Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway

[43066]

Just been a trip on it. I have to say I'm rather impressed. Much better than I expected.

The interior looks great, a real feel of quality and much better than the 700/707. The seats are a definite upgrade from the standard ironing board as fitted on the 700/707/387 etc and really do feel a bit wider. There is a small spacer between the seat backs. Just to put into context, you can travel from Peterborough to Brighton in worse seats with worse legroom. And no charging points.

Legroom in the airline seats feels better than on a 450 or 707 (not difficult in the latter case). However legroom in the bay seats is as poor as on a 707, but the very substantial table partly makes up for this. Shame no seat back tables on the airline seats.

An Irritation is that the charging sockets are underneath the front of the seats rather than the rear of the seats in front.

The three vertical grab poles around the doorway don't look like they'll interfere with boarding and alighting as was suggested they might. There's plenty of space around them. Whether they just encourage standing there rather than in the middle of the coach remains to be seen.

Heating just right and ride quality typical Aventra, ie not as good as a 450 or 458, but acceptable for a suburban train.

PIS pretty much bog standard Aventra, and it of course coped with not calling at Sunnymedes.

Acceleration didn't feel quite as good as a 707, but better than anything else on SWR.

The guard was not involved in despatch except at Datchet towards Windsor when the driver requested degraded despatch.

Plenty of uniformed and non-uniformed staff on the train.

I don't like using the T word, but these really are going to be transformational when they start entering service in volume.

It makes it all the more the pity that they have been so delayed and, poignantly, are very possibly going to be the last trains designed and built at Derby.


Here's a photo I took this morning showing the spacer and how the bulkier cushions take up the space between the seats.

Thanks for this. Good to see a sensible and balanced appraisal of this stock, based on its fitness for purpose, rather than the standard shopping list of complaints that seems to come with *all* new trains on here!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Short account and a few pics from my trip today:

SWR 701 Train

Lovely pictures and what sounds like a very nice day too.

 

[davews]

Lovely pictures and what sounds like a very nice day too.

Thanks. I write my blogs for my non-railway friends, normally about my London walks, so I avoid railway jargon. I have had quite a few comments like 'the new trains look great'. But one of my mates said 'just looks like a train to me, what's special about it'!

It was interesting to see some young women with toddlers in buggies get on at Twickenham, testing the trains in real life situations. Wonder if the wheelchair ramps have seen use yet?

 

[Goldfish62]

Thanks for this. Good to see a sensible and balanced appraisal of this stock, based on its fitness for purpose, rather than the standard shopping list of complaints that seems to come with *all* new trains on here!

Thanks! Yes, that was exactly my intention.

 

[WWTownEnth]

Once all units are rolled out, will there be a need for any class 450s on the suburban, Windsor and Reading lines?

 

[Craig1122]

My verdict:

Seats themselves aren't awful but the trunking along the side really intrudes into the window seat foot space. Copying the use of spacers as in the 455/458 both between seats and between the seat and body side would have made it much more pleasant. It was fine in the middle of the day with not many people on board but I don't think they'll be very comfortable when full. And as standard for most trains the seats don't line up with the windows.

It's a relief that they're 2+2 as the wider gangways will be much easier to navigate than the 450's. Heat & vent/ride seem acceptable as you would expect.

I couldn't see any bins and despite having small tables for the facing seats there are none on the back of the airline seats. Plenty of space around the doors for rapid boarding but for some reason low level equipment cupboards block some of the floor.

I realise this is personal taste but I find the blue/grey interior pretty miserable, certainly compared to the SWT red interiors. As I think someone has already commented the floors seem very prone to marking. Combined with SWR's general lack of attention to cleaning that doesn't bode well.

PIS is out of date as it shows Tfl rail which hasn't existed for a couple of years. Pre recorded connectional information hasn't been given any thought and appears to be a standard list rather than being linked to the route the train is on. Possibly this will improve.

So in summary I'd say bang average at best. Air con will mean it's an improved experience compared to a 455, but then they're 40+ years old so it should be. Interior isn't as well thought out or as pleasant as a 458, it's a shame the designers didn't look at them as a template.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Once all units are rolled out, will there be a need for any class 450s on the suburban, Windsor and Reading lines?

No. 450s will be used exclusively on London Waterloo to Portsmouth via Basingstoke and Guildford, London Waterloo to Alton and Basingstoke, Ascot to Aldershot (excluding through services), Farnham to Guildford, Winchester to Bournemouth stopping service, Brockenhurst to Lymington and Southampton to Portsmouth. Now that I’ve written that out and bearing in mind there are 127, it makes sense that SWR don’t think they’ll need the 458/4s as well.

 

[Goldfish62]

[deleted]

The interior isn't as well thought out or as pleasant as a 458, it's a shame the designers didn't look at them as a template.

Just as well. I think the 458/5 interior is pretty poor and is obviously a compromise, being a "value" conversion from the 458/0. Just as an example the way the vertical grab poles are attached means they protrude so far into the gangway that it narrows it so much as to almost eliminate all the benefit of having 2+2 seating. Plus draft screens restrict the circulation area around the doors, window alignment is probably worse than any other train, there's no cycle space and the universal toilet takes up an unnecessary amount of room.

 

[Siemens Staines]

Once all units are rolled out, will there be a need for any class 450s on the suburban, Windsor and Reading lines?

I would have thought that the Windsor line services to Weybridge will retain a limited number of 450 diagrams? In the past these trains have been used to retain diversionary route knowledge via Chertsey for depots that do not sign metro traction classes. I am not sure that requirement is going to be any different once 701s replace 455s and 458s, but perhaps I am mistaken.

 

[swr444]

I would have thought that the Windsor line services to Weybridge will retain a limited number of 450 diagrams? In the past these trains have been used to retain diversionary route knowledge via Chertsey for depots that do not sign metro traction classes. I am not sure that requirement is going to be any different once 701s replace 455s and 458s, but perhaps I am mistaken.

I can't imagine the 2S will have desiros on it. I feel like they will train up Basingstoke guards/drivers on 701s so they can work these services, plus any if a 701 ends up on an alton/basing stopper cycle.

 

[TEW]

There shouldn't be a need to have 450s on any Suburban services in as much as there should be enough 701s to cover everything. But it may be desirable to have some either for Basingstoke crew to retain route knowledge via Chertsey without needing to sign 701s, or for some Suburban Depots to retain Desiro traction knowledge as otherwise they're likely to have very little or no Desiro work. The initially proposed timetables would certainly seem incompatible with the continued use of 450s on Suburban services, but who knows whether there will be any speeding up of services now.

 

[Warrior2852]

How much of the SWR electric network are the 701s actually cleared for and could technically run in passenger service in future diversionary/disruption/timetable reshuffling? Could they technically go down the Portsmouth Direct for instance, or run Basingstoke and Alton?

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

How much of the SWR electric network are the 701s actually cleared for and could technically run in passenger service in future diversionary/disruption/timetable reshuffling? Could they technically go down the Portsmouth Direct for instance, or run Basingstoke and Alton?

I think it's highly likely they will end up on Alton and Basingstoke services now and then. 701s will run to Farnham via Ascot, and it's likely some will end up stabled there too, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw them on the odd Alton service. These interwork with Basingstoke services.

 

[Lockwood]

How much of the SWR electric network are the 701s actually cleared for and could technically run in passenger service in future diversionary/disruption/timetable reshuffling? Could they technically go down the Portsmouth Direct for instance, or run Basingstoke and Alton?

I've seen one go through Liphook

 

[CarrotPie]

I think it's highly likely they will end up on Alton and Basingstoke services now and then. 701s will run to Farnham via Ascot, and it's likely some will end up stabled there too, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw them on the odd Alton service. These interwork with Basingstoke services.

I've seen one at Brockenhurst

 

[Bayum]

Any idea which Waterloo departures are 701 today?

 

[CarrotPie]

Any idea which Waterloo departures are 701 today?

No passenger services on RTT.

 

[Goldfish62]

Any idea which Waterloo departures are 701 today?

Not running at weekends currently.

How much of the SWR electric network are the 701s actually cleared for and could technically run in passenger service in future diversionary/disruption/timetable reshuffling? Could they technically go down the Portsmouth Direct for instance, or run Basingstoke and Alton?

Well, in testing, especially during the early days, they've run on every section of electrified line.

We also have to remember that as per the 720s, there are likely to be surplus units unless SWR decide to restore services to pre-Covid levels, which seems a very remote possibility.

 

[swt_passenger]

How much of the SWR electric network are the 701s actually cleared for and could technically run in passenger service in future diversionary/disruption/timetable reshuffling? Could they technically go down the Portsmouth Direct for instance, or run Basingstoke and Alton?

They’ve already been almost everywhere, as reported by posters in this thread, they’ve definitely appeared under test at Weymouth, Portsmouth Harbour, and I think Alton might be the only terminus they haven’t been explicitly mentioned as reaching in this thread. Have they been on the Netley line, or through Botley or Cosham?

I'd be surprised if they aren’t already physically cleared for the entire SWR network, but that’s not really evidence that they’d ever need to operate to those places.

 

[Bayum]

No passenger services on RTT.

Not running at weekends currently.


Well, in testing, especially during the early days, they've run on every section of electrified line.

We also have to remember that as per the 720s, there are likely to be surplus units unless SWR decide to restore services to pre-Covid levels, which seems a very remote possibility.

Thank you both. Still in London on Monday, so might see if I can find any out and about.

 

[Invincible]

Arterio | Our Trains | South Western Railway

www.southwesternrailway.com

I see the webpage has been updated with photos. But does not mention Windsor.
The map shows stations the 701 will use and does not include Alton.

 

[CarrotPie]

Arterio | Our Trains | South Western Railway

www.southwesternrailway.com

I see the webpage has been updated with photos.
The map shows stations the 701 will use and does not include Alton.

I can't see any (save for a front shot or two) that weren't there in 2022; certainly the interior shots are CGI. The fact that a lot of it is now out of fat (following entry into service) and the myriad grammatical errors leaves a lot to be desired...

 

[Sun Chariot]

I've seen one go through Liphook

Was that this morning? I don't see any info today on RTT.

Set 029 was hauled down Pompey Direct Line last May (a photo of it, on my thread "Loco hauled around Havant" on forum's photo/video section)

 

[Goldfish62]

I can't see any (save for a front shot or two) that weren't there in 2022; certainly the interior shots are CGI. The fact that a lot of it is now out of fat (following entry into service) and the myriad grammatical errors leaves a lot to be desired...

And the MD in the videos was replaced in 2021 and that one is soon to be replaced!

 

[D365]

Thank you both. Still in London on Monday, so might see if I can find any out and about.

Next week is the same Tues-Fri diagram as the week just gone.

 

[Peter Sarf]

Next week is the same Tues-Fri diagram as the week just gone.

Plus a bonus extra return.
So all together 2U91, 2U92, 2U93 & 2U94.
Tue-Fri next week.

 

[Matt Taylor]

Was that this morning? I don't see any info today on RTT.

Set 029 was hauled down Pompey Direct Line last May (a photo of it, on my thread "Loco hauled around Havant" on forum's photo/video section)

701005 had a test run to Southsea in August 2020 and 701019 spent Christmas 2022 in Southsea Down Carriage Sidings.

 

[Lockwood]

Was that this morning? I don't see any info today on RTT.

Set 029 was hauled down Pompey Direct Line last May (a photo of it, on my thread "Loco hauled around Havant" on forum's photo/video section)

Months ago. But to answer the question "can they go down the PDL?" yes, I've seen it.

Will they often? Probably not?

 

[mic505]

No. 450s will be used exclusively on London Waterloo to Portsmouth via Basingstoke and Guildford, London Waterloo to Alton and Basingstoke, Ascot to Aldershot (excluding through services), Farnham to Guildford, Winchester to Bournemouth stopping service, Brockenhurst to Lymington and Southampton to Portsmouth. Now that I’ve written that out and bearing in mind there are 127, it makes sense that SWR don’t think they’ll need the 458/4s as well.

I've heard rumours the 458/4's will be used on Waterloo-Alton/Basingstoke services, instead of the Portsmouth route, because of less or quicker driver training and testing the 100mph re-gearing.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Plus a bonus extra return.
So all together 2U91, 2U92, 2U93 & 2U94.
Tue-Fri next week.

In 1958 BR would swap over an entire depot from steam one day DMU the next oh and generally on improved timings as well