Ex LNER (and Grand Central) Mark 4 sets for TfW

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Great news.

Will go and film 010 for my YouTube channel.

Currently delayed, and interestingly enough driven by the driver I recently wrote a furious complaint about, unless she’s got a twin.

 

[Welshguy1048]

Lol.

I wont ask what she did wrong!!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Lol.

I wont ask what she did wrong!!

Best if I don’t go off topic here, let’s just say she wasn’t very polite
It’s currently sat at Cardiff Central awaiting a guard, now 17 minutes late.

EDIT: 1714 CDF - HHD now cancelled as far as Shrewsbury.
Passengers will now be offloaded as guard has arrived and cannot work MK4 sets. A currently unallocated spare DMU will take over from Shrewsbury.

The MK4 set can’t reverse back towards Canton as the GWR 1730 CDF PMH is blocking it in so will no doubt have to run empty to Cardiff East Jct and reverse.

 

[Welshguy1048]

RTT is reporting it as cancelled due to unknown cause.......

Now it has changed to an issue with the train crew!

Best if I don’t go off topic here, let’s just say she wasn’t very polite
It’s currently sat at Cardiff Central awaiting a guard, now 17 minutes late.

EDIT: 1714 CDF - HHD now cancelled. Passengers will now be offloaded as guard has arrived and cannot work MK4 sets.

Lol

Have you got to be a special guard to work MK4 sets then?

Cancelled between Cardiff and Shrewsbury according to RTT

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

RTT is reporting it as cancelled due to unknown cause.......

Now it has changed to an issue with the train crew!


Lol

Have you got to be a special guard to work MK4 sets then?

Cancelled between Cardiff and Shrewsbury according to RTT

“Due to the inability of train crew to work this specific type of train.” is what the announcement says. Whoever made the announcement also confused matters more by mistakenly calling it the Manchester train, when of course it is the Holyhead train, so now Manchester passengers are asking if their train is also cancelled.

 

[Welshguy1048]

“Due to the inability of train crew to work this specific type of train.” is what the announcement says. Whoever made the announcement also confused matters more by mistakenly calling it the Manchester train, when of course it is the Holyhead train, so now Manchester passengers are asking if their train is also cancelled.

You couldn't make it up!!

“Due to the inability of train crew to work this specific type of train.” is what the announcement says. Whoever made the announcement also confused matters more by mistakenly calling it the Manchester train, when of course it is the Holyhead train, so now Manchester passengers are asking if their train is also cancelled.

So what has been allocated from Shrewsbury....?

 

[Topological]

Is there no chance the Mk4 goes to Shrewsbury empty? Presumably if not the whole set is out of position for tomorrow.

It does not give much faith in TfW if things consistently collapse.

The MK4 are much better than anything else, but feel like TfW felt they should have an "Intercity" train without actually thinking about the benefits of a more homogenous fleet.

 

[gazthomas]

It is going ECS to Shrewsbury. What an ongoing shambles

 

[Welshguy1048]

It is going ECS to Shrewsbury. What an ongoing shambles

Can't see it on RTT.....

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

RTT now suggests the train is indeed running empty to Shrewsbury.

67014 is now due in from Manchester, this being the third 67+MK4 set in Central in the space of forty-five minutes, but not much good for the Holyhead passengers. They have been put onto 175105 which is on the delayed 1749 to Man Picc.

The 1730 GWR service to Portsm Hbr has departed 21 minutes late due to being blocked in by the cancelled MK4 set. It had already arrived on Platform 1B alongside the MK4 set when it was cancelled, so couldn’t simply move to Platform 2, which then became occupied by the CrossCountry anyway.

 

[gazthomas]

Can't see it on RTT.....

Realtime Trains | 5W96 1714 Cardiff Central to Shrewsbury | 21/07/2023

Real-time train running information for 5W96 1714 departure from Cardiff Central to Shrewsbury on 21/07/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[Welshguy1048]

Realtime Trains | 5W96 1714 Cardiff Central to Shrewsbury | 21/07/2023

Real-time train running information for 5W96 1714 departure from Cardiff Central to Shrewsbury on 21/07/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Thanks

 

[Topological]

Realtime Trains | 5W96 1714 Cardiff Central to Shrewsbury | 21/07/2023

Real-time train running information for 5W96 1714 departure from Cardiff Central to Shrewsbury on 21/07/2023. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

And then the Portsmouth is out late too.

This is just standard Cardiff planning.

The Portsmouth could have used 2 given the Birmingham arrival was 1 minute after that and even allowing for time to clear the signals to allow the Birmingham to arrive the delay would not have been that large.

Of course it should not be the case that sending a unit to form a later train in behind a front train is problematic, but with TfW and the Mk4 (and presumably 197s given need for competence) it seems risky.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

And then the Portsmouth is out late too.

This is just standard Cardiff planning.

The Portsmouth could have used 2 given the Birmingham arrival was 1 minute after that and even allowing for time to clear the signals to allow the Birmingham to arrive the delay would not have been that large.

Of course it should not be the case that sending a unit to form a later train in behind a front train is problematic, but with TfW and the Mk4 (and presumably 197s given need for competence) it seems risky.

No it couldn’t have as it was already sat in 1B at the appropriate time before the Holyhead was cancelled.

 

[Topological]

No it couldn’t have as it was already sat in 1B at the appropriate time before the Holyhead was cancelled.

The point I am making is that planning should not put anything behind a TfW at the moment.

I appreciate the decision was made before the cancellation.

A glance at RTT shows the set to form the Portsmouth train arrived at 1723, instead of a scheduled 1717, and therefore after the Holyhead had failed to depart.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

67014 has arrived on time from Manchester but the onwards connection to Swansea (1808 TfW service) has been cancelled due to 150230 being declared a failure at Canton. Many will remember every other Manchester West Wales service was split to allow MK4s to operate.

So that’s inconvenienced passengers in the other direction too. The usual dispatch culprit at Cardiff Central (old guy with a red face and glasses) is being rude to customers rather than helping them, too. He physically uses his dispatch paddle to waft them out of the way. (!!)

 

[Envoy]

It is going ECS to Shrewsbury. What an ongoing shambles

Total shambles. Wonder if the passengers were told that their train was going north but they could not use it because the guard had not been trained how to press the buttons to lock/unlock the doors on that type of train?

So much for having the trains back under state control and not a private company!

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

67025 has been cancelled beyond Crewe on this evening’s 2030 Manchester Picc to Cardiff Ctrl. Passengers will need to transfer to a 2-carriage 175 for onward travel.

 

[sd0733]

67025 has been cancelled beyond Crewe on this evening’s 2030 Manchester Picc to Cardiff Ctrl. Passengers will need to transfer to a 2-carriage 175 for onward travel.

That's supposed to happen in Manchester, the 2030 is booked a unit anyway.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

That's supposed to happen in Manchester, the 2030 is booked a unit anyway.

Yes, not great for customers needing to get off and get back on though, especially as some who were seated will doubtlessly rejoin to find they don’t have a seat anymore.

 

[sd0733]

Yes, not great for customers needing to get off and get back on though, especially as some who were seated will doubtlessly rejoin to find they don’t have a seat anymore.

Not great no, HD06 was supposed to stay at Canton with 1W23 to have been a unit until very late on so no unit was sent to Manchester an hour earlier to form the 20:30.
Not sure why the plan changed but does seem to have caused a fair few unintended consequences

 

[Welshguy1048]

My video of the delayed 67010 with black MK4 set

Dave

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Presumably 1W96 picked up a trained guard at Shrewsbury - arrived at Holyhead 22 late.
The previous 1W95 (1522 Cardiff-Holyhead, 2x197 on RTT) was cancelled from Abergavenny ("problem with the train").
Not a good day for south-north Wales services.

 

[craigybagel]

Total shambles. Wonder if the passengers were told that their train was going north but they could not use it because the guard had not been trained how to press the buttons to lock/unlock the doors on that type of train?

I know I shouldn't bite but there's a lot more to it than just the doors (although even then the door controls are very different from and other rolling stock in the fleet). It's a 3 day course for guards and quite an intensive one at that.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I know I shouldn't bite but there's a lot more to it than just the doors (although even then the door controls are very different from and other rolling stock in the fleet). It's a 3 day course for guards and quite an intensive one at that.

It's a course that after two years of having the trains in service you'd think the guard allocated to it would know.

 

[craigybagel]

It's a course that after two years of having the trains in service you'd think the guard allocated to it would know.

There's about a hundred guards at Cardiff Mainline depot (who work the train in question), at a time when the company has been struggling to cover services as it is. There's only so much that can be trained at a time without cancelling trains, and there's still a fair few at Cardiff that need doing. Obviously the conductor shouldn't have been rostered to the job in the first place, so someone has made a mistake, but it is what it is.

 

[Rhydgaled]

Forgive me for asking, but what exactly needs modifying with the 67s?

They worked perfectly well when the Mk IVs were on East Coast on the Newcastle - Carlisle drags.

There's an extra socket fitted to the front of the loco, to enable the '42 way' cable to be plugged into the loco. This allows the loco and DVT to talk to each other

AFAIK on the East Coast they were used to drag the entire set, any 67 can do that, as can pretty much any loco but they were never used to be driven from the DVT with the 67 on the rear

I seem to recall that when Chiltern and ATW (for 'Gerald') started using 67s with mark 3 DVTs there were reports that the locos also needed to have remote fire-suppresion system fitted (in addition to the mods needed for the loco and DVT to 'talk' to each other) before the loco could be used to push from the rear with no member of staff on the loco. Presumably that fire-suppresion system is still required for the mark 4s.

The MK4 are much better than anything else, but feel like TfW felt they should have an "Intercity" train without actually thinking about the benefits of a more homogenous fleet.

The people from KeolisAmey who were responsible for the vast majority of TfW's original fleet plan certainly were thinkinkg about a more-homogenous fleet since they insisted on replacing the 158s and 175s with new stock - not just the 150s and Pacers. Don't forget that at originaly (when it was run by KeolisAmey) TfW Rail Services were only planning to have three mark 4 sets, replacing the three ATW mark 3 sets (although it was always the intention for the mark 4s to be deployed slightly differently to the ATW mark 3s).

Total shambles. Wonder if the passengers were told that their train was going north but they could not use it because the guard had not been trained how to press the buttons to lock/unlock the doors on that type of train?

So much for having the trains back under state control and not a private company!

There was of course a period when the whole industry was unable to conduct driver training due to COVID distancing rules - presumably this also applied to guards to some extent so the delay to getting all crews fully competent is understandable.

 

[Plasmanoodle]

I made a short journey on 1V18 yesterday evening. It was one of the ex-Grand Central sets, although I don’t know which one exactly. The interior carriage lights were switching off at every stop, and the emergency lights at either end were illuminating. Does anyone know what might have been causing that? The loco not providing enough power when at a standstill, or otherwise?

 

[sd0733]

Thats HD07

I made a short journey on 1V18 yesterday evening. It was one of the ex-Grand Central sets, although I don’t know which one exactly. The interior carriage lights were switching off at every stop, and the emergency lights at either end were illuminating. Does anyone know what might have been causing that? The loco not providing enough power when at a standstill, or otherwise?

That's HD07, when the Guard keys in at the DVT door panel the lights go off. It's just one panel so obviously an electrical gremlin there as it doesn't happen when key on at any of the coaches.

 

[JakeMurphy]

1V91’s unfortunately hit an animal on the line in gobowen area this morning. Rescue is on the way