. Mind that said I wouldn't say Morpeth is quiet, 400k people isn't bad for where it is and if you got numbers anywhere near half of that at the Blyth stations it would cause a massive headache for Arriva.

Cramlington is too infrequent to be usable imo. 10 buses an hour vs 1 train an hour, the bus will always win.

Personally I do think they will focus on the Cramlington and with the X7, I wouldn't be surprised to see them focus on Seaton Delaval / Seghill where the train is a bit awkward. The X8 will be in trouble though imo, it duplicates the X7/52 for most of it anyway bar the small section around High Pit and South Beach to Cramlington similar with the X21 unless they pull it out of Nedderton as it's a detour as it is. Well if they had any sense they would anyway. There's always the 43 which could be extended to fill in the gaps around South Beach etc.

 

[Geordie driver]

I had no idea Morpeth train station was that busy, just anecdotal on my behalf.

The 43 was the old 405 , indeed it ran to Blyth in the evening and on a Sunday for a long time after it became the 43.

I had assumed through ticketing would be the norm, it's going to be a very expensive ride if you have to buy separate bus, train and Metro tickets for one journey.

 

[northern506]

I can't quote a source as it was word of mouth from a driver, so please treat this information as such. However, they said that Arriva are withdrawing services 51, 52, 53, 54 and 55 in Newcastle effective from September.

Quite a shocking decline by Arriva Northumbria in recent months if true.

 

[MB1]

I can't quote a source as it was word of mouth from a driver, so please treat this information as such. However, they said that Arriva are withdrawing services 51, 52, 53, 54 and 55 in Newcastle effective from September.

Quite a shocking decline by Arriva Northumbria in recent months if true.

I've heard the same. The 51/54/55 aren't really a surprise, the tendering of evening and Sunday trips on the 51/54 showed how much money those were making. The move to Ashington/Blyth was always going to have challenges, I'm led to believe the initial plans to expand either of those depots became increasingly unviable, and if it's a huge expense for routes that aren't making money? There was only one outcome.

 

[David 90825]

I can't quote a source as it was word of mouth from a driver, so please treat this information as such. However, they said that Arriva are withdrawing services 51, 52, 53, 54 and 55 in Newcastle effective from September.

Quite a shocking decline by Arriva Northumbria in recent months if true.

Arriva Northumbria's management met with the Trade Union on Friday 5th May to discuss the situation. The use of Walkergate depot will cease by early September with services relocating to Blyth. It was announced that Arriva does not intend to operate services 51-55 beyond early September. It was also announced that land for expansion at Ashington has not been obtained whilst land for expansion at Blyth has been secured. The attachment has been sent to staff, hopefully it can be read.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Arriva Northumbria's management met with the Trade Union on Friday 5th May to discuss the situation. The use of Walkergate depot will cease by early September with services relocating to Blyth. It was announced that Arriva does not intend to operate services 51-55 beyond early September. It was also announced that land for expansion at Ashington has not been obtained whilst land for expansion at Blyth has been secured. The attachment has been sent to staff, hopefully it can be read.

First of all, thank you for sharing. What a sorry show this is and what a decline for what was a decent business. That they can't get additional space at Ashington almost defies belief, but in any case, this was all eminently predictable. In fact, I did call it when they apologised for their appalling service and escalating issues...

As a priority action, work is underway to review our current timetables and service frequencies within parts of Tyne & Wear, with a view of potentially introducing small yet efficient changes in early 2023 which we believe will help to support positive service delivery in hot spots across the North East. These plans are currently being shared and discussed with local authority leads where appropriate, whom we are working in partnership with, to further show our commitment to righting the current challenges being experienced across our bus network.

I said in November that....

You try to be balanced. However, what could have escalated things in the last few weeks? Having announced the closure of Jesmond in favour of a replacement, then saying that they won't then be replacing it and are having a partial stop-gap at Stagecoach's depot, isn't going to have a positive impact on driver numbers!

I would imagine that those small yet efficient changes will see a certain cross Pennine service relinquished and a few others too?

I don't know if either firm you mention would be interested in having a pop on those routes but you could certainly see stuff like the 47 and 555 and 685 being thrown in by Arriva as being too difficult to operate, low margin etc esp. once they exit Walkergate

The 685 was nailed on to go and so it transpired, and think the 555 has gone already? The 55 was one that I thought was vulnerable and it was always going to be the case. Trying to operate lower margin routes away from base with limited capability to interwork...

One wonders whether Stagecoach and Go North East will be looking at those and hoovering them up... If I were an Arriva Newcastle driver, I don't know whether I'd bother with staying. By now, loyalty will be measured in pounds as they've burnt through any goodwill some time ago

 

[317 forever]

Arriva Northumbria's management met with the Trade Union on Friday 5th May to discuss the situation. The use of Walkergate depot will cease by early September with services relocating to Blyth. It was announced that Arriva does not intend to operate services 51-55 beyond early September. It was also announced that land for expansion at Ashington has not been obtained whilst land for expansion at Blyth has been secured. The attachment has been sent to staff, hopefully it can be read.

It does seem that within Newcastle Arriva will only be the interurban operator to Northumberland plus route X12 to Middlesbrough via Durham. Everything else will be Stagecoach, Go North East or tendered services to independents.

 

[Snex]

It does seem that within Newcastle Arriva will only be the interurban operator to Northumberland plus route X12 to Middlesbrough via Durham. Everything else will be Stagecoach, Go North East or tendered services to independents.

Other than the 1, 41/41A, Q3 and Coast Road services. There's no GoNorthEast North of the Tyne anymore, they've already fledged the area but quietly and two of them are subsidised in the evening already - one ran by another company. It's Stagecoach only pretty much nowadays and might aswell be a franchised network East of the A19.

Arriva still have the Great North Road services though (43/44/45), Coast Road services (306/308) and 57/57A in the Newcastle area and possibly the 553? Haven't seen that one mentioned in any of this.

The commerical bus network in North Tyneside, in particular, is in a dire state though.

 

[317 forever]

Other than the 1, 41/41A, Q3 and Coast Road services. There's no GoNorthEast North of the Tyne anymore, they've already fledged the area but quietly and two of them are subsidised in the evening already - one ran by another company. It's Stagecoach only pretty much nowadays and might aswell be a franchised network East of the A19.

Arriva still have the Great North Road services though (43/44/45), Coast Road services (306/308) and 57/57A in the Newcastle area and possibly the 553? Haven't seen that one mentioned in any of this.

The commerical bus network in North Tyneside, in particular, is in a dire state though.

Oh yes, I wouldn't have thought of the 57 or 553. Admittedly route 57 starts from Ashington. Routes 306 & 553 are an anomaly.

Those remaining routes could operate from Blyth, although I've heard rumours that drivers don't want to move there. Maybe distance rather than location itself.

 

[Snex]

Oh yes, I wouldn't have thought of the 57 or 553. Admittedly route 57 starts from Ashington. Routes 306 & 553 are an anomaly.

Those remaining routes could operate from Blyth, although I've heard rumours that drivers don't want to move there. Maybe distance rather than location itself.

That is the plan as far as I'm aware. The 306/308 interwork now and most the boards are already there. Believe off the top of my head there's about 5 boards on the 43, 44, 45, 306 and 308 to still move across which aren't currently ran by Blyth but they also run some 51/52/53/54 boards so they shouldn't need many more drivers depending on how many are still agency staff.

It'll be interesting to see if they actually need all the staff long term as I believe all the ones remaining at Walkergate were heading to Ashington.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Other than the 1, 41/41A, Q3 and Coast Road services. There's no GoNorthEast North of the Tyne anymore, they've already fledged the area but quietly and two of them are subsidised in the evening already - one ran by another company. It's Stagecoach only pretty much nowadays and might aswell be a franchised network East of the A19.

Arriva still have the Great North Road services though (43/44/45), Coast Road services (306/308) and 57/57A in the Newcastle area and possibly the 553? Haven't seen that one mentioned in any of this.

The commerical bus network in North Tyneside, in particular, is in a dire state though.

That is the plan as far as I'm aware. The 306/308 interwork now and most the boards are already there. Believe off the top of my head there's about 5 boards on the 43, 44, 45, 306 and 308 to still move across which aren't currently ran by Blyth but they also run some 51/52/53/54 boards so they shouldn't need many more drivers depending on how many are still agency staff.

It'll be interesting to see if they actually need all the staff long term as I believe all the ones remaining at Walkergate were heading to Ashington.

You do forget how much Go North East have reduced their operations at Percy Main.

The 306/308 do interwork. I can only assume that some drivers from Walkergate were anticipated to move to Ashington and that they (if not the vehicles) would interwork between the X21/X22 and routes like the 55.

The memo suggests that they will be looking to discuss with the workforce, and it may be that people will have understandable concerns as to whether a job actually exists for them. I'd imagine both Go North East and Stagecoach will be looking at those routes - the 53 would fit in with Go NE whereas the 51/52 may well appeal to Stagecoach. That said, those routes have been damaged by Covid and Arriva so what sort of service they'd sustain, we'll have to wait and see.

 

[Tetchytyke]

I'd imagine both Go North East and Stagecoach will be looking at those routes - the 53 would fit in with Go NE whereas the 51/52 may well appeal to Stagecoach.

The 51 and 54 look nailed-on Stagecoach, given Stagecoach have expanded well into North Tyneside with the 317 tender as well as the 22 and 10/11 through the Tunnel.

The 52 and 53 could go either way, I’m surprised Arriva won’t just run them from Blyth, it’s not like there’s a lot of dead running involved to/from Cramlington and they’d fit in with the 57/57A too.

Go have pretty much abandoned North Tyneside too, but have done it a lot more under the radar. I don’t see that they’d be that fussed about the 52 and 53, they’re certainly not about much else, including the 19.

Wouldn’t surprise me if they all go to tender and end up with Gateshead Taxis, like most of Go’s network did.

I’m not surprised they’ve decided not to expand Ashington, let’s face it Ashington will suffer more from any rail expansion far more than Blyth would.

 

[Snex]

The memo suggests that they will be looking to discuss with the workforce, and it may be that people will have understandable concerns as to whether a job actually exists for them. I'd imagine both Go North East and Stagecoach will be looking at those routes - the 53 would fit in with Go NE whereas the 51/52 may well appeal to Stagecoach. That said, those routes have been damaged by Covid and Arriva so what sort of service they'd sustain, we'll have to wait and see.

Yeah that was exactly I was thinking, I'm not sure Arriva will need all the drivers. I'm sure they'd be grabbed quickly though by one of the other operators though.

The 51 and 54 look nailed-on Stagecoach, given Stagecoach have expanded well into North Tyneside with the 317 tender as well as the 22 and 10/11 through the Tunnel.

The 52 and 53 could go either way, I’m surprised Arriva won’t just run them from Blyth, it’s not like there’s a lot of dead running involved to/from Cramlington and they’d fit in with the 57/57A too.

Go have pretty much abandoned North Tyneside too, but have done it a lot more under the radar. I don’t see that they’d be that fussed about the 52 and 53, they’re certainly not about much else, including the 19.

Wouldn’t surprise me if they all go to tender and end up with Gateshead Taxis, like most of Go’s network did.

I’m not surprised they’ve decided not to expand Ashington, let’s face it Ashington will suffer more from any rail expansion far more than Blyth would.

Oddly, personally I think Stagecoach will be most interested in the 52 and 54 so they have a monopoly on the Killingworth to Newcastle / Four Lane Ends and Freeman to Newcastle routes. The 52 arguably even commercially, it could easily be done as an extension of the 38 which is basically a large chunk of the route anyway and if they go for a tender with that they'd be guaranteed to win it as it's 1 bus less, similar to the 62 extension, PVR 3 I believe it would be, as it's roughly 45 minutes from Cramlington to the Freeman.

 

[Bristol LHS]

In retrospect, when Arriva and GNE did their ‘sorting out’ in 2010, it might have made more sense for Arriva to have retained Hexham and instead withdrawn from Jesmond at that point. Might have enabled GNE to make something sustainable out of Percy Main, and kept Arriva on the Tyne Valley and 685.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Might have enabled GNE to make something sustainable out of Percy Main, and kept Arriva on the Tyne Valley and 685.

The “sorting out” didn’t involve Percy Main at all. Go had bought Northumbria Coaches in Ashington, and were operating the competing services from there.

The “sorting out” was, from the operators’ perspective, the most sensible way of carving up. For Go it got Arriva out of western Gateshead, and for Arriva it got go out of Ashington.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The “sorting out” didn’t involve Percy Main at all. Go had bought Northumbria Coaches in Ashington, and were operating the competing services from there.

The “sorting out” was, from the operators’ perspective, the most sensible way of carving up. For Go it got Arriva out of western Gateshead, and for Arriva it got go out of Ashington.

In fairness, I think that's what they were saying. Had the "sorting out" been done another way, Arriva could've retained (and improved) its Tyne Valley routes and ceded the North Tyneside services to Go North East which would've helped Percy Main. However, I don't think that was likely when you consider what decent sized depots both Jesmond and Percy Main were even 10 years ago. The decline has been notable and has only been exacerbated by Covid.

However, given how Stagecoach has looked to expand its operations with the 317 and 10/11 (as mentioned above), you'd think that they would be most interested in wading in there. After the exit in Guildford and Crewe, Stagecoach may again be well placed to profit from Arriva's decline.

 

[Snex]

In retrospect, when Arriva and GNE did their ‘sorting out’ in 2010, it might have made more sense for Arriva to have retained Hexham and instead withdrawn from Jesmond at that point. Might have enabled GNE to make something sustainable out of Percy Main, and kept Arriva on the Tyne Valley and 685.

Probably better for Arriva to gain Percy Main and Go North East Ashington. I know some will say that's a bad deal for Arriva but I'm not sure whether the Berwick and Ashington Expresses would be better than gaining full control of the Coast Road which has been a dog fight ever since, until the partnership that's recently come in and is a very strong corridor.

Other than the Blyth to Morpeth / Ashington buses there was very little overlap between Ashington and Blyth depots.