Class 158/159 recovery following Salisbury collision

[fgwrich]

just seen a video posted of it on twitter, it looks like the number has also been covered, i wonder why?

I did a brief twitter search earlier but couldn’t see that one.

It looks like the centre car of 102 isn’t too bad. A few nasty scrapes and some undercarriage damage but thankfully not as bad as the other vehicles.

https://twitter.com/parsnippo/status/1456731563429928965?s=21

 

[CR165022]

I did a brief twitter search earlier but couldn’t see that one.

https://twitter.com/StuPerkins76/status/1457071662810161155?s=20

here it is

 

[marks87]

https://twitter.com/StuPerkins76/status/1457071662810161155?s=20

here it is

Left-field suggestion, but with the number being black characters on a yellow background might it technically be illegal not to cover them if otherwise visible to the rear on the road?

 

[Crossover]

Left-field suggestion, but with the number being black characters on a yellow background might it technically be illegal not to cover them if otherwise visible to the rear on the road?

I would suggest the same. Just something that may otherwise confuse ANPR

 

[Cowley]

Left-field suggestion, but with the number being black characters on a yellow background might it technically be illegal not to cover them if otherwise visible to the rear on the road?

Imagine getting a ticket for an unroadworthy vehicle on the highway? That’d be one to frame…

 

[ANDREW_D_WEBB]

I would suggest the same. Just something that may otherwise confuse ANPR

Probably wise, this story shows that ANPR cameras are not fool proof and the letters are seemingly not checked by a human prior to sending. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-58959930

 

[158747]

57763, the leading vehicle of 158763 departing Salisbury this morning.

 

[dosxuk]

NR have uploaded a picture of the front carriage of the 159 after being dragged from the tunnel, and I have to say, it looks in surprisingly good condition, cab area excepted. There's not even a single smashed window in the passenger area on the side that went into the 158, and while there is some damage to the underfloor, it looks like some of that may have happened while dragging it through the ballast.

From that picture alone, I wouldn't be surprised to see it repaired and put back into use - sure the cab will need rebuilding, but that's been done in the past several times. I suppose the question is how much of a problem loosing a unit will cause?

https://twitter.com/NetworkRailWssx/status/1457316243850121221

 

[swt_passenger]

From the NR Tweets:

“To put the repairs into context, we’re expecting to replace 1,456 sleepers, three sets of points, the moveable rails which enable trains to change course, 1,010 yards of new track and 3km of cable for signalling and power supply.”

That’s getting on for the full length of the tunnel, which is something they were proposing might happen a few days ago.

 

[Killingworth]

Have any more units been removed yet, and how are track and signalling work progressing, imperially or metrically?

 

[swt_passenger]

Have any more units been removed yet, and how are track and signalling work progressing, imperially or metrically?

Post #98 (was 99) links to a NR tweet saying only one carriage was left and about to be lifted out about mid-day today 7th. They intend to spend the rest of the week renewing the infrastructure.

 

[yorkie]

Just a gentle reminder this thread is to discuss the recovery of the units from the scene.

Thanks.

 

[158747]

Have any more units been removed yet, and how are track and signalling work progressing, imperially or metrically?

The final two coaches were removed today. 57763 (158763) departed late this morning and 57803 (159102) departed late this afternoon.

 

[brad465]

Post #99 links to a NR tweet saying only one carriage was left and about to be lifted out about mid-day today 7th. They intend to spend the rest of the week renewing the infrastructure.

I think there's been a clear out of posts that means either the post you're referring to isn't there anymore, or it's a different number, thus there is no NR tweet link that's obvious?

 

[swt_passenger]

I think there's been a clear out of posts that means either the post you're referring to isn't there anymore, or it's a different number, thus there is no NR tweet link that's obvious?

It’s #98 now, I’ve amended my earlier post, thanks. The link is under the photo if you don’t see it immediately.

 

[brad465]

It’s #98 now, I’ve amended my earlier post, thanks. The link is under the photo if you don’t see it immediately.

Great, thank you

 

[swt_passenger]

Great, thank you

thanks for saying so…

 

[malc-c]

Just stumbled on this video...

Looks like the train is wedged in tight

I'll let you guys comment on the health and safety aspects of the procedure

 

[geoffk]

Will both operators end up a unit down, or will one or more carriages be returned to service? I guess that's a hard one to answer right now. Any news on the SWR driver?

 

[swt_passenger]

Just stumbled on this video...

Looks like the train is wedged in tight

I'll let you guys comment on the health and safety aspects of the procedure

Post #15 leads to the same video, it appeared on Friday.

 

[Scotrail84]

Just stumbled on this video...

Looks like the train is wedged in tight

I'll let you guys comment on the health and safety aspects of the procedure

If that cable had snapped those 3 lads could have ended up in a different postcodes. They should have been well clear.

 

[Pinus contorta]

If that cable had snapped those 3 lads could have ended up in a different postcodes. They should have been well clear.

That's what I thought when I saw the close up of where the guy at the back on his own positioned. But it isn't very clear off the footage how strong / thick the 'cable' is. That's the big question. Is it suitable for the task?

 

[malc-c]

Granted we don't know the braking strain of the cables and harnesses used, nor do we know how it was fixed to the carriage, presumably direct to the chassis, although it did look as the corridor connector moved when the 59 began pulling. But you can never predict what may happen and any risk assessment would have raised this (you would have thought) so maybe it wasn't as risky as we think ?

There are several other videos of this event that have surfaced and on the other side of the 59, at least a further half dozen people were standing watching the event, but they were not directly in the danger zone should the cable have let go... but then if the cable had struck the 59....

 

[reddragon]

Are there any pictures or videos of the recovery and latter coaches recovered?

 

[swt_passenger]

Are there any pictures or videos of the recovery and latter coaches recovered?

There’s really only been a few pictures - mostly via Twitter links - that have been linked in earlier posts as people noticed them. A number of pics of coaches have had full tarpaulins fitted, for obvious reasons.

 

[trebor79]

Granted we don't know the braking strain of the cables and harnesses used, nor do we know how it was fixed to the carriage, presumably direct to the chassis, although it did look as the corridor connector moved when the 59 began pulling. But you can never predict what may happen and any risk assessment would have raised this (you would have thought) so maybe it wasn't as risky as we think ?

There are several other videos of this event that have surfaced and on the other side of the 59, at least a further half dozen people were standing watching the event, but they were not directly in the danger zone should the cable have let go... but then if the cable had struck the 59....

Yeah I'd be nowhere near that.
Years ago I was driving a winch at a gliding site - cable breaks are a semi-regular event and they can whip all over the place. Visitor came to see what happened at the winch end of operations, she thought I was being fussy when I insisted she sit in the cab with me. Cable broke big-time. Bits of cable sprayed onto the winch cab windscreen and wrapped themselves round the chicken wire windscreen protector. Meanwhile the broken end that was still attached to the winch drum whipped right back behind us and would have neatly sliced her in two.
She didn't think I was being fussy after that!

You can do all the risk assessment you like - fact remains if the strop breaks all that energy is going to be dissipated by the strop whipping back. Nasty.

 

[coppercapped]

That's what I thought when I saw the close up of where the guy at the back on his own positioned. But it isn't very clear off the footage how strong / thick the 'cable' is. That's the big question. Is it suitable for the task?

Granted we don't know the braking strain of the cables and harnesses used, nor do we know how it was fixed to the carriage, presumably direct to the chassis, although it did look as the corridor connector moved when the 59 began pulling. But you can never predict what may happen and any risk assessment would have raised this (you would have thought) so maybe it wasn't as risky as we think ?

There are several other videos of this event that have surfaced and on the other side of the 59, at least a further half dozen people were standing watching the event, but they were not directly in the danger zone should the cable have let go... but then if the cable had struck the 59....

The maximum load which can be exerted on the cable is the maximum tractive effort which can be exerted by the Class 59 which is some 540kN. Any more and the wheels will slip.

As long as the cable and fittings are rated for this load then everything will be hunky-dory. I suspect that the recovery experts can do simple arithmetic...

 

[malc-c]

The maximum load which can be exerted on the cable is the maximum tractive effort which can be exerted by the Class 59 which is some 540kN. Any more and the wheels will slip.

As long as the cable and fittings are rated for this load then everything will be hunky-dory. I suspect that the recovery experts can do simple arithmetic...

True, but with all due respects, you can never factor in the randomness of karma... Under normal circumstances it could be assumed that the chassis is strong enough to withstand that force, but in an accident the integrity might have been compromised, and whilst the cable my stand up to the force, a damaged weld, or stressed rivets could let go. What I found interesting to see was whilst a thick covered cable / chain was used at the damaged train, there was a fair amount of stretch in whatever cable was used between the 59 and the damaged coach.

I respect that there were pressures to remove the debris as quick as possible, and there was probably no alternative but to use one or two locos to pull the debris out of the tunnel, but it would seem from the replies here that most of us feel the guys in the video should have been further back.

 

[mpthomson]

True, but with all due respects, you can never factor in the randomness of karma... Under normal circumstances it could be assumed that the chassis is strong enough to withstand that force, but in an accident the integrity might have been compromised, and whilst the cable my stand up to the force, a damaged weld, or stressed rivets could let go. What I found interesting to see was whilst a thick covered cable / chain was used at the damaged train, there was a fair amount of stretch in whatever cable was used between the 59 and the damaged coach.

I respect that there were pressures to remove the debris as quick as possible, and there was probably no alternative but to use one or two locos to pull the debris out of the tunnel, but it would seem from the replies here that most of us feel the guys in the video should have been further back.

HGV recovery drivers routinely stand close to cables when winching vehicles, including those that are difficult to move/stuck/bogged down etc. There'll be something in the rig that's designed to fail before the cable and with some progressiveness to avoid the whip type effect.

 

[trebor79]

The maximum load which can be exerted on the cable is the maximum tractive effort which can be exerted by the Class 59 which is some 540kN. Any more and the wheels will slip.

As long as the cable and fittings are rated for this load then everything will be hunky-dory. I suspect that the recovery experts can do simple arithmetic...

True, but with all due respects, you can never factor in the randomness of karma... Under normal circumstances it could be assumed that the chassis is strong enough to withstand that force, but in an accident the integrity might have been compromised, and whilst the cable my stand up to the force, a damaged weld, or stressed rivets could let go. What I found interesting to see was whilst a thick covered cable / chain was used at the damaged train, there was a fair amount of stretch in whatever cable was used between the 59 and the damaged coach.

Exactly this. And also that maximum 540kN assumes static load. We can see the 59 bouncing backwards and forwards and the coaches jerking about. There's dynamic loading going on which may significantly exceed the maximum output of the loco for an instant, but an instant is all it takes.