Lighting quality on trains: are you bothered?

[BRX]

I'm curious to know how many people are actually bothered about lighting quality on board trains.

For me, bad lighting is now one of the most significant irritants on long journeys, which is frustrating because it seems like something that should not be difficult or expensive to get right, if it's specified by someone who knows what they are doing.

I think train companies ought to take it more seriously, but I'm quite fussy about lighting in general. Perhaps most of the population isn't bothered.

I often find it's too bright - but the main thing that bothers me is the colour temperature, which is often much too cold (by which I mean, it's much too far in the blue-ish rather than orange-ish direction).

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes, definitely. Quality lighting, using a combination of indirect, diffused strips and spots, is an essential part of creating a welcoming, relaxing (but safe) feeling on board.

The Class 196 and 397 in my view get it spectacularly right, to use two examples.

The Class 777 for instance gets it very wrong - way too bright. As did the original Mk3, which was grossly overlit - the "dim" setting was about right. And use of "daylight tubes" as FGW did on the HSTs was awful.

And what to me looks really sloppy is mixing colour temperatures of tube. To me it looks sloppier than using random seat covers because you can't find the right ones.

 

[Kilopylae]

I often find it's too bright - but the main thing that bothers me is the colour temperature, which is often much too cold (by which I mean, it's much too far in the blue-ish rather than orange-ish direction).

You've hit the nail on the head here. It leads to me seeking out CrossCountry services to avoid using GWR IETs despite the Voyager stink.

 

[Bletchleyite]

You've hit the nail on the head here. It leads to me seeking out CrossCountry services to avoid using GWR IETs despite the Voyager stink.

I don't find IETs that bad - they are a *bit* bright and there is a *slight* flicker but it's not terrible. Could be better but by no means worst.

 

[bramling]

I'm curious to know how many people are actually bothered about lighting quality on board trains.

For me, bad lighting is now one of the most significant irritants on long journeys, which is frustrating because it seems like something that should not be difficult or expensive to get right, if it's specified by someone who knows what they are doing.

I think train companies ought to take it more seriously, but I'm quite fussy about lighting in general. Perhaps most of the population isn't bothered.

I often find it's too bright - but the main thing that bothers me is the colour temperature, which is often much too cold (by which I mean, it's much too far in the blue-ish rather than orange-ish direction).

Certainly find both factors a mild irritant on some types of train, and enough of a thing to add to the list of reasons to avoid using trains at the moment.

 

[BRX]

And use of "daylight tubes" as FGW did on the HSTs was awful.

That's about the worst there is/was, and has unfortunately between retained on the Scotrail HSTs.

That lighting was perhaps decided on when LED lighting was relatively new, and warmer temperature LEDs were more expensive, but there's no excuse now.

What I wonder is whether there are people at TOCs who believe that passengers prefer this kind of lighting, or if it's just that it gets specified by people without the right knowledge.

 

[stuu]

Too bright is horrible - the GWR HSTs were particularly awful when there were refurbished. IETs aren't too bad but I prefer the warmer lighting on Voyagers

 

[Bletchleyite]

That's about the worst there is/was, and has unfortunately between retained on the Scotrail HSTs.

That lighting was perhaps decided on when LED lighting was relatively new, and warmer temperature LEDs were more expensive, but there's no excuse now.

It's not LED, it's fluorescents. I just don't understand why they did it, it's awful, though was vaguely tolerable when switched to the dim setting as it mostly was.

You can use cold colour temperature lighting as a background light, it works quite well on the Irish intercity DMUs, but direct and bright makes it feel like an interrogation.\

TfL installed it on the A, C and D stocks (it really was awful with direct, bare tubes - it was like an assault on my retinas), but fortunately reversed their decision with the S stock which have warm, well-diffused lighting and feel very welcoming.

What I wonder is whether there are people at TOCs who believe that passengers prefer this kind of lighting, or if it's just that it gets specified by people without the right knowledge.

The only conclusion I can come to (bar gross incompetence) is that whoever specced it came from South or South East Asia where it is the norm and people genuinely prefer it.

 

[BRX]

Perhaps sunglasses should join noise-cancelling headphones as part of the standard kit to defend against the general sensory assault that is so often the case now.

It's not LED, it's fluorescents.

Oh right.

So potentially all Scotrail would need to do is swap out some flourescent tubes?

I had thought maybe it's some kind of difficult to replace legacy LED strips in there.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Lighting that's too subdued also an issue. Certainly used to be the case in standard class on Pendolinos on the WCML when they were operated by Virgin.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Lighting that's too subdued also an issue. Certainly used to be the case in standard class on Pendolinos on the WCML when they were operated by Virgin.

One person's dingy is another person's cosy. I love the Pendolino lighting (though the "cigarette stained" conduits maybe look a bit wrong). The refurb brightens it a bit while still not overdoing it.

A long distance train should be primarily about a relaxing ambiance. Such trains should (as Pendolinos do) have individual lighting to allow people who want it brighter to choose that for themselves.

 

[Halish Railway]

I have been on a Northern Class 150 at night and received a migraine due to how harsh the lighting was with the contrast of the dark outside and some of the dark furnishings (Black seatbacks and dark blue walls at the end of the carriage).

 

[Bletchleyite]

I have been on a Northern Class 150 at night and received a migraine due to how harsh the lighting was with the contrast of the dark outside and some of the dark furnishings (Black seatbacks and dark blue walls at the end of the carriage).

The worst is the Class 155, which at the non-bog end (if I recall) basically has an LED spotlight shining in your face. Whichever muppet designed that wants strapping to a seat and left with that light shining at them until they repent.

 

[alistairlees]

The worst is the Class 155, which at the non-bog end (if I recall) basically has an LED spotlight shining in your face. Whichever muppet designed that wants strapping to a seat and left with that light shining at them until they repent.

Could you specify the seat type, for maximum effect?

 

[londonmidland]

Northern’s ‘refurbished’ Class 150s.

Simply awful with its super bright LED cold white lights, which don’t even have diffusers fitted to them.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Could you specify the seat type, for maximum effect?

None other than the venerable Sophia, preferably one that's been in use for a couple of years so has a collapsed base.

 

[Mzzzs]

I find the lights on the mk4s too dark.
Lights on castle sets were bright but also made an already very cold train feel even colder.

 

[yorkie]

Good quality trains have lighting that is not intrusive and give passengers the ability to switch on additional lighting above their seat if they desire. Sadly, this is rare.

 

[Flying Snail]

Good quality trains have lighting that is not intrusive and give passengers the ability to switch on additional lighting above their seat if they desire. Sadly, this is rare.

Meanwhile individual reading lights (and controllable air vents) have been standard on road coaches for 50 years.

 

[bengley]

Northern’s ‘refurbished’ Class 150s.

Simply awful with its super bright LED cold white lights, which don’t even have diffusers fitted to them.

View attachment 132200

These are a big pet hate of mine too. Too bright, far too cool white. It makes a big difference when you step onto a 769 which retain the old Thameslink warm white fluorescent tubes and are far, far nicer.

It's worth noting the LED tubes on the 150s can be rotated to face up instead of down towards the passengers and provide ample, more diffused light. I wouldn't, however, condone any passenger doing this themselves

 

[Meerkat]

I went on one trip out on an IET and back on an HST. The HST had the shocking flourescents, like a backstreet takeaway. The IET was very uncomfortable but the lighting was fine. The issue was the flickering display above the end saloon door - because of its position it was hard for it not to be at least in the corner of my eyes.
Never really noticed the lights on SWR, which is a compliment I guess. The 159s seem snugger, but not sure if the lighting is warmer or its the narrower body, fewer windows, and end doors.
I did really like the relaxing low lighting in the Pendolinos. Apart from anything else it means you can still see something of the lights going by outside.

 

[Mikey C]

A non train example, but I really dislike the lighting used in the Borismasters, which tries to ape the "tungsten bulbs" of the (unrefurbished) Routemasters with individual and really bright LEDs shining down, which I find pretty unpleasant.

The GWR refurbished HSTs were way OTT with the brightness of their lighting. Didn't they rectify this by turning half of them off?

 

[BRX]

With half of them off the brightness is reduced to something more sensible but the colour remains awful.

 

[Bletchleyite]

A non train example, but I really dislike the lighting used in the Borismasters, which tries to ape the "tungsten bulbs" of the (unrefurbished) Routemasters with individual and really bright LEDs shining down, which I find pretty unpleasant.

I really like the spots on those, they look classy and are nothing like the old tungstens.

Another one I've seen that's good is the Wright double deckers which have a very thin line of LEDs each side of the upstairs ceiling which give the lighting impression of a load of spots.

 

[Trainbike46]

I'm not too bothered personally, but I don't like it when light is too yellow in colour, as it just makes the train feel old and dirty

And I do agree with others here that a mix of different colour tubes looks a bit messy (though I prefer it over broken lights, which looks even worse)

 

[yorksrob]

A nice warm tungsten glow is the best - as on the thumper.

 

[physics34]

Clearly the new LED lighting on alot of stock is headache indusing, especially if u suffer from them regularly. Also not very good if you have a hangover!

Yet another issue with train comfort that has not been properly assessed with the public. It just ticks a box!

 

[Ken H]

I just wish they would turn some of them off when its bright outside. Daylight is so much better than artificial.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I always loved the warm lighting on Virgin Pendolinos and fear the refurbishment will ruin this.

Class 700s, I feel, have an atmosphere strongly reminiscent of a dentist’s practice, probably down to the lights, but also the sterile blue interior and new paint smell which persists 6 years or so after their introduction.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I always loved the warm lighting on Virgin Pendolinos and fear the refurbishment will ruin this.

It's a bit brighter but not unpleasantly so.