GWR operating short 'HSTGTi' sets (see diagrams section for workings)

[XCTurbostar]

GWR have confirmed (admittedly via Twitter) that 43172 will loose its livery with no plans to gain it again.

 

[43 302]

One of the Laira drivers said it was now nameless and being sent off lease

It is indeed now nameless.

 

[43 302]

Coaches are meant to be 42173, 42195, 42217, 42310, 42353 (prototype) & 44042

 

[43096]

Coaches are meant to be 42172, 42195, 42217, 42310, 42353 (prototype) & 44042

42172 is at Ely I believe. More likely 42173.

 

[MB162435]

It is indeed now nameless.

Does look like it's staying and going green

 

[fgwrich]

Coaches are meant to be 42173, 42195, 42217, 42310, 42353 (prototype) & 44042

Which is a very odd and rather motley collection of vehicles, as 5 of those are TS-Ds. I'm surprised about the inclusion of 42353 in that rake as well, as it was in an appalling state when it went off lease - I can only imagine that one will be for spares / scrap.

42172 is an ex EC Vehicle, so as @43096 has it will be 42173.

 

[Phil Scott]

Which is a very odd and rather motley collection of vehicles, as 5 of those are TS-Ds. I'm surprised about the inclusion of 42353 in that rake as well, as it was in an appalling state when it went off lease - I can only imagine that one will be for spares / scrap.

42172 is an ex EC Vehicle, so as @43096 has it will be 42173.

It also seems strange that they are all Porterbrook vehicles. Other than the vehicles owned by FRH, most of the converted GWR coaches are Angel vehicles.

Perhaps the six vehicles in question have been sold to FRH. Otherwise, won't Porterbrook have to pay Angel for the use of the door mods?

 

[fgwrich]

It also seems strange that they are all Porterbrook vehicles. Other than the vehicles owned by FRH, most of the converted GWR coaches are Angel vehicles.

Perhaps the six vehicles in question have been sold to FRH. Otherwise, won't Porterbrook have to pay Angel for the use of the door mods?

They would indeed have to pay Angel or come to an agreement ala XC Mk3s. Incidentally these are the Porterbrook design TS-Ds with the unique small windows as well.

I wonder if a further vehicle swap between FRH & Porterbrook has taken place?

 

[43 302]

It is indeed 42173. And yes it is slightly odd in numerous ways mentioned above. I guess we will find out soon. Wouldn't surprise me if they are now FRH owned. Although using one of the prototypes is about questionable.

 

[MML]

Any chance GWR will standardize on 5 coaches like Scotrail intend, before it becomes too late to find any suitable spare Mk3s ?

 

[43 302]

Any chance GWR will standardize on 5 coaches like Scotrail intend, before it becomes too late to find any suitable spare Mk3s ?

I'd say zero. These aren't intercity services they're working remember.

 

[43096]

Any chance GWR will standardize on 5 coaches like Scotrail intend, before it becomes too late to find any suitable spare Mk3s ?

Are ScotRail going for all 5-car? At the moment the original plan stands. And, no, not going to happen on GWR.

 

[northernbelle]

It also seems strange that they are all Porterbrook vehicles. Other than the vehicles owned by FRH, most of the converted GWR coaches are Angel vehicles.

Perhaps the six vehicles in question have been sold to FRH. Otherwise, won't Porterbrook have to pay Angel for the use of the door mods?

It should be noted (again) that recent stock transfers from Porterbrook have been to GWR as franchise assets, rather than to First Rail Holdings which effectively acts as a traditional leasing company. It's a subtle but key difference and a relatively unusual arrangement.

Coaches heading to Doncaster aren't necessarily for conversion, so it shouldn't be taken as read that specific vehicles heading there will come back as converted 'sliders'.

 

[43 302]

It should be noted (again) that recent stock transfers from Porterbrook have been to GWR as franchise assets, rather than to First Rail Holdings which effectively acts as a traditional leasing company. It's a subtle but key difference and a relatively unusual arrangement.

Coaches heading to Doncaster aren't necessarily for conversion, so it shouldn't be taken as read that specific vehicles heading there will come back as converted 'sliders'.

What other reason could they have for being taken to Wabtec, other than to convert for Castle sets?

 

[HamworthyGoods]

What other reason could they have for being taken to Wabtec, other than to convert for Castle sets?

Spare parts for other conversions

 

[43 302]

43088 has made it's sliding door debut today on the north end of the set.

43088 + GW03 + 43188
2E07 0850 Penzance to Exeter
2C28 1318 Exeter to Penzance
2P26 1815 Penzance to Plymouth

43088 is North End.

 

[Phillipimo]

GWR buys vehicles outright in HST fleet expansion

Photos: Tony Miles UK: Despite concerns over future passenger numbers, the Department for Transport has given permission for Great Western Railway to procure three more shortened HST diesel trainsets, branded as the Castle Class by the franchisee. Each set comprises four refurbished PRM...

www.railwaygazette.com

UK: Despite concerns over future passenger numbers, the Department for Transport has given permission for Great Western Railway to procure three more shortened HST diesel trainsets, branded as the Castle Class by the franchisee.


Each set comprises four refurbished PRM TSI-compliant MkIII trailer vehicles marshalled between two diesel power cars. GWR already has 11 of these ‘short sets’, all of which have been heavily rebuilt at Wabtec’s Doncaster plant, where power doors are fitted.


With its fleet now increasing to 14, GWR expects to use 12 each day on services across the west of England. Currently the fleet is deployed on the Cardiff – Bristol – Penzance corridor, but the company is still evaluating how the additional sets will be used.

GWR to buy three more 4 car HST sets. Increasing the fleet from 11 to 14.

 

[John R]

Great news. That would just about be enough to connect up the existing services and operate an hourly Cardiff to Penzance service, which would be an excellent service.

 

[Meerkat]

Great news. That would just about be enough to connect up the existing services and operate an hourly Cardiff to Penzance service, which would be an excellent service.

How so - who wants to do journeys that long?
The cost would be tying Plymouth and Exeter commuters into the vagaries of Bristol and Cardiff delays.

 

[43 302]

From what I understand, there will be 15 coaches leased form angel, three coaches already owned by FRH, five coaches bought from porterbrook by GWR and seven PCs leased from angel. 43009, 010, 171 & 172 are already at Wabtec so presumably three more to go.

 

[fgwrich]

From what I understand, there will be 15 coaches leased form angel, three coaches already owned by FRH, five coaches bought from porterbrook by GWR and seven PCs leased from angel. 43009, 010, 171 & 172 are already at Wabtec so presumably three more to go.

Those 5 coaches bought from PB + FRH 42353 will be for spares only (they were all TSDs).

 

[43 302]

Those 5 coaches bought from PB + FRH 42353 will be for spares only (they were all TSDs).

42353 is PB, was swapped when the first 11 sets cam about.

 

[43096]

From what I understand, there will be 15 coaches leased form angel, three coaches already owned by FRH, five coaches bought from porterbrook by GWR and seven PCs leased from angel. 43009, 010, 171 & 172 are already at Wabtec so presumably three more to go.

What is quoted elsewhere is that GWR are buying the 15 trailers and 7 power cars from Angel.

 

[Envoy]

How so - who wants to do journeys that long?
The cost would be tying Plymouth and Exeter commuters into the vagaries of Bristol and Cardiff delays.

Well, I suspect that quite a few people wish to get from Cardiff & Newport down to south Devon & Cornwall and vice versa. By the time you factor in changing to/from the faster Cross Country services at Bristol, you often find that there is nothing much in it time wise between these and the HST direct services with their multiple-stops. Throw in possible lower fares by sticking with GWR and it would be easy to see how business could increase.

 

[43 302]

What is quoted elsewhere is that GWR are buying the 15 trailers and 7 power cars from Angel.

Oh really, that would make more sense given the articles title.

 

[Meerkat]

Well, I suspect that quite a few people wish to get from Cardiff & Newport down to south Devon & Cornwall and vice versa. By the time you factor in changing to/from the faster Cross Country services at Bristol, you often find that there is nothing much in it time wise between these and the HST direct services with their multiple-stops. Throw in possible lower fares by sticking with GWR and it would be easy to see how business could increase.

“Quite a few“ on what basis - are we talking a significant number of people who will actually go by train and will be put off by changing? Making it one service not only increases the delay risk but makes it harder to make the timings convenient for commuting and connections at either end.

 

[PHILIPE]

I just can't drop on it at the moment but I read that additional HSTs would replace 158s on the Cardiff to Penzance corridor allowing these to be deployed on Cornish Branches where route availability permits and, in turn, releasing 150s to help in displacing the Pacers at Exeter

 

[Mikey C]

I just can't drop on it at the moment but I read that additional HSTs would replace 158s on the Cardiff to Penzance corridor allowing these to be deployed on Cornish Branches where route availability permits and, in turn, releasing 150s to help in displacing the Pacers at Exeter

Wouldn't it be rather a waste of 158s to use them on slow Cornish branch lines?

 

[PHILIPE]

Wouldn't it be rather a waste of 158s to use them on slow Cornish branch lines?

Agreed, but if you have them available where else would you put them ?

 

[Meerkat]

Agreed, but if you have them available where else would you put them ?

Up North where they need them. Then GWR could lose a class and simplify to 80x, HST, Turbo, 150

edit - forgot the 769s!
edit - and the sleepers...oh well a bit simpler!
edit - and 387s! Simpler in the West anyway!