DLR B23 Stock (CAF Inneo)

[Mothball]

On a semi-related note, while answering a FOI for me, TfL mentioned withdrawn B92, 88, has been reactivated using parts from other withdrawn vehicles to be used for unloading and shunting of the new vehicles on delivery. TfL's quote attached.

To facilitate the unloading and movement of the new trains at the depot,
both Keolis Amey Docklands (KAD) and TfL’s project team have identified a
potential to convert the three B92 vehicles, currently unfit for Passenger
Services, into a single dedicated B92 shunting vehicle to assist with the
unloading and moving of the new fleet vehicles on delivery.

A single shunting vehicle was created from one of the three B92 vehicles
currently unsuitable for passenger service and stored at the Beckton
Depot. These 3 vehicles are: -

• Unit 039 (on a berthing road)

• Unit 098 (in the BN shed)

• Unit 088 (on the engineering sidings)

Unit 088 was converted into a dedicated shunting vehicle by utilising
parts from units 039 and 098. In addition to these parts, a Docklands
Light Railway Ltd (DLRL) free issue coupler adaptor was also supplied.

The estimated cost of undertaking this conversion was c. £21k against
other quotes that the project received for purchasing / hiring such a
vehicle being in excess of £100k.

 

[busestrains]

Is there any news on when the first CAF train will enter passenger service? As one of them has already been delivered i am presuming later this year?

 

[theking]

Says December 2023 in that presentation 2024 more likely I'd imagine.

 

[Thirteen]

Early 2024 was always the pencilled start date, if they get it for December this year then I'd be impressed.

 

[Snow1964]

Per latest TfL Commissioner report (page 21)

DLR rolling stock replacement programme
The manufacture of the new DLR rolling stock in Spain is continuing as planned, with seven trains completed and on their test track to run checks. We took delivery of the first train at our Beckton depot on 13 January, two months ahead of target. We anticipate having completed the manufacture of 12 trains by the end of this financial year

7 trains built, 12 by Financial year end is 31st March

Beckton depot and network infrastructure
At Beckton, critical works to complete the changeover of the signalling power supplies on the northern sidings works and to install new transformer rectifiers in the sub- station were successfully completed in line with the revised programme. This follows the cancellation of previous possession for other operational prioritisation resulting from the national mourning period following Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth
II’s death and our work to support this, Operation London Bridge.
The contract for the maintenance facility building and additional southern sidings have now been awarded. This is the
largest procurement of the programme after the rolling stock contract. The new maintenance building will have 400 solar panels installed on the roof, providing excess low-voltage power required for the new shed. This excess will be used to offset the existing maintenance facility. We are also using composite sleepers throughout the depot manufactured from recycled plastics as opposed to concrete sleepers, reducing embedded carbon across the site.
We have started signalling testing with
the existing fleet on the DLR network in preparation for the arrival of the new trains in January. In addition, we have awarded the contract for the design and build for
a second entrance at Blackwall station which is essential for unlocking the full fleet roll out.

https://board.tfl.gov.uk/documents/g728/Public%20reports%20pack%20Wednesday%2001-Feb-2023%2010.00%20Board.pdf?T=10

 

[Jammy Dodger]

Early 2024 was always the pencilled start date, if they get it for December this year then I'd be impressed.

Most likely end of Q1 2024 I'd say

 

[Geogregor]

Morgan Sindall wins £88m Beckton DLR depot upgrade

Delayed work to start on Docklands Light Railway train maintenance depot in East London

www.constructionenquirer.com

The rejigged project includes a new maintenance facility building including four sidings, superstructure and fit out of a new shed, and installation of a test track.

The scope also now includes deferred southern sidings works and the detailed design and build of the temporary fit out shed

Maintenance and stabling facilities are being extended to handle a new fleet of DLR trains.

 

[TRAX]

Unit 201 was officially unveiled today.
Pictures from Modern Railways via Twitter.

 

[py_megapixel]

Commuters are clearly used to the longitudinal seating layout, so I doubt that will be much of a concern. Not sure of the wisdom of only having an armrest every 3 seats though...

 

[bramling]

Commuters are clearly used to the longitudinal seating layout, so I doubt that will be much of a concern. Not sure of the wisdom of only having an armrest every 3 seats though...

I know it isn’t a massive thing in the grand scheme of things, but what they’ve done with the front seats looks a very retrograde step. This isn’t purely an enthusiast thing, as the front seats are *very* popular with locals and tourists.

 

[Techniquest]

Agreed on the front seats, incredibly popular with just about everyone.

I do like the look of this new train, I'll reserve full judgement for when I get on one of them, but I like what I see so far. If the front seats go, then I will be disappointed for sure but I will like the DLR for its rapid transit and things like the massive bridges etc around West India Quay amongst other things.

 

[bramling]

Agreed on the front seats, incredibly popular with just about everyone.

I do like the look of this new train, I'll reserve full judgement for when I get on one of them, but I like what I see so far. If the front seats go, then I will be disappointed for sure but I will like the DLR for its rapid transit and things like the massive bridges etc around West India Quay amongst other things.

The proof will be how well these new trains hold up. I have an element of reservation here given who is building them.

 

[Techniquest]

The proof will be how well these new trains hold up. I have an element of reservation here given who is building them.

Perhaps that is understandable, but I hope the new order prove to be good. There's only one way to find out, and in a matter of months we'll soon see.

Plenty of time to enjoy the existing trains at least, indeed I might even allocate a handful of hours to doing each and every line of the DLR on the existing trains before they go. That could be a fun little adventure!

 

[Mikey C]

Perhaps that is understandable, but I hope the new order prove to be good. There's only one way to find out, and in a matter of months we'll soon see.

Plenty of time to enjoy the existing trains at least, indeed I might even allocate a handful of hours to doing each and every line of the DLR on the existing trains before they go. That could be a fun little adventure!

And not all the existing stock are being replaced anyway.

 

[TRAX]

What appears to be wrong with the front seats ?

 

[D365]

That's a substantial driving console at the front, presumably the increased size is to accommodate more electronics underneath?

 

[stuu]

What appears to be wrong with the front seats ?

There's only one row, the existing trains have two rows

 

[Techniquest]

And not all the existing stock are being replaced anyway.

Oh yes that's true, I'd forgot that.

I'm having a senior moment here, but how many of these funky new trains are due to enter service?

 

[MCR247]

Oh yes that's true, I'd forgot that.

I'm having a senior moment here, but how many of these funky new trains are due to enter service?

43 I believe. I think it was said at the time of order that 33 were direct replacements and 10 for service increases, though that may now have changed of course

 

[Thirteen]

I'm impressed by how the B23 Stock looks now we're have close up footage.

 

[Techniquest]

43 I believe. I think it was said at the time of order that 33 were direct replacements and 10 for service increases, though that may now have changed of course

Thanks I guess we'll see what happens but I suspect the last 10 will still come along, possibly with some delays while they figure out exactly what they'll do with them. Given that's got to be a good couple of years at the minimum away yet, things might have completely changed by then!

 

[fgwrich]

Unit 201 was officially unveiled today.
Pictures from Modern Railways via Twitter.

One thing that does surprise me a little though, is the use of narrower inter car connections. Admittedly on the current DLR Stock, it is somewhat like standing on a turntable - presumably they've chosen to move a lot of the electrical equipment to the beefier front and car ends.

 

[Dstock7080]

43 I believe. I think it was said at the time of order that 33 were direct replacements and 10 for service increases, though that may now have changed of course

54 new trains.

Mayor visits Beckton depot to see new, state-of-the-art DLR train

Mayor visits Beckton depot to see new, state-of-the-art DLR train

tfl.gov.uk

 

[richpthomas]

That's a substantial driving console at the front, presumably the increased size is to accommodate more electronics underneath?

As per IanVisits, the driving consoles are mounted higher to accommodate a standing operating position, rather than seated in the current stock:

There’s also a change in how the train attendant drives the train when in manual, as safety standards now recommend that staff should be standing when carrying out safety functions — so the front seat control desk is taller than the current design so the staff don’t have to bend down to the controls.

 

[jon81uk]

43 I believe. I think it was said at the time of order that 33 were direct replacements and 10 for service increases, though that may now have changed of course

There was also an option for a further 11 which are being purchased using the governments Housing Infrastructure Fund. I expect that is to help futureproof with the Thamesmead extension.

 

[Jammy Dodger]

There was also an option for a further 11 which are being purchased using the governments Housing Infrastructure Fund. I expect that is to help futureproof with the Thamesmead extension.

According to Murky Depths (see below), there are a total of 54 trains ordered (designated B23) - 43 funded by TfL (33 to replace B90, B92 and B2K, 10 for fleet expansion), and 11 funded by the Housing Infrastructure Fund (government is "dragging their feet" over the final sign-off). Ignoring the possible Beckton Riverside/Thamesmead extension (which is highly unlikely to be completed by the end of the decade), it would appear that this will be enough for a full fleet replacement (hypothetically including B07), relegating the remaining B07 to demand response usage and adding frequencies in certain areas.

New DLR trains begin arriving in London - Murky Depths

The first new DLR train has arrived in London as works to increase frequency and capacity with a fleet of up to 53 trains

www.fromthemurkydepths.co.uk

New DLR trains begin arriving in London​

The first train carriage ordered as part of a mass order for new DLR trains has arrived in the capital from Spain.

Beckton depot is the home of the first new new rolling stock constructed by CAF.

New trains ditch the existing red colour scheme for turquoise livery.

They’ll be fully walk-through and planned improvements include a doubling of Woolwich to Stratford services alongside Stratford to Beckton.

Beckton depot is being expanded to hold an expanded fleet. Construction is ongoing to create new sidings.

 

[GodAtum]

What's the difference in passenger capacity between these and old stock?

I agree it's a shame only 1 row of front seats. They are my cousin's favorite, and as he has autism if he can't sit on them we'll need to wait for the next train.

 

[ijmad]

Geoff Marshall was there at the press event of course, here's his video walking around the new train.

As expected, walkthrough, aircon, USB charger points, transverse seating throughout (except at the very front/back), and some nice real time passenger information display.

What's the difference in passenger capacity between these and old stock?

I agree it's a shame only 1 row of front seats. They are my cousin's favorite, and as he has autism if he can't sit on them we'll need to wait for the next train.

For the B23s I have only found in-car seat layouts for the front and rear (A/E) cars which have 38 seats each, I think B and D are a bit longer but it's mostly extra doors so I would guess at least 150 seats in a whole unit. Which is comparable with a 3 unit train of existing stock.

However the capacity uplift will also see considerably increased frequency across practically every branch, and all trains running at full length, so if you think about it in terms of 'seats per hour' it's going to be much higher.

 

[jon81uk]

What's the difference in passenger capacity between these and old stock?

I agree it's a shame only 1 row of front seats. They are my cousin's favorite, and as he has autism if he can't sit on them we'll need to wait for the next train.

From IanVisits fantastic report

Take a sneak peek inside the DLR’s new trains

The first of a new fleet of DLR trains has arrived in the UK, and there's been a chance to see inside the train before it goes into passenger service.

www.ianvisits.co.uk

“
Although the trains have more space for wheelchairs and look as if they have fewer seats to sit on, in fact, they have more seats. Including the flip-ups, the new trains will have 156 seats, compared to the 152 sets on a current 3-car train. That’s because they’ve been able to create more space inside the train by building them as single 5-car units instead of having space wasted by joining two or three separate units together.
“

 

[ijmad]

Although the trains have more space for wheelchairs and look as if they have fewer seats to sit on, in fact, they have more seats. Including the flip-ups, the new trains will have 156 seats, compared to the 152 sets on a current 3-car train. That’s because they’ve been able to create more space inside the train by building them as single 5-car units instead of having space wasted by joining two or three separate units together.

So I was keen to correct my post above, and did a bit of primary research. I know some seat layouts have been altered so this could be outdated, but it does seem that the B9X/B2Ks units have 52 seats per unit (as can be seen here). So yes, 3 unit trains of the stock the new trains are replacing do indeed have 156 seats and the new trains likely have more seats.