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Livery under Great British Railways

LNW-GW Joint

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Great British Energy seems to be being promoted by the new government as GB Energy.
The rail equivalent would thus be GB Rail.
I think that would be an improvement on the long-form Great British Railways.
 
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irish_rail

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Well I'd like to see the double arrow applied to unit cab sides throughout the network as a good start. Anyone who has seen 802114 which has a small white double arrow will understand what I mean. This could be done in a couple of weeks and for relatively minimal cost , and would at least set the ball rolling, as personally I think new liveries are likely a couple of years away.
 

Sorcerer

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While I agree using the jack as a livery might look tacky, I think some of you are too harsh about using the colours. It does make sense to represent a nationalised railway with the colours of the national flag.

Some of you are also really harsh on white liveries. I think, if kept clean, they look really smart in a simplistic yet effective way. All over colours can easily look gaudy. I drew this quick carriage as an example of what might look smart using the flag’s colours.

View attachment 162380

It’s simple but I don’t think it looks too bad. SBB, who you all love to worship, aren’t too far off.
I must admit, I do quite like this render. Maybe the doors could be a different colour such as dark blue or something to contrast it with the red roof, but otherwise it does look quite similar to the simplistic yet smart and effective liveries of SBB and TfW that can be used on all kinds of rolling stock.
 

Leyland Bus

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Well I'd like to see the double arrow applied to unit cab sides throughout the network as a good start. Anyone who has seen 802114 which has a small white double arrow will understand what I mean. This could be done in a couple of weeks and for relatively minimal cost , and would at least set the ball rolling, as personally I think new liveries are likely a couple of years away.
Well that took way too much time to find...


Far too small, almost pointless having it. Why is it even there?

Photo of GWR 802 114 from Flickr taken by Colin Peachy.
 

renegademaster

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Well that took way too much time to find...


Far too small, almost pointless having it. Why is it even there?

Photo of GWR 802 114 from Flickr taken by Colin Peachy.
I suspect it might be something a employe at the depot snuck on like the NSE stickers put on the front of various Southeastern networkers
 

61653 HTAFC

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Again that would be up to the Yorkshire Combined Authorities to come to an agreement on, the two possibilities I can think of off the top of my head are either trains run across county borders only to the first suitable interchange station or they manage an even share of service on the shared lines. My actual proposal for Yorkshire local service assuming that a single Yorkshire Combined Authority is not going to happen any time soon would be that they be operated as if they were any other Northern/North Eastern regional service.

I am well aware that getting all of the Yorkshire Combined Authorities to play nicely is problematic, but the management of the local rail services is unlikely to be handed over to the Combined Authorities without them reaching an agreement on the matter so the status quo of GBR managing the services will be maintained/restored if the Yorkshire Combined Authorities don't play nicely with each other.
Even back in the 1990s when many local services in West Yorkshire were branded (and even named on announcements) as "MetroTrain"... they were still run by Regional Railways.

I wouldn't trust West Yorkshire Combined Authority (or whatever they're called this week) to run a bath, let alone a railway.
 
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TT-ONR-NRN

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I must admit, I do quite like this render. Maybe the doors could be a different colour such as dark blue or something to contrast it with the red roof, but otherwise it does look quite similar to the simplistic yet smart and effective liveries of SBB and TfW that can be used on all kinds of rolling stock.
Thank you :)
 

Islineclear3_1

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I think it'd be risky to have trains of all the same livery especially at stations which have different services.
When I grew up in the 1970s, generally speaking, suburban stock was blue and express stock was blue & grey. Easy!

Seriously though, what we need is a unified livery that looks smart and doesn't reveal the dirt too much.

And before anyone says anything, I draw the line at rainbow... I remember two 319s (364/5?) carrying a livery like this and it looked...well garish and horrible....
 

HSTEd

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When I grew up in the 1970s, generally speaking, suburban stock was blue and express stock was blue & grey. Easy!

Seriously though, what we need is a unified livery that looks smart and doesn't reveal the dirt too much.

And before anyone says anything, I draw the line at rainbow... I remember two 319s (364/5?) carrying a livery like this and it looked...well garish and horrible....
What about black with grey/silver doors?
 

irish_rail

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I suspect it might be something a employe at the depot snuck on like the NSE stickers put on the front of various Southeastern networkers
No I believe it is official, its certainly been there for a couple of years, one at each end, possibly as part of a DFt experiment. Agreed that if rolled out, it would need to be 2 or 3 times bigger.
 

43096

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How about vinyls showing places and faces relevant to the region or route?
What is needed is a simple, effective livery that doesn't involve vast acreages of vinyl. Vinyl just encourages the designers to get their crayons out to create a "current" complicated design that rapidly dates and looks shoddy.
 

JLH4AC

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Even back in the 1990s when many local services in West Yorkshire were branded (and even named on announcements) as "MetroTrain"... they were still run by Regional Railways.

I wouldn't trust West Yorkshire Combined Authority (or whatever they're called this week) to run a bath, let alone a railway.
I am well aware of how Regional Railways/Northern were ones to actually operate Metrotrain yet though many means such as control over extra funding, them owning some of their own rolling stock, and legal powers granted to the PTE were able to have a great deal of control over the management of the local services. I do not think that West Yorkshire will ever operate the West Yorkshire suburan trains themselves especially not before TfL starts doing so.
 

Mark J

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Class 800 units should be rebranded 'Intercity 140' and in a modern day 'Swallow Livery'.. :lol:
 

61653 HTAFC

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BR ran trains with Trans Pennine (no "Express") branding in the 1980s, even devising a livery which was later adapted to become Provincial/Regional Railways. This livery was applied to several sets of coaches and to one class 47.

The SRA invented TPE as an inter-city brand formed from the limited-stop services of these two TOC, the remains of which mostly became Northern.
Just one TOC (Northern Spirit) initially. The North Western services only became part of TPE later on. Northern Spirit used the Trans-Pennine Express name from day one, with a separate pink livery on the 158s as opposed to the green livery applied to 142s and 156s.
 

vuzzeho

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Class 800 units should be rebranded 'Intercity 140' and in a modern day 'Swallow Livery'.. :lol:
I do wonder... assuming the Azuma/Evero/Paragon/whatever brand names for the IETs are going to be retired... will they be given different names? I feel like A-train or AT300s could work.
 

Bletchleyite

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I do wonder... assuming the Azuma/Evero/Paragon/whatever brand names for the IETs are going to be retired... will they be given different names? I feel like A-train or AT300s could work.

If you follow my line of reasoning that incorporating the rest of InterCity into LNER, with that company renamed to InterCity, is (a) sensible* and (b) likely, then I could see the "Azuma" name being the one that wins.

* I don't like their fares policy, but that's also DfT's fares policy, so it is likely to roll out more widely regardless of who operates the IC services.
 

Bletchleyite

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Isn't the name "Azuma" attached to the East Coast mainline becasuse it is Japanese for east?

It is, but hardly anyone knows that and it does seem to be the best-known of the brands for Class 80x, with people using it to describe all of them. Probably because of the power of Virgin's marketing (who came up with it in conjunction I think with a member of staff).
 

43096

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Class 800 units should be rebranded 'Intercity 140' and in a modern day 'Swallow Livery'.. :lol:
They should be all-over maroon. That will then weather to a turd brown colour to match the quality of the train.
;)
 

irish_rail

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It is, but hardly anyone knows that and it does seem to be the best-known of the brands for Class 80x, with people using it to describe all of them. Probably because of the power of Virgin's marketing (who came up with it in conjunction I think with a member of
Completely disagree. You cannot call the intercity fleets Azumas. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to the majority of the country. Its just sounds like one of those dated meaningless buzz words. At least IET does what it says on the tin, and follows on from the successful HST. Its also timeless in a way Azuma will never be.
 

Bletchleyite

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Completely disagree. You cannot call the intercity fleets Azumas. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to the majority of the country. Its just sounds like one of those dated meaningless buzz words. At least IET does what it says on the tin, and follows on from the successful HST. Its also timeless in a way Azuma will never be.

You could I suppose licence the ICE brand from Deutsche Bahn (or ask for it for nowt given that I suspect they paid BR nowt to get InterCity originally!)
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Completely disagree. You cannot call the intercity fleets Azumas. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to the majority of the country. Its just sounds like one of those dated meaningless buzz words. At least IET does what it says on the tin, and follows on from the successful HST. Its also timeless in a way Azuma will never be.
The public sector Italians have gone for fleet names like Swing, Jazz, Rock and Pop (from different manufacturers).
Sometimes the manufacturer's name sticks, like Flirt and Pendolino, or Aventra.
The only common feature about the 80x fleets is the AT300 Hitachi family brand name.
No doubt DfT/GBR will own the IEP moniker, as the name of their 800/801 fleet procurements which ended up with GWR/LNER.
 

43096

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You could I suppose licence the ICE brand from Deutsche Bahn (or ask for it for nowt given that I suspect they paid BR nowt to get InterCity originally!)
You'd hope DB would ask for some guarantees on quality of service to avoid possible brand damage! Because an IET of whatever flavour is an embarrassment against any form of DB ICE.
 

Andyh82

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As the main goal seems to be to remove perceived confusion with different brands and make it clear that there aren’t private TOCs, I can see it being one brand, one livery, probably pretty simple so people don’t think they’ve spent too much money, no sub brands or anything. An 800 would be painted the same as a 150, the same as a 450

Look at the Bee Network in Manchester, it’s a plain colour, one name, no branding, even the flagship guided bus way has lost its name, it looks increasingly likely that the trams will lose their Metrolink name as well

I personally wouldn’t do this, but it’s what I could see happening.

I do wonder... assuming the Azuma/Evero/Paragon/whatever brand names for the IETs are going to be retired... will they be given different names? I feel like A-train or AT300s could work.
Despite what enthusiasts always want, technical sounding names are not going to be public facing or if they are, they won’t catch on

Nobody is ever going to say they’ve been on one of those new “IET” trains, but I imagine many have said they’ve been on an “Azuma”
 

JLH4AC

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Despite what enthusiasts always want, technical sounding names are not going to be public facing or if they are, they won’t catch on

Nobody is ever going to say they’ve been on one of those new “IET” trains, but I imagine many have said they’ve been on an “Azuma”
I would say rail enthusiasts are worse for not using technical names, I find that the general public will use the official name if it is widely known, or refer to their manufacturer or the service they operate if they need to be more specific about a particular train yet rail enthusiasts will invent new nicknames for them even if they already have perfectly good official names.

HST, InterCity 125, and InterCity 225 caught on in the UK, and TGV and ICE caught on abroad.
 

irish_rail

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Nobody is ever going to say they’ve been on one of those new “IET” trains, but I imagine many have said they’ve been on an “Azuma”
Yes but my point is that "Azuma" has absolutely no integrity throughout the majority of the UK, as what has "east" got to do with Plymouth, Liverpool, Swansea or Glasgow? Just because it sounds good (although I would dispute that anyway), its no good unless the word has some kind of meaning. And east just doesn't work. If anything the UK is more west orientated, in that we sit in western Europe. East, smacks of Eastern Asia to me. Completely irrelevant.
 

ricj

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Yes but my point is that "Azuma" has absolutely no integrity throughout the majority of the UK, as what has "east" got to do with Plymouth, Liverpool, Swansea or Glasgow? Just because it sounds good (although I would dispute that anyway), its no good unless the word has some kind of meaning. And east just doesn't work. If anything the UK is more west orientated, in that we sit in western Europe. East, smacks of Eastern Asia to me. Completely irrelevant.
Exactly. Pretty sure people that travel daily to and from Paddington to the West don't say they've 'been on an Azuma'. And why, when we're (hopefully) going for a united identity for our 'Great British' railway, would we stick with a Japanese word? It's a stupid name for a stupid train and to me, has always stood for cheap and nasty, poorly made rubbish.
 

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