HST coach disposals

[Helvellyn]

It looks like the first and last coaches were ex Arriva Trains Wales loco hauled coaches? I'm suprised they were able to couple them to HST trailers as I thought there were differences between the couplings (and electrical supplies, although this is irrelevant on an empty train heading for scrap!)

It's just the heating supply that differs - ETS for the loco-halued coaches; three phase supply for the HST trailers. The former have drop-head buckeye couplings and the latter have fixed buckeyes, but they are compatible.

When a number of East Coast TGS vehicles were modified to work with Class 91s at the start of East Coast electrification my recollection is that two modifications were made, both at the Guard's compartment end: fitment of a drop-head buckeye in place of the fixed buckeye and the addition of buffers to the headstock. Modified power cars were used at opposite end both as DVTs but also to provide the three-phase supply for the air-con, lighting, etc. because the Class 91s couldn't provide this being ETS fitted.

 

[43096]

It's just the heating supply that differs - ETS for the loco-halued coaches; three phase supply for the HST trailers. The former have drop-head buckeye couplings and the latter have fixed buckeyes, but they are compatible.

The HST couplers are known as Alliance couplers. HST train supply is also ETS: indeed back when introduced the LHCS train supply was known as ETH.

When a number of East Coast TGS vehicles were modified to work with Class 91s at the start of East Coast electrification my recollection is that two modifications were made, both at the Guard's compartment end: fitment of a drop-head buckeye in place of the fixed buckeye and the addition of buffers to the headstock. Modified power cars were used at opposite end both as DVTs but also to provide the three-phase supply for the air-con, lighting, etc. because the Class 91s couldn't provide this being ETS fitted.

There were more than two modifications: the TGS vehicles were fitted with RCH jumper cables to connect to the 91s and there was an interface made between the RCH connection and the HST 36-way jumper cable. There were wiring modifications on the power cars to link the relevant wires in the jumpers to the TDM "filing cabinet" in the power car van. Must admit, I never really understood why it was felt necessary to fit the TGS with buffers and drop-head buckeyes given that they would only work with power cars or Class 89/90/91 locos, all of which had drop-head buckeyes that could couple to an Alliance coupler.

 

[cav1975]

Are any more going for scrap any time soon?

 

[ChilternTurbo]

I'm assuming the blue and grey farewell tour LNER set are still stored?

 

[fgwrich]

I'm assuming the blue and grey farewell tour LNER set are still stored?

Correct, still at Ely Papworth. Thankfully Newport seem too busy chopping up the 365s & ex LO / TfL rail units at the moment.

 

[43096]

Correct, still at Ely Papworth. Thankfully Newport seem too busy chopping up the 365s & ex LO / TfL rail units at the moment.

By my reckoning Angel still have 41 HST trailers stored at Ely awaiting their fate:
- 3 x TRBF (402xx)
- 5 x TRFB (407xx)
- 10 x TF
- 18 x TS
- 5 x TGS

 

[Southern Dvr]

By my reckoning Angel still have 41 HST trailers stored at Ely awaiting their fate:
- 3 x TRBF (402xx)
- 5 x TRFB (407xx)
- 10 x TF
- 18 x TS
- 5 x TGS

They must be long past being any use to anyone but the scrappie unfortunately.

 

[47444]

By my reckoning Angel still have 41 HST trailers stored at Ely awaiting their fate:
- 3 x TRBF (402xx)
- 5 x TRFB (407xx)
- 10 x TF
- 18 x TS
- 5 x TGS

To which, if my records are right, can be added:
Porterbrook have 9 HST trailers stored at Gascoigne Wood, Burton-on-Trent, Long Marston and Wabtec Doncaster (40751, 40807, 41161, 41189, 42110, 42173, 42195, 42217, 42310)
First GW own outright 14 HST trailers stored at Long Marston, Laira, Penzance and Wabtec Doncaster (40900, 40902, 40904, 42094, 42095, 42167, 42175, 42176, 42231, 42353, 42563, 42565, 42566, 44100)
I believe that LSL have 29 HST trailers of which 16 are stored (40106, 40808, 41063, 41117, 41149, 41167, 41183, 41187, 42100, 42220, 42319, 42583, 44047, 46006, 46012, 46014)
I also have 3 other HST trailers shown as stored whose ownership I am unclear on (40728, 41043, 44089)

Any updates to these lists most welcome, of course (I have the same 41 Angel trailers at Ely)

 

[43096]

To which, if my records are right, can be added:
Porterbrook have 9 HST trailers stored at Gascoigne Wood, Burton-on-Trent, Long Marston and Wabtec Doncaster (40751, 40807, 41161, 41189, 42110, 42173, 42195, 42217, 42310)
First GW own outright 14 HST trailers stored at Long Marston, Laira, Penzance and Wabtec Doncaster (40900, 40902, 40904, 42094, 42095, 42167, 42175, 42176, 42231, 42353, 42563, 42565, 42566, 44100)
I believe that LSL have 29 HST trailers of which 16 are stored (40106, 40808, 41063, 41117, 41149, 41167, 41183, 41187, 42100, 42220, 42319, 42583, 44047, 46006, 46012, 46014)
I also have 3 other HST trailers shown as stored whose ownership I am unclear on (40728, 41043, 44089)

Any updates to these lists most welcome, of course (I have the same 41 Angel trailers at Ely)

A short update that Porterbrook have no stored HST trailers in their ownership.

I’ll post a full update on the above later.

 

[Mack91]

To which, if my records are right, can be added:
Porterbrook have 9 HST trailers stored at Gascoigne Wood, Burton-on-Trent, Long Marston and Wabtec Doncaster (40751, 40807, 41161, 41189, 42110, 42173, 42195, 42217, 42310)

I can't say what has happened to them since, but there aren't any HST trailers stored at Gascoigne Wood anymore. Mainly 321s, a few wagons, a 142 and some Nova 3 sets when I've passed on the train recently.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

Gas Wood is being used for training purposes on the Nova 3 sets by TPE crews hence why they are there as well as for the storage space available. there are plans to introduce more sets in traffic in May but unsure wether this is on the south route and diverting them from Manchester Airport to Liverpool or to re-extend the york Scarborough shuttles through to Manchester. Think Redcar/saltburn has been knocked on the head due to noise complaints

 

[47444]

I can't say what has happened to them since, but there aren't any HST trailers stored at Gascoigne Wood anymore. Mainly 321s, a few wagons, a 142 and some Nova 3 sets when I've passed on the train recently.

Thank you for this - my notes have 40751 still there - does anyone know where that is now (if it still exists)?

 

[priorn]

Thank you for this - my notes have 40751 still there - does anyone know where that is now (if it still exists)?

Weston Wharf on the Cambrian Heritage Railway, for use as the station buffet. Arrived at Oswestry on 19th May 2021.

 

[57Tonic]

I can't say what has happened to them since, but there aren't any HST trailers stored at Gascoigne Wood anymore. Mainly 321s, a few wagons, a 142 and some Nova 3 sets when I've passed on the train recently.

I have 40807 & 41161 at Pitlochry as The Wee Choo Choo Restaurant also 41043 Wabtec Doncaster for prototype Chiltern door conversion.

 

[43096]

To which, if my records are right, can be added:
Porterbrook have 9 HST trailers stored at Gascoigne Wood, Burton-on-Trent, Long Marston and Wabtec Doncaster (40751, 40807, 41161, 41189, 42110, 42173, 42195, 42217, 42310)

These are located as follows; as above none are now Porterbrook's:
40751 - Cambrian Railways Society
40807, 41161 - sold to Wee Choo Choo restaurant in Pitlochry. Venture since gone into administration, vehicles last reported at Reid's, Stoke-on-Trent
41189 - ownership to Motorail then International Metals & Cable Recycling, Long Marston (for use as an office)
42110 - owned by Nemesis, at Burton-on-Trent
42173/195/217/310 - owned by First Greater Western (aka GWR franchise) for spares recovery. Located at Wabtec Doncaster.

First GW own outright 14 HST trailers stored at Long Marston, Laira, Penzance and Wabtec Doncaster (40900, 40902, 40904, 42094, 42095, 42167, 42175, 42176, 42231, 42353, 42563, 42565, 42566, 44100)

With the exception of 42353 (which is First Greater Western owned), all these are owned by First Rail Holdings.
40900/902/904, 42167/176/231/563/565 - all stored at Long Marston
42094/095/175 - at Laira (presumably component recovery)
42353 - at Wabtec Doncaster for component recovery
42566, 44100 - at Penzance

I believe that LSL have 29 HST trailers of which 16 are stored (40106, 40808, 41063, 41117, 41149, 41167, 41183, 41187, 42100, 42220, 42319, 42583, 44047, 46006, 46012, 46014)

40106, 40808, 42319/583, 46012 - Severn Valley Railway
41063/117, 42100/220, 44047 - Crewe
41149/167, 46006/014 - Eastleigh
41183 - Blue Pullman set
41187 - "Staycation" set

I also have 3 other HST trailers shown as stored whose ownership I am unclear on (40728, 41043, 44089)

40728 - DATS owned
41043 - awaiting disposal (if not already disposed) after accident damage at NL 10/09/2005
44089 - Grand Central owned. Last reported at York.

 

[fgwrich]

I have 40807 & 41161 at Pitlochry as The Wee Choo Choo Restaurant also 41043 Wabtec Doncaster for prototype Chiltern door conversion.

I'm not sure what will be happening to those two as Planning Permission was recently refused. They have both been repainted into BR Blue Grey though.

 

[57Tonic]

I'm not sure what will be happening to those two as Planning Permission was recently refused. They have both been repainted into BR Blue Grey though.

They called in the liquidator's in November 21

 

[fgwrich]

They called in the liquidator's in November 21

That's a shame, I wonder if anything has since happened to them then?

 

[47444]

Thanks everyone for your comprehensive answers

 

[Phil Scott]

40704 has apparently arrived at the GCR. Unsure if it’s for static use, or whether more will follow.

 

[43096]

40704 has apparently arrived at the GCR. Unsure if it’s for static use, or whether more will follow.

I can’t see how it can be for anything but static use. They’ve nothing to haul them with even before getting to train supply.

 

[Southern Dvr]

I can’t see how it can be for anything but static use. They’ve nothing to haul them with even before getting to train supply.

Train supply can be done with some form of shore supply, numerous vehicles have been converted into B&Bs or cafes etc. Highly doubt these will be moving again.

 

[Towers]

Ex EMR 41206 & 41209 now each have their own Instagram pages if anyone wants to follow & keep track!

They've been moved to an as yet undisclosed new home.

Instagram links below:

Mark Three A (@four_one_206) • Instagram photos and videos

367 Followers, 232 Following, 17 Posts - See Instagram photos and videos from Mark Three A (@four_one_206)

instagram.com

Mark three (@four_one_209) • Instagram photos and videos

556 Followers, 409 Following, 41 Posts - See Instagram photos and videos from Mark three (@four_one_209)

instagram.com

 

[43096]

Train supply can be done with some form of shore supply, numerous vehicles have been converted into B&Bs or cafes etc. Highly doubt these will be moving again.

Exactly. HST vehicles are ideal for this, as they can be fed from a commercial 415V three phase supply.

 

[57Tonic]

40704 has apparently arrived at the GCR. Unsure if it’s for static use, or whether more will follow.

I think this leaves just 40714/20/34 & 50 ex TRUB/TRFBs at Ely, not in preservation or scrapped.

 

[fgwrich]

I think this leaves just 40714/20/34 & 50 ex TRUB/TRFBs at Ely, not in preservation or scrapped.

Not quite, as 40714 was converted into TS 42504 at Kilmarnock in 2012.

The three, now unwanted, ex EMT / EMR / GWR 402s (40204 / 5 / 21) are also in Ely too.

 

[spotify95]

What happened to the LNER farewell set (that they did in intercity colors) - is that still being stored somewhere, or has that been disposed of?

 

[43096]

What happened to the LNER farewell set (that they did in intercity colors) - is that still being stored somewhere, or has that been disposed of?

The answer is above, in post #668.

 

[43102EMR]

What happened to the LNER farewell set (that they did in intercity colors) - is that still being stored somewhere, or has that been disposed of?

Was meant to be part of the Onene collection in Kent for preservation, but not sure what’s come of that.

 

[fgwrich]

Was meant to be part of the Onene collection in Kent for preservation, but not sure what’s come of that.

It certainly wasn't. That was a blunder either concocted by Rail Advent or a miscommunication by Margate. Neither Angel Trains had sold it (and to this day remains unsold) and LSL certainly hadn't bought it.

What isn't helping it is Angel Trains desire to sell it as a complete rake. So, good news for Newport SIMS then...