Chesham to Aylesbury without a ticket

[bengley]

Chesham, a London Underground station, does not have a ticket machine or office which can sell the full range of NR fares.

Today I travelled to Aylesbury without a ticket from Chesham because I could not buy a railcard discounted ticket there (which I am fully entitled to seeing as I paid for my railcard)

Upon arriving at Aylesbury I bought a return ticket from the ticket office. The man asked why I did not have a ticket and he accepted my reason and was fully understanding.

Obviously no problem there, however if I were to do the same thing again in the future and got a stubborn ticket inspector or member of gate staff at Aylesbury, where would I stand in regards to a penalty fare?

Thanks.

 

[yorkie]

In theory you should buy a ticket that allows you do to part of your journey, that you can exchange later. In reality though that can be a lot of hassle and doesn't prevent you being accused by over-zealous staff (see other topics on that issue!)

3. Where the full range of tickets is not available

If you cannot buy an appropriate ticket for the journey you want to make because the range of tickets that is available at the station from which you intend to start your journey is restricted, you must buy a ticket or Permit to Travel before you travel that entitles you to make at least part of the journey. Then you must, as soon as is reasonably practicable, buy an appropriate ticket to complete your journey. In these circumstances, you only need to pay the fare that you would have paid if you had bought a ticket immediately before your journey. The price you will have to pay will be reduced by the amount paid for the ticket or Permit to Travel.

That would apply from Aylesbury but LUs conditions would apply from Chesham I believe, however I am informed they're basically the same.

Were there any staff on duty at Chesham to ask/assist, or were they on their break?

 

[Daniel]

You should buy the appropriate single or return to your destination at the adult fare, (which is available from LUL machines), and have it exchanged at an open ticket office for a ticket with your appropriate discount.

This information is displayed on ticket office closure boards at LU stations.

If the ticket machine is fully functioning at Chesham you are liable to a penalty fare en-route, at least on LU. I'm not sure how NR would view it.

 

[yorkie]

You should buy the appropriate single or return to your destination at the adult fare, (which is available from LUL machines), and have it exchanged at an open ticket office for a ticket with your appropriate discount.

I'm informed that Aylesbury station will not process this transaction as they cannot issue a refund of an LU ticket.

Is there a station that can both issue the correct ticket and refund the incorrect ticket?

If not, is the customer in an impossible situation?

Would LU accept the ticket to be refunded on return to Chesham either later that day or at a later date?

 

[bengley]

I'm informed that Aylesbury station will not process this transaction as they cannot issue a refund of an LU ticket.

Is there a station that can both issue the correct ticket and refund the incorrect ticket?

If not, is the customer in an impossible situation?

Would LU accept the ticket to be refunded on return to Chesham either later that day or at a later date?

Chesham ticket office is never open at a convenient time and so this would be impossible for me without making a trip out of my way just to go to the staiton at silly hours.

 

[yorkie]

I'd write to LU and Chiltern, asking what they think you should do. I would be curious to hear what they suggest.

 

[causton]

Don't the LU TVMs issue railcard-discounted tickets? Or is it only for certain ones (I definitely know you can get a YNG discount!)

 

[bengley]

Don't the LU TVMs issue railcard-discounted tickets? Or is it only for certain ones (I definitely know you can get a YNG discount!)

Only on travelcards
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Quick update on this: I sent a message to Chiltern Railways on Facebook who say that all of their ticket inspectors have now been re-briefed on this situation.

 

[causton]

Only on travelcards

Not as of late! I have bought a 16-25 railcard discounted single to Hatfield from Moorgate and Kings Cross...


edit: attached is a picture of it. Confusing layout I know - the ticket is issued from Moorgate-Hatfield with a weird routing of Finsbury Park Anytime (it's an anytime single) bought at 21:03...

 

[bengley]

Not as of late! I have bought a 16-25 railcard discounted single to Hatfield from Moorgate and Kings Cross...


edit: attached is a picture of it. Confusing layout I know - the ticket is issued from Moorgate-Hatfield with a weird routing of Finsbury Park Anytime (it's an anytime single) bought at 21:03...

Was that bought from a TVM or ticket office?

 

[causton]

Was that bought from a TVM or ticket office?

A TVM. There are new options for National Rail (or Other Destinations) I think, and then you select 'National Railcard', choose the railcard, destination and ticket type IIRC!

 

[bengley]

That must be a very recent addition then, last time I tried was the day I posted this thread and when I selected Aylesbury in the 'Other single fares' menu, it went straight to please pay £xx

 

[Mojo]

The Poms (LU TVMs) only issue Railcard discounted tickets that aren't Travelcards from certain locations.

 

[causton]

Well as you can see the date of the ticket is not yesterday or today, so the option must be there somewhere! I remember having to select a different option (perhaps it was National Railcard tickets instead of Other fares) - but I have no idea! Perhaps someone who's in London can check it out, or perhaps it's only available at certain TVMs which have been updated, or something like that... I don't think I'll be in London for a while so can't really check
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The Poms (LU TVMs) only issue Railcard discounted tickets that aren't Travelcards from certain locations.

Aha, got there before I did! Hmm... why is this not enabled everywhere?

 

[richardderby]

national rail discounted tickets are only available from tube national rail interchanges where LUL sells tickets on behalf of the T.O.C and is the ONLY ticket issuing facility at that station. The machines were recently upgraded to offer this, as part of the ticket office opening hours reductions. If ticket not available at Chesham, the machine at Chorleywood (where you have to change..) should issue a discounted fare.

 

[bengley]

national rail discounted tickets are only available from tube national rail interchanges where LUL sells tickets on behalf of the T.O.C and is the ONLY ticket issuing facility at that station. The machines were recently upgraded to offer this, as part of the ticket office opening hours reductions. If ticket not available at Chesham, the machine at Chorleywood (where you have to change..) should issue a discounted fare.

From Chesham one would change at Chalfont & Latimer however you cannot access the ticket machines from the platforms and there are notices specifically saying that people needing to buy tickets need to exit from the northbound gate (which is unbarriered) walk down the road, under the bridge and back into the station from the southbound entrance. This whole process may cause me to miss a train and seeing as on a Sunday they're only once an hour it's not really fair on me or anyone else!

 

[NIMBUS]

the machine at Chorleywood (where you have to change..)

You mean Chalfont and Latimer - but your point stands.

 

[jon0844]

It's odd that the Moorgate > Hatfield ticket says Finsbury Park, as if you must use FCC from Moorgate as the Northern Line is an accepted route too. Mind you, I guess you still go via Finsbury Park from King's Cross too.

The ticket layout looks rather confusing generally. I'd hate to be you showing that to some FCC RPIs!!

 

[causton]

I'd hate to be you showing that to some FCC RPIs!!

Oh I did, they accepted it, walked away, looked confused at it, came back to it, nodded at it, and walked off!

I guess the explanation for why makes sense - although if TfL could make a little bit of extra money selling these tickets if they've got the capabilities of it now... why not

 

[Daniel]

From Chesham one would change at Chalfont & Latimer however you cannot access the ticket machines from the platforms and there are notices specifically saying that people needing to buy tickets need to exit from the northbound gate (which is unbarriered) walk down the road, under the bridge and back into the station from the southbound entrance. This whole process may cause me to miss a train and seeing as on a Sunday they're only once an hour it's not really fair on me or anyone else!

At London Underground stations the gateline must be staffed if the barriers are closed. A quick explanation to the CSA would mean you're let out to use the machines, it's not hard.

 

[island]

At London Underground stations the gateline must be staffed if the barriers are closed. A quick explanation to the CSA would mean you're let out to use the machines, it's not hard.

That's true at NR stations as well. Doesn't mean it's always abided by. (Not having a go at you Daniel, just pointing things out.)

 

[clagmonster]

Can the machines at Chalfont issue a ticket from Chesham though? If not, would it be possible to excess the ticket at the first encounter with a person with ticket selling capabilities?

 

[bengley]

Can the machines at Chalfont issue a ticket from Chesham though? If not, would it be possible to excess the ticket at the first encounter with a person with ticket selling capabilities?

Why should I have to do that though? A simple trip to Aylesbury turns into a confusing mess of having to sort out the ticket afterwards. Thanks but no thanks.