I'm not sure adding another class of travel is adding complexity into the system.Hmmm. I thought everyone was trying to simplify the fares structure, whilst this adds yet more complexity.
Well, yes and no. Everybody wants to simplify the fares structure for normal punters. Business people want a first class product with a misleading description including the word standard, in order to get around petty travel cost limitations.Hmmm. I thought everyone was trying to simplify the fares structure, whilst this adds yet more complexity.
Well, yes and no. Everybody wants to simplify the fares structure for normal punters. Business people want a first class product with a misleading description including the word standard, in order to get around petty travel cost limitations.
I don't go First Class very often, but I'm not bothered by lounge access. In the morning I don't arrive early enough to make it worthwhile, in the evening I'd rather wait in the pub!I'm only me, but I usually travel First Class and I never use the First Class lounges. If I have time to kill at Euston I go to the Doric Arch and pay for a pint of ESB and find myself a comfy chair.
Maybe I should add that, although I've not been to the Euston lounge for ten years or more now, I was originally put off because it was busy and scruffy and noisy. I just didn't see the point then, nor do I today. But some people like them, that's fine, but I'm not interested.
On the train I would prefer better food that I pay for rather than the free food, although the morning breakfast service is OK I would prefer something better in the evenings and wouldn't mind paying extra for it.
They might fall foul of the wrath of their food and drink tenants who pay vast rents for outlets at stations...I wonder if Network Rail could make money out of offering their own paid-for lounge facility?
Not sure if this has been noted already but the web page about Standard Premium has been taken down.
https://www.avantiwestcoast.co.uk/onboard/standard-premium now results in an HTTP 404 error.
The name "Standard Premium" did surprise me a bit. They could have called it "First Lite" or something. To the passenger that always travels standard, I imagine 'Standard Premium' sounds like 'Standard, but slightly upgraded and more expensive'. By pitching it as a downgraded version of First instead, they give the impression of 'Get the posh First Class experience for cheap', which I think is more likely to attract impulse upgrades and leisure travellers who want to treat themselves to a bit of luxury without feeling guilt about their spending - which seems to be the market they're trying to tap into.
I'm part of the East Coast crowd and really wouldn't miss it. It amazes me that through all the franchise changes over the years (from GNER onwards) the coffee tastes exactly the same (and not very good). I imagine there are great big vats of it brewing away for years somewhere that it all gets decanted from.Careful, you'll get lynched by the East Coast crowd. We love our at-seat service and hot breakfasts/dinners!
Yup. LNER offered a Scottish Executive ticket (not sure if they still do) that was a "complimentary first class upgrade" - everything on it said Standard, even the reservation coupon, for that very reason. Worked a treat for me expenses-wise.The reason for calling it that is exactly the same reason Eurostar called theirs "Standard Premier" - so people can sneak it past "no First Class" expenses policies.
Yup. LNER offered a Scottish Executive ticket (not sure if they still do) that was a "complimentary first class upgrade" - everything on it said Standard, even the reservation coupon, for that very reason. Worked a treat for me expenses-wise.
It's not fraud. The tickets were cheaper than Standard Anytime ones, and no-one would have batted an eyelid if I'd claimed for one of those.Depends I guess on your management. If someone tried that on with me I'd be more angry with them than if they just put a First Class ticket in out of policy and came up with a decent justification. Defrauding your employer isn't a great way to keep your job.
Not sure how well it'll work now anyway, as a good many employers these days require the cheapest ticket to be purchased, either via a corporate travel system that enforces that or sometimes screenshotting to show that you did choose the cheapest. Long gone are the days of being entitled to anything up to the Anytime Return.
Of course one of the joys of not being a manager in a company that's had all the joy squeezed out of it by pointless bean-counters, is that I can offer my staff a comfortable travel experience, get some work out of them on the ride, and not have them permanently worried that they've transgressed a petty rule by not spending half an hour of their expensive time saving 5 minutes worth of time off the fate.Depends I guess on your management. If someone tried that on with me I'd be more angry with them than if they just put a First Class ticket in out of policy and came up with a decent justification. Defrauding your employer isn't a great way to keep your job.
Not sure how well it'll work now anyway, as a good many employers these days require the cheapest ticket to be purchased, either via a corporate travel system that enforces that or sometimes screenshotting to show that you did choose the cheapest. Long gone are the days of being entitled to anything up to the Anytime Return.
BA have dropped the partnership with M & S but it is hit and miss to get any complementary refreshments on BA short haul. Least with KLM you get a drink, crisps and packet of biscuits or pretzels.Pretty much exactly how I see it. Indeed, it's how I believe all First Class should be. If you want food, buy it - as easyJet and Ryanair have demonstrated (and now BA on short-haul) you can have a much better range if you only have to cater for a smaller number of people wanting it. I'd concede to free tea, coffee and water, though, as most people will enjoy one of those.
BA have dropped the partnership with M & S but it is hit and miss to get any complementary refreshments on BA short haul. Least with KLM you get a drink, crisps and packet of biscuits or pretzels.
That's up to you but the fact that BA has had to revise their catering post Covid19 says it all.I'd rather pay for more if I want it than have a rubbish offering (tiny cup of coffee, pathetic packet of pretzels) free.
That's up to you but the fact that BA has had to revise their catering post Covid19 says it all.
Anyway, I hope LNER follow suit with the Advanti WC proposal because it's a damn good idea.What it says is that the approach doesn't work in the context of COVID-19, not that it won't work later.
I fear you may be correct, although I am now a dedicated tea drinker. Always bugged me that you get a decent Yorkshire Tea in standard but Fairtrade in First. On the general point though, if GNER hadn't maintained the First Class dining options we probably wouldn't have them now (and they have been cut back greatly over the years). I've mentioned elsewhere that I had three options for a Leeds-Edinburgh trip last January; I chose to change at York to travel First with LNER than in First with either XC or TPE.I'm part of the East Coast crowd and really wouldn't miss it. It amazes me that through all the franchise changes over the years (from GNER onwards) the coffee tastes exactly the same (and not very good). I imagine there are great big vats of it brewing away for years somewhere that it all gets decanted from.
See, now I don't. It doesn't need an extra class introducing, it need a Weekday First option (which East Coast/LNER do/did, by invitation). What we have now is Seatfrog; first time I used that I won the auction and found myself booked into a table of four, all of which were Seatfrog seats from Leeds (but I was the only winner...).Anyway, I hope LNER follow suit with the Advanti WC proposal because it's a damn good idea.
Depends I guess on your management. If someone tried that on with me I'd be more angry with them than if they just put a First Class ticket in out of policy and came up with a decent justification. Defrauding your employer isn't a great way to keep your job.
Not sure how well it'll work now anyway, as a good many employers these days require the cheapest ticket to be purchased, either via a corporate travel system that enforces that or sometimes screenshotting to show that you did choose the cheapest. Long gone are the days of being entitled to anything up to the Anytime Return.
MPs are allowed to travel first class if it's cheaper than Standard (not quite sure what, if any, restrictions on ticket types apply). Civil Servants are not. Do as we say, not as we do....It’d go down a treat with MPs though
According to https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ter-news/mp-first-class-train-travel-13616835, "MPs are still allowed to travel first-class if the cost of the ticket is cheaper than the standard-class ‘walk-on’ fare.", so presumably any kind of First Class advance ticket. However their expenses do tend to get reported at the individual level, so some of them might feel it inappropriate to travel First Class given that their constituents will get to know about it.MPs are allowed to travel first class if it's cheaper than Standard (not quite sure what, if any, restrictions on ticket types apply). Civil Servants are not. Do as we say, not as we do....
According to https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ter-news/mp-first-class-train-travel-13616835, "MPs are still allowed to travel first-class if the cost of the ticket is cheaper than the standard-class ‘walk-on’ fare.", so presumably any kind of First Class advance ticket. However their expenses do tend to get reported at the individual level, so some of them might feel it inappropriate to travel First Class given that their constituents will get to know about it.
EDIT - better source of information is https://www.theipsa.org.uk/media/185688/scheme-2020-21.pdf
"9.13 For journeys by public transport, MPs may buy a ticket of any class but (except where paragraph 9.14 applies) reimbursement will be limited to the rate of an economy class ticket available at the time of booking. In the case of air travel, ‘economy’ includes ‘flexible economy’.
9.14 For journeys made by rail, reimbursement will be limited to the rate of an ‘anytime standard open’ ticket for the journey prevalent at the time of the claim."
"Information on standard open fares is included in the online expenses system, which will automatically check the cost of the relevant rail journey."
When I was a Civil Servant, and I resigned in April 2015, we were told not to buy any sort of First Class ticket, but conversely the cost of the ticket wasn't a factor. So, as I said earlier, I usually bought an Open Standard Return and upgraded to First Class on the train at my own expense.
When I was a Civil Servant, and I resigned in April 2015, we were told not to buy any sort of First Class ticket, but conversely the cost of the ticket wasn't a factor. So, as I said earlier, I usually bought an Open Standard Return and upgraded to First Class on the train at my own expense.
Plus you can claim back your marginal rate of tax on the extra amount paid (if it's not reimbursed by your employer, that is, but by calling it "Standard" it may be), which was 40% for me when I worked for IBM until 2008, following which as a Civil Servant it was only 20% because I took a pay cut for a better job!This of course is one key purpose of this idea - allow that to happen weekdays as well as weekends (I've done exactly that for weekend work journeys before) and make it affordable for people paying for it themselves.
I am still a Civil Servant. They are increasingly pushing hard on the use of Advanced tickets (at least one way if the time of end of business is uncertain).According to https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ter-news/mp-first-class-train-travel-13616835, "MPs are still allowed to travel first-class if the cost of the ticket is cheaper than the standard-class ‘walk-on’ fare.", so presumably any kind of First Class advance ticket. However their expenses do tend to get reported at the individual level, so some of them might feel it inappropriate to travel First Class given that their constituents will get to know about it.
EDIT - better source of information is https://www.theipsa.org.uk/media/185688/scheme-2020-21.pdf
"9.13 For journeys by public transport, MPs may buy a ticket of any class but (except where paragraph 9.14 applies) reimbursement will be limited to the rate of an economy class ticket available at the time of booking. In the case of air travel, ‘economy’ includes ‘flexible economy’.
9.14 For journeys made by rail, reimbursement will be limited to the rate of an ‘anytime standard open’ ticket for the journey prevalent at the time of the claim."
"Information on standard open fares is included in the online expenses system, which will automatically check the cost of the relevant rail journey."
When I was a Civil Servant, and I resigned in April 2015, we were told not to buy any sort of First Class ticket, but conversely the cost of the ticket wasn't a factor. So, as I said earlier, I usually bought an Open Standard Return and upgraded to First Class on the train at my own expense.