Blackpool trams

[AngelicUpstart]

The above isn't actually a true representation of what has happened. Storm Arwen caused damage to the gable end of a building on the corner of Springfield Road and the Prom. This is what caused both the Prom and tramway to shut. On Sunday, contractors noticed that the roof of the Metropole was also damaged. On Monday the road was allowed to reopen as the building on the corner of Springfield Road had been made secure, but the Tramway remained closed so they could fix the Metropole roof. On Saturday a couple of trams were allowed through empty to provide a skeleton service Pleasant Street-Fishermans Walk (another damaged building in Fleetwood blocking access to the Ferry!) but was stopped when they discovered the damage to the Metropole. The tramway reopened this morning, Tuesday.

We're now left with single track working, northbound only, between North Pier and Cabin, during daylight hours (mostly), for work on the "long term" out off use points at North Pier and a few other bits of track maintenance on that track.

And this just in, subject to confirmation, and building work at the platform being advanced enough, a test tram will go to the new terminus next week, possibly Wednesday, possibly Thursday.

 

[davehsug]

The above isn't actually a true representation of what has happened. Storm Arwen caused damage to the gable end of a building on the corner of Springfield Road and the Prom. This is what caused both the Prom and tramway to shut. On Sunday, contractors noticed that the roof of the Metropole was also damaged. On Monday the road was allowed to reopen as the building on the corner of Springfield Road had been made secure, but the Tramway remained closed so they could fix the Metropole roof. On Saturday a couple of trams were allowed through empty to provide a skeleton service Pleasant Street-Fishermans Walk (another damaged building in Fleetwood blocking access to the Ferry!) but was stopped when they discovered the damage to the Metropole. The tramway reopened this morning, Tuesday.

We're now left with single track working, northbound only, between North Pier and Cabin, during daylight hours (mostly), for work on the "long term" out off use points at North Pier and a few other bits of track maintenance on that track.

And this just in, subject to confirmation, and building work at the platform being advanced enough, a test tram will go to the new terminus next week, possibly Wednesday, possibly Thursday.

Any news on whether a trip took place? I've been checking the Gazzette website, but mot seem anything.

 

[trainmananthon]

Any news on whether a trip took place? I've been checking the Gazzette website, but mot seem anything.

As far as I'm aware, no the trip didn't happen and I certainly didn't see anyone on our roster to do it either.

We're still on a temporary single line timetable mid-weeks for the time being as they're still doing welding work on the points by North Pier

 

[AY1975]

Was in Blackpool this weekend and pretty much every tram I saw in the centre area (ie Tower/Central Pier) was showing as "Sorry tram full". They wouldn't stop at the stops if nobody requested it but if someone requested it, most passengers were ignore the "tram full" message and will try and board as who knew when the next tram would be (and if that one would have space)

Are the tram stops in Blackpool officially compulsory or request stops (IIRC they are request stops)?

(See also this thread on compulsory versus request stops on UK light rail systems: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/compulsory-vs-request-stops-on-uk-light-rail-systems.225767/)

The latest I heard was that when Blackpool North finally opens, services will still be Starr Gate - Fleetwood Ferry throughout the day, with every other tram going to North Station. How true this is I don't know, but that's what we got told in training school.

I presume you mean they will be alternately Starr Gate-North Station-Fleetwood Ferry and Starr Gate-Fleetwood Ferry direct (just as Metrolink has Bury-Piccadilly-Altrincham and Bury-Altrincham direct trams, and has some Eccles via MediaCityUK trams (mainly on Sundays IIRC)).

 

[Kite159]

I meant by they wouldn't stop if nobody requested it, if there was passengers waiting at the stop wanting to board.

No request to stop on the tram and it would go straight past the waiting passengers because it was "Full"

 

[davehsug]

Read on the Gazzette website tonight, that operations to North Station will now not commence until construction on the hotel above is completed. Likely to be next November.

 

[Steddenm]

There are some planned test trams on the North Station branch this month plus the tram timetable has been reduced to 15 minutes daytime and 30 minutes in the evening until Easter.

 

[Steddenm]

The first test tram turned off the main route into Talbot Road this evening towards North Station. Not sure how far it got though. There is a video on the I Love Blackpool page on Facebook.

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Nice to see the two trams together on the Talbot Road extention.

Photo credit: Blackpool Transport/Blackpool Council with creative commons agreement.

 

[AngelicUpstart]

The first test tram turned off the main route into Talbot Road this evening towards North Station. Not sure how far it got though.

All the way to the new Talbot Gateway station, but I understand the southern platform only. The fact the Tory Spring Conference starts in town tomorrow might just suggest that a test run before a ministerial photo op possibly!

The shell of the hotel is now pretty well complete although it is devoid of final cladding and windows. The old underpass has been filled in and work on it's replacement is due to start any day.

 

[trainmananthon]

There are more test runs due to run tonight too, roughly around the same time - approx 2200ish

These are the only two runs that I'm aware of for now, but they'll likely be more in future, definitely before it opens as all the trainers, drivers and operations staff will need a run up there before it can be officially opened

 

[Tramfan]

I've not heard anything recently about the planned service pattern, I wonder if this has been determined yet?

 

[trainmananthon]

I've not heard anything recently about the planned service pattern, I wonder if this has been determined yet?

I asked in the Starr Gate office about this the other day and none of the operations staff or my managers know for certain, but so far I think there are two options...
1) every other tram will go to North Station so for example in the height of summer, if services are every 7 minutes from Starr Gate to Fleetwood then North Station will get a tram every 15 minutes
2) North Station will be served on the Starr Gate/Pleasure Beach - Little Bispham runs, with all Fleetwood trams running straight through

It's all gonna be a fine balancing act as not only can you not have two trams pass on Talbot Road, but us drivers and guards can only work a certain number of hours before we are required to have a break and so if every tram went to North Station then we wouldn't get back to Starr Gate in time as current driving/guarding times are already fairly tight as it is

 

[Tramfan]

I asked in the Starr Gate office about this the other day and none of the operations staff or my managers know for certain, but so far I think there are two options...
1) every other tram will go to North Station so for example in the height of summer, if services are every 7 minutes from Starr Gate to Fleetwood then North Station will get a tram every 15 minutes
2) North Station will be served on the Starr Gate/Pleasure Beach - Little Bispham runs, with all Fleetwood trams running straight through

It's all gonna be a fine balancing act as not only can you not have two trams pass on Talbot Road, but us drivers and guards can only work a certain number of hours before we are required to have a break and so if every tram went to North Station then we wouldn't get back to Starr Gate in time as current driving/guarding times are already fairly tight as it is

Thanks, I guess with reliefs being at Starr Gate at the end of the line, and with traditional services being all full length Starr Gate to Fleetwood journeys, there's very limited scope for what can actually be done with the duties. One of my concerns was also whether there'd be enough trams for a dedicated extra service to/from North Station as per some early suggestions, particularly as 004 and 018 seem to have been missing for quite some time. Will certainly be interesting to see how it's done!

 

[trainmananthon]

Thanks, I guess with reliefs being at Starr Gate at the end of the line, and with traditional services being all full length Starr Gate to Fleetwood journeys, there's very limited scope for what can actually be done with the duties. One of my concerns was also whether there'd be enough trams for a dedicated extra service to/from North Station as per some early suggestions, particularly as 004 and 018 seem to have been missing for quite some time. Will certainly be interesting to see how it's done!

I think we should just about manage without 004 & 018 for now. Even during the most intense timetables, only 13 trams are out at once so we've got a couple spare.

Looks like repairs might have finally started on 018 after a van clattered into the cab side of it early last year but I've not been near it for the last two weeks so I don't know for certain. 004, the depot Xmas tree, won't be around for a while yet.

 

[LOL The Irony]

004, the depot Xmas tree, won't be around for a while yet.

Is that the one that was allegedly found with corrosion?

 

[trainmananthon]

Is that the one that was allegedly found with corrosion?

Wouldn't know, sorry. All I know from my mk1 eyeball is that it's in bits in the back of Road 3

Spoke to one of the engineers by tram 018 today... Repairs have been done and just needs the cab reassembling then its good to go, so should be a couple of months away.
Tram 004 you won't see for another couple of years and for now is just a spares donor

 

[Cliveblackpool]

I asked in the Starr Gate office about this the other day and none of the operations staff or my managers know for certain, but so far I think there are two options...
1) every other tram will go to North Station so for example in the height of summer, if services are every 7 minutes from Starr Gate to Fleetwood then North Station will get a tram every 15 minutes
2) North Station will be served on the Starr Gate/Pleasure Beach - Little Bispham runs, with all Fleetwood trams running straight through

It's all gonna be a fine balancing act as not only can you not have two trams pass on Talbot Road, but us drivers and guards can only work a certain number of hours before we are required to have a break and so if every tram went to North Station then we wouldn't get back to Starr Gate in time as current driving/guarding times are already fairly tight as it is

Running a 15 minute service in each direction will result in a tram crossing the busy promenade and turn in/out of Talbot road every 3.75 minutes! With the lights sequence etc impacting traffic on prom, and a short delay to the tram crossing. Not passing another tram on Talbot Road could be a problem. Thought they would have had one track on Talbot road and the other on say Springfield road (loop).
Today there is a 15 minute service from Star Gate to Fleetwood and VV. 7 trams are on the route.
Could be a problem if a rammed tram goes up to BPN and not able to pick up all the rail passengers?

 

[freddiem]

I'm probably being thick here, but what is the reason 2 trams can't pass on Talbot Road? is it to do with power supply?

 

[mmh]

Post #128 has a picture of two trams passing on (the bottom end of) Talbot Road.

 

[Cliveblackpool]

Excellent video of trams testing track on Talbot Road 16th March.
Liams Transport Videos 2022

 

[Vespa]

Interesting video noticed lots of sparks as the power is trying to earth through the rusty track, thought that drunk guy at 5:36 was going to fall under the tram for second.

 

[davehsug]

Running a 15 minute service in each direction will result in a tram crossing the busy promenade and turn in/out of Talbot road every 3.75 minutes! With the lights sequence etc impacting traffic on prom, and a short delay to the tram crossing. Not passing another tram on Talbot Road could be a problem. Thought they would have had one track on Talbot road and the other on say Springfield road (loop).
Today there is a 15 minute service from Star Gate to Fleetwood and VV. 7 trams are on the route.
Could be a problem if a rammed tram goes up to BPN and not able to pick up all the rail passengers?

I still don't understand how or why through services would be needed or desirable? It would make far more sense to operate seperate services North Station - Pleasure Beach/Starr gate & North Station Cleveleys/Fleetwood. People, especialy daytrippers, might get quite angry at wasting 20-30 minutes on a useless diversion up & down Talbot Road! Who would knowigly board such a service? Surely there would be much less call for the service North anyway? A 15 minute service South might be well loaded, but 30 minutes more appropriate for Northbound.

 

[LOL The Irony]

Running a 15 minute service in each direction will result in a tram crossing the busy promenade and turn in/out of Talbot road every 3.75 minutes! With the lights sequence etc impacting traffic on prom, and a short delay to the tram crossing. Not passing another tram on Talbot Road could be a problem. Thought they would have had one track on Talbot road and the other on say Springfield road (loop).
Today there is a 15 minute service from Star Gate to Fleetwood and VV. 7 trams are on the route.
Could be a problem if a rammed tram goes up to BPN and not able to pick up all the rail passengers?

If this winds up being an issue, one way of sorting it could be to close Talbot Road to anything not a tram, taxi or bus between Ma Kelly's and the prom

 

[Trackman]

thought that drunk guy at 5:36 was going to fall under the tram for second.

The guy at 5:04 walks out in front of the tram without even looking.

 

[philthetube]

I still don't understand how or why through services would be needed or desirable? It would make far more sense to operate seperate services North Station - Pleasure Beach/Starr gate & North Station Cleveleys/Fleetwood. People, especialy daytrippers, might get quite angry at wasting 20-30 minutes on a useless diversion up & down Talbot Road! Who would knowigly board such a service? Surely there would be much less call for the service North anyway? A 15 minute service South might be well loaded, but 30 minutes more appropriate for Northbound.

Trams will need to get to Starr gate in order to facilitate crew reliefs, they might as well go in from the north and go out to the south because of this, whether it would be better for them to show Blackpool north as a destination instead of Fleetwood/Starr Gate is another question.

Most of the Hotels are to the north so people arriving for a holiday are likely to want to go that way.

 

[trainmananthon]

I'm probably being thick here, but what is the reason 2 trams can't pass on Talbot Road? is it to do with power supply?

It's something to do with the spacing, or lack of, between the tracks to facilitate the parking outside Premier Inn. Trams would be foul of each other by about 6inch

The guy at 5:04 walks out in front of the tram without even looking.

As a tram driver, welcome to my world...

I still don't understand how or why through services would be needed or desirable? It would make far more sense to operate seperate services North Station - Pleasure Beach/Starr gate & North Station Cleveleys/Fleetwood. People, especialy daytrippers, might get quite angry at wasting 20-30 minutes on a useless diversion up & down Talbot Road! Who would knowigly board such a service? Surely there would be much less call for the service North anyway? A 15 minute service South might be well loaded, but 30 minutes more appropriate for Northbound.

Personally if it was me, I'd operate the North Station and mainline services separate from each other, that way they're less likely to interfere with each others operations if something goes down. Keep the Fleetwoods running direct and have a few trams operating Pleasure Beach - North Station and Little Bispham - North Station

 

[LOL The Irony]

Personally if it was me, I'd operate the North Station and mainline services separate from each other, that way they're less likely to interfere with each others operations if something goes down. Keep the Fleetwoods running direct and have a few trams operating Pleasure Beach - North Station and Little Bispham - North Station

That works in theory, but in practice, during high season, the trams just get filled up by all the Norbreck lot and have to skip stops. If you were going to Cleveleys or Fleetwood, you could be in for a 30 minute plus wait.

 

[trainmananthon]

That works in theory, but in practice, during high season, the trams just get filled up by all the Norbreck lot and have to skip stops. If you were going to Cleveleys or Fleetwood, you could be in for a 30 minute plus wait.

Part of the reason trams are planned to be every 7 minutes this summer. Every 15 minutes to Fleetwood (4 trams per hour) and every 15 minutes to Little Bispham (4 trams per hour)

 

[LOL The Irony]

Part of the reason trams are planned to be every 7 minutes this summer. Every 15 minutes to Fleetwood (4 trams per hour) and every 15 minutes to Little Bispham (4 trams per hour)

Fleetwood used to be every 10, every 15 will struggle to work.

 

[trainmananthon]

Fleetwood used to be every 10, every 15 will struggle to work.

Was that summer 2021? That was all they could manage with the staff or lack of. This year the 15 minutely Fleetwood is being supplemented by the 15 minutely Little Bisphams too, giving a tram every 7 minutes - not including any 'specials' running or the B fleet being out.