Back in the day...

[Sultan1056]

I always used to think of 401-585 as the "originals" though I did have half a dozen of the 556-585 batch as their old numbers in my spotting days, so I'm not sure how logical that is!

Ah! I understand now. For me I would not have included those that received a 47/0 number, only 401-547/550/552/554.

 

[xotGD]

Up to 585 were in my first "Combined Volume", so I too regard them as the "proper" 47/4s.

 

[Sultan1056]

Up to 585 were in my first "Combined Volume", so I too regard them as the "proper" 47/4s.

I must be showing my age, my first combined volume showed them with their original numbers!

 

[Peter Sarf]

I must be showing my age, my first combined volume showed them with their original numbers!

My first non-combined books had all locos renumbered away from their D-prefix numbers except for a number of soon to be 45/0s and 45/1s.
I cannot recall how far up the 47/4s went - probably 47555 ?.

 

[Falcon1200]

I cannot recall how far up the 47/4s went - probably 47555 ?.

My 1978 Locoshed Book does indeed go up to 47555, so those to me are the original 47/4s; Although @Sultan1056 makes a valid point. IMHO any ETH 47s numbered higher are latecomers!

 

[Magdalia]

What’s a proper 47/4?

For me it is the position of the ETH plug. Above the buffer is proper, so 47421-585 are proper.

 

[D1537]

For me it is the position of the ETH plug. Above the buffer is proper, so 47421-585 are proper.

So it's either 401-555, 421-585, 401-547/550/552/554*, or 401-585. Clear as mud

Sunday 7 February 1988
(definitely four proper ones here - 47705 was previously 47554)
47463 1S19 Crewe-Glasgow Central (via the G&SW)
47705 1O72 Glasgow QS-Edinburgh
47524 1O07 Edinburgh-York (via Meadowbank Stadium)
47457 1V94 York-Birmingham NS (via Doncaster)
310075 Birmingham NS-Coventry

* incidentally, I'm not sure that 47549 ever carried 47133 as a number (information conflicts, and I've never seen an image), so that might have to be included as well.

 

[D6130]

I'm pretty certain that at the time of the TOPS renumbering in 1973-74, the original ETH locos were 47 401-529.

 

[Peter Sarf]

I'm pretty certain that at the time of the TOPS renumbering in 1973-74, the original ETH locos were 47 401-529.

That would mean only 11 individual numbers missing in earlier sub classes as iirc there were 508 class 47s to re-number ?.

 

[D1537]

I'm pretty certain that at the time of the TOPS renumbering in 1973-74, the original ETH locos were 47 401-529.

Correct. 47530-555 were originally allocated numbers in the 47/0 series, but most never carried them because they were converted to ETH before their renumbering into TOPS.

The only ones that did - for a short period - were
47549 (47133, though some debate on this one)
47551 (47153)
47553 (47260)
47555 (47126)

And of course 47125 was never converted to 47548, leaving a gap in the series.

 

[Falcon1200]

Tuesday 08th February 1983
A trip for some 33 haulage; HSTs and units not recorded at this time.

50019​	2A39​	0955​	Oxford​	Paddington​	Oxford​	Didcot​
33007​	1M75​	1510​	Cardiff C​	Crewe​	Cardiff C​	Newport​
33032​	1O87​	1615​	Cardiff C​	Portsmouth​	Cardiff C​	Newport​
33058​	1M73​	1710​	Cardiff C​	Crewe​	Cardiff C​	Newport​
33015​	2O61​	1715​	Cardiff C​	Weymouth​	Newport​	Bristol TM​
50019​	1A68​	1827​	Paddington​	Oxford​	Didcot​	Oxford​

 

[Magdalia]

That would mean only 11 individual numbers missing in earlier sub classes as iirc there were 508 class 47s to re-number ?.

298+81+129=508

 

[D1537]

Saturday 8 February 1986
The previous night, generator 47420 had headed to Portsmouth. As the February offer meant a trip there was £5, and I had a 21st birthday party to attend in Coventry that night, this seemed like a good plan.
47625 1O27 Coventry-Portsmouth Harbour
47420 1E31 Portsmouth Harbour-Birmingham NS
47606 1O23 Birmingham NS-Coventry

Sunday 8 February 1987
The joys of diversionary routes, with some new Brush track for me this week as unaccountably I still needed the route via Barnsley for a 47, I'd done it with other power.
47447 1M69 Newcastle-Leeds (via the High Level Bridge, Leamside, Castleford and Woodlesford)
47462 1A25 Leeds-Wakefield Westgate
47465 1M58 Wakefield Kirkgate-Sheffield (via Barnsley and Wombwell - new track Horbury Jc.-Wincobank Stn. Jc.)
47653 1E61 Sheffield-York (via Doncaster)
47540 1E18 York-Durham (failed - train terminated)
43100+43198 1N07 Durham-Newcastle

 

[Peter Sarf]

298+81+129=508

Thanks for that. Makes it look so simple. Those 81 would be the no heat 47/3s ?. They were particularly hard to spot or get for traction, especially for a 14 year old lad tucked away in the far South Eastern corner of Britain !.

 

[Ant1966]

Thanks for that. Makes it look so simple. Those 81 would be the no heat 47/3s ?. They were particularly hard to spot or get for traction, especially for a 14 year old lad tucked away in the far South Eastern corner of Britain !.

Same. My last two 47s for sight were 47303 and 47304! Think they were IM or TE locos? Funny how I still remember that 40 years later!

 

[D1537]

Same. My last two 47s for sight were 47303 and 47304! Think they were IM or TE locos? Funny how I still remember that 40 years later!

303 and 304 were Knottingley MGR locos from the mid-70s until transferred away in 1981 when replaced by 56s. I was brought up in Yorkshire and the KY batch were easy to see by standing on (for example) Kirkgate station and simply waiting... However they didn't stray much so it's not surprising they were your last two!

My last three 47s for sight were both (probably equally unsurprisingly) Stratford ones. I got the last of the three - 47160 - when it turned up at Leeds hauling my train to York to go spotting one morning!

 

[Peter Sarf]

303 and 304 were Knottingley MGR locos from the mid-70s until transferred away in 1981 when replaced by 56s. I was brought up in Yorkshire and the KY batch were easy to see by standing on (for example) Kirkgate station and simply waiting... However they didn't stray much so it's not surprising they were your last two!

My last three 47s for sight were both (probably equally unsurprisingly) Stratford ones. I got the last of the three - 47160 - when it turned up at Leeds hauling my train to York to go spotting one morning!

Despite needing lots of 47/3s - big gaps in my Locoshed book - it was a 472xx I needed last (47228 iirc). I had eventually identified Knottingley as my target depot and visited it often (with the help of Termini Enthusuasts / RESL), I then had to go back for the 56s - one of my last was there inside.

 

[Deepgreen]

A 40 featured in my 1983 Freedom of Scotland - I'll post that up next when I get the chance...

I didn't record numbers in the 80s but my photos do give clues - here was 40168 coming off the Stirling to Euston motorail (on which my father's Rover P4 was travelling) at Carstairs, with an 85 waiting to take over. May 1984.

 

[NorthWestRover]

Same. My last two 47s for sight were 47303 and 47304! Think they were IM or TE locos? Funny how I still remember that 40 years later!

304 was my last 47 for sight too.

 

[Deepgreen]

I’d survive on dog s#*t sandwiches to spend a week doing that lot!

Or 'Shipham's Paste' as it was labelled...

 

[Sun Chariot]

I didn't record numbers in the 80s but my photos do give clues - here was 40168 coming off the Stirling to Euston motorail (on which my father's Rover P4 was travelling) at Carstairs, with an 85 waiting to take over. May 1984.

View attachment 174193

Wonderful evocative shot. I am too young by a couple of years to have seen the Whistlers in revenue service. Early in spring 1984, I saw a couple outside Carlisle - annoyingly, my Leeds-bound service was in the hands of a 31/4 instead.
The other 40s I saw, were on death row - at Swindon Works (1985) and Crewe Works (1986).

And much kudos for your father running a Rover P4 in 1984. I remember seeing P6s and occasional P5 on the road back in the early 1980s; but I never saw a P4. My first car was a 1986 SD1.

 

[D6130]

My last two Duffs for sight - both KY MGR locos - were 277 and 279....both seen ex-works at Crewe on different dates in 1979. I had never realised that it was possible for MGR locos to be so clean! Having achieved that milestone, I decided to call it a draw and then ceased spotting for good.

 

[Deepgreen]

Wonderful evocative shot. I am too young by a couple of years to have seen the Whistlers in revenue service. Early in spring 1984, I saw a couple outside Carlisle - annoyingly, my Leeds-bound service was in the hands of a 31/4 instead.
The other 40s I saw, were on death row - at Swindon Works (1985) and Crewe Works (1986).

And much kudos for your father running a Rover P4 in 1984. I remember seeing P6s and occasional P5 on the road back in the early 1980s; but I never saw a P4. My first car was a 1986 SD1.

He had three P4s in his life and drove nothing else! Here it sits at the very rear of the car transporter wagons at Carstairs, just visible. I recall that the loaders at Stirling couldn't drive it and my father had to drive it on himself, hence it being at the very back! Here it is as my wedding car in 1994, with another, owned by a friend of mine.

 

[D1537]

View attachment 174217

Some excellent kit on there, including a bay window camper and a Mk1 Scirocco! Liking the Motorail-branded window covers, I wonder if anyone's still got one of those?

 

[Falcon1200]

Funny how I still remember that 40 years later!

I think we tend to remember the most important moments in our lives.... My last 47 for sight was Haymarket's 47274. And although I was not a haulage enthusiast at the time, I vividly recall having Knottingley's 47310 from Mexborough to Doncaster, after a Saturday evening visit to Wath in August 1977.

 

[Kirkoswald]

I didn't record numbers in the 80s but my photos do give clues - here was 40168 coming off the Stirling to Euston motorail (on which my father's Rover P4 was travelling) at Carstairs, with an 85 waiting to take over. May 1984.

View attachment 174193

I think this will have been 01/06/84 when 168 worked 1M69 11.30 ex Stirling.

With a Rover P4 on the train this is probably the most excellent combination of motive power I've ever heard of.

 

[D1537]

Sunday 9 February 1986
Having not done an overnight due to the aforementioned birthday party, that meant I missed a new 47 (47011) piloting 1V62 over Cannock. However, post-hangover there was a consolation prize of a big Thornaby one on the drags. If I remember correctly there was a very motley collection of power out this day, including a pair of 20s and a 45. I presume the controller that notoriously refused to diagram Type 5s was on that day.
47486 (86236) 1G24 Nuneaton-Birmingham NS
47363 (86206) 1A20 Birmingham NS-Nuneaton

Tuesday 9 February 1988
At the time BR(E) were doing cheap day returns to Glasgow and Edinburgh, so a common afternoon move to make a change from the Pennines was to HST it up to Edinburgh, get some 47/7s in, and return on 1E10, still making last orders in the pub.
43165+43074 1S12 Newcastle-Edinburgh
47707 1O39 Edinburgh-Glasgow QS
47707 1O44 Glasgow QS-Edinburgh
47712 1O47 Edinburgh-Glasgow QS
47712 1O52 Glasgow QS-Edinburgh
47431 1E10 Edinburgh-Newcastle

 

[D1537]

Monday 10 February 1986
47513 1M88 Coventry-Manchester Picc
47475 1M73 Manchester Vic-Liverpool
47412 1E88 Liverpool-Newcastle

 

[QJ]

Sunday 10 February 1980 (end of my second trip to France - the way it used to be)
(SNCF)
BB16005 #405 Flèche d'Or 1230 Paris Nord - Calais Maritime (Paris Nord to Amiens)
BB67592 #405 Flèche d'Or 1230 Paris Nord - Calais Maritime (Amiens to Calais Maritime)
(Only had one SNCF BB67400 diesel for haulage at the time. Guess which one?)
(Sealink Ferry)
mv Vortigern (IMO 6910960 / TOPS 99007) 1550 Calais Maritime to Folkestone Harbour
(BR)
1*CEP+1*BEP*1+*CEP+1*DMLV EMU lashup 1720 Folkestone Harbour - London Victoria (Folkestone Harbour to London Victoria)

Friday 10 February 1984
1*205 DMU EH 2V27 0823 Basingstoke - Reading (Basingstoke to Reading)
for a cheeky leap after work
1*117 DMU RG 1712 Reading - London Paddington (Reading to Maidenhead)
47378 BS 1A60 1733 London Paddington - Twyford (Maidenhead to Twyford) (edit 11/02 this train was formed of the HST trailer generator set)
1*121+1*117(3) DMU 1723 London Paddington - Reading (Twyford to Reading)
33061 HG 1Z63 1618 Cardiff Central - London Paddington (Reading to London Paddington)
47531 BS 1M17 1945 London Paddington - Wolverhampton (London Paddington to Reading)
1*205 DMU EH 2O17 2053 Reading - Portsmouth Harbour (Reading to Basingstoke)

 

[D6130]

Sunday 10 February 1980 (end of my second trip to France - the way it used to be)
(SNCF)
BB16005 #405 Flèche d'Or 1230 Paris Nord - Calais Maritime (Paris Nord to Amiens)
BB67592 #405 Flèche d'Or 1230 Paris Nord - Calais Maritime (Amiens to Calais Maritime)
(Only had one SNCF BB67400 diesel for haulage at the time. Guess which one?)
(Sealink Ferry)
mv Vortigern (IMO 6910960 / TOPS 99007) 1550 Calais Maritime to Folkestone Harbour
(BR)
1*CEP+1*BEP*1+*CEP+1*DMLV EMU lashup 1720 Folkestone Harbour - London Victoria (Folkestone Harbour to London Victoria)

Friday 10 February 1984
1*205 DMU EH 2V27 0823 Basingstoke - Reading (Basingstoke to Reading)
for a cheeky leap after work
1*117 DMU RG 1712 Reading - London Paddington (Reading to Maidenhead)
47378 BS 1A60 1733 London Paddington - Twyford (Maidenhead to Twyford)
1*121+1*117(3) DMU 1723 London Paddington - Reading (Twyford to Reading)
33061 HG 1Z63 1618 Cardiff Central - London Paddington (Reading to London Paddington)
47531 BS 1M17 1945 London Paddington - Wolverhampton (London Paddington to Reading)
1*205 DMU EH 2O17 2053 Reading - Portsmouth Harbour (Reading to Basingstoke)

What was 1Z63 on which you had 33 061 in 1984?